Global Warming could be worse than we thought-- paper from Science

[Boris]

I'm with you, philosophically. But we can live smarter, nonetheless. For example, I use LED lighting in my place, and I drive a gas efficient vehicle. I recycle my ****, and I try to reduce my footprint. I am sure there is much more that I can do. And none of this has decreased my quality of life.

[MENTION=40]Siro[/MENTION] You purchased a Lexus not a gas efficient vehicle. Please stop preaching innocence and virtue from your high horse.

What [MENTION=26]Gameface[/MENTION] said was true you prove it.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

It is a projection based on what it is happening and what has already happened. It is not an assumption. Look where China was 30 years ago, and where they are now. Look where the West was 100 years ago, and where we are now.

I personally love the human species, and I don't mind seeing 10 or 15 billion of us populating the Earth. It would give us more reason to expand into space.

Well, if there are too many humans on this planet maybe we should take the next evolutionary step and send some of them to other places?

And as far as global warming is concerned, I think we're past the point of no return. We're not going to solve it by going backwards, we're gonna have to deal with the fallout and figure out a proactive way to control it. Not by limiting our activity but by directly controlling the effect we have on the planet.

Anyone who thinks we're going to move around less, or produce less, or consume less can go pound sand because that's not how this works, that's not how any of this works.

^Two great posts right there. I'm for making the most of the reality that we have.

 

[Siro]

[MENTION=40]Siro[/MENTION] You purchased a Lexus not a gas efficient vehicle. Please stop preaching innocence and virtue from your high horse.

What does the brand matter? I purchased a hybrid vehicle that gives me over 40 mpg. How is that not efficient?

 

[b_line]

I drive a vw diesel that is poisoning all of us. I bought it because I was lied to and told it was meeting emission standards and I love the fuel efficiency. It is also a ton of fun to drive.

Screw volkswagen.

 

[Boris]

What does the brand matter? I purchased a hybrid vehicle that gives me over 40 mpg. How is that not efficient?

You are preaching your holiness but you did not buy the most efficient vehicle. You come off as Hollywood types. Tell everyone else who cannot afford a Lexus to be more efficient yet you can afford luxury without being forced to paying the higher price tag of a tesla and a solar farm to power it. Unless the poor can subsidize you and [MENTION=2036]b_line[/MENTION] charging stations that is.

The landed gentry always acts like this, oh gentleman Siro. You are so great for being energy efficient when it suits your needs but nothing more when it does not.

 

[Siro]

You are preaching your holiness but you did not buy the most efficient vehicle. You come off as Hollywood types. Tell everyone else who cannot afford a Lexus to be more efficient yet you can afford luxury without being forced to paying the higher price tag of a tesla and a solar farm to power it. Unless the poor can subsidize you and [MENTION=2036]b_line[/MENTION] charging stations that is.

The landed gentry always acts like this, oh gentleman Siro. You are so great for being energy efficient when it suits your needs but nothing more when it does not.

I've been skipping your posts for so long, I forgot you're just a silly troll. My bad.

 

[RandyForRubio]

So you're saying I shouldn't still be burning my garbage?

 

[RandyForRubio]

If we just got rid of cows we'd be fine.

 

[fishonjazz]

Those developing countries will develop.

Some of those pictures were from Hong Kong China.
Isn't Hong Kong already pretty developed?

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Some of those pictures were from Hong Kong China.
Isn't Hong Kong already pretty developed?

The first picture looks like Hong Kong to me. Big residential buildings are a result of lots of people choosing to live in a valuable area. There is a very good chance that those people have good jobs.

The third photo could be from Hong Kong as well. You get crowded beaches on sunny days in large metro areas. None of those people had to go to that beach on that day. They could go somewhere else. They probably chose to be there because of the many positives that those particular people associate with living in a major city.

The photos farther down on the page are probably from India or Pakistan. Overcrowding is a real problem there. The best available solution is education.

 

[Siro]

Some of those pictures were from Hong Kong China.
Isn't Hong Kong already pretty developed?

Yeah, but I don't see the issue with large crowds. If you don't like it, don't live in a huge dense city. The complaints about "overpopulation" and Earth's ability to support so many people have been around for hundreds of years. And yet, living situation continues to improve for more and more people.

What is the issue with having a lot of people? Objectively speaking? There is always more resources to be found. You dig deeper into the planet, and you start gathering space resources. Water, even on Earth, is practically infinite. Farms can be built vertically, multiplying the amount of food we produce. Hell, even farms can one day become obsolete, as we start manufacturing food with whatever properties we want with genetic engineering.

What do you want humanity to look like in a thousand years? A species that is beyond all material needs, or one barely surviving by adopting a conservative, and static, lifestyle? To me, it's a no-brainer.

 

[Boris]

I've been skipping your posts for so long, I forgot you're just a silly troll. My bad.

Conveniently burying your guilt by avoidance or truly narssistically unaware of what you are preaching? I cannot tell but it is definitely one or the other.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Conveniently burying your guilt by avoidance or truly narssistically unaware of what you are preaching? I cannot tell but it is definitely one or the other.

You've overlooked the obvious. It looks like he has no interest in dealing with your idiocy.

 

[fishonjazz]

What is the issue with having a lot of people?

Would you want to ride on one of those trains in the pictures I posted? I don't think anybody would. Including the people in those pictures.
I'm quite sure that they are not living that way by choice. They over populated their area and now they are paying the price and hating it I bet.

 

[fishonjazz]

Having a yard is good. Being able to travel 20 miles in less than an hour is good.

 

[Siro]

Would you want to ride on one of those trains in the pictures I posted? I don't think anybody would. Including the people in those pictures.
I'm quite sure that they are not living that way by choice. They over populated their area and now they are paying the price and hating it I bet.

CL said it was the most pressing issue of our time. I was responding to that. Having to deal with such crowds is an annoyance, but it is not an existential issue at all, let alone our most pressing one.

As for me, I love large cities, and I would love to live in one. Having to deal with that many people is a downside, but there are also so many upsides to living in a large city. You don't have to feel the same way. But this is a matter of preference. I would rather discuss the issue from a more objective angle.

 

[fishonjazz]

CL said it was the most pressing issue of our time. I was responding to that. Having to deal with such crowds is an annoyance, but it is not an existential issue at all, let alone our most pressing one.

As for me, I love large cities, and I would love to live in one. Having to deal with that many people is a downside, but there are also so many upsides to living in a large city. You don't have to feel the same way. But this is a matter of preference. I would rather discuss the issue from a more objective angle.

Good response

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Having a yard is good. Being able to travel 20 miles in less than an hour is good.

Some people are willing to give up a yard and the lack of traffic for other things. Also, I'm certain the train pictures you pointed out are not the normal commute. Something else is going on, probably a big celebration. Look at the people. They are not miserable like you are saying they are. They look very happy.

I haven't been to Pakistan but I have been in very impoverished neighborhoods in places like Mexico, Indonesia and Kenya. I think it would surprise you to discover that in general the resident's attitudes are much different than your impressions of what they would be.

I once met a guy who grew up in India in a cardboard box with a tin roof. He is now a multi-millionaire. He is proof to me that the unrealized potential in those environments is staggering. The only reasonable solution is education. It will bring the standard of living up and push the birth rate down.

 

[Deleted member 848]

very much a myth (both the populations contributing to GHGs, as well as overpopulation being the world's biggest issue-- at least IMO)

^ emissions of GHGs per capita

^ countries by population density

Emissions of CO2 total (not per capita)

Included a couple more for you Joe.

 

[Deleted member 848]

The political left is invested in the case that global warming is the largest problem humanity is facing, that it is caused almost entirely by first world countries, and that it can be solved by imposing huge taxes on polluters. I don't believe that any of those three statements are correct.

- it is the largest problem humanity is facing-- I'd love to hear of a bigger one.
- I don't think people argue that it is caused exclusively by first world countries-- however the problem is that those who feel the brunt of climate change the most are those that have produced some of the lowest GHG emissions. Also, if we are taking grand totals in terms of all-time production, then yes the developed world has produced the most.
- to pool together all of the proposed solutions in the fight against climate change as "taxes on polluters" is inaccurate and damaging.