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Grayson Allen

kabenac said:
Grayson's combine showed he has what it takes to be a contributor on both sides of the ball.

Although his numbers are bad (as others have mentioned), he's a hard-worker and from what I've seen (in college) he so hated losing he tended to overreact. This leads me to believe he'll continue to work hard to improve and not be a lazy POS like Trey Lyles.
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His combine showed? If we based two-way potential on combine numbers, well, a bunch of guys who suck and aren’t in the league any more would be.
 
The Thriller said:
What rookies under Sloan should’ve played more?

So you think Allen has potential but just needs more development? Wasn’t he an older player who spent more time developing in school? Or is he a good player already but cannot shine because he has better players in front of him?

What nba skills do you see him possessing?
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Shandon Anderson played on a team that went to the NBA finals and he was a 2nd round pick.
 
Grayson looks like he'll be a gritty back-up guard. He plays hard, has some IQ, tries to defend, can shoot off the catch and can get off a decent floater in the paint. My expectations aren't super high for him. I think of his role being something similar to Matthew Dellavadova, but teams need a guy like that.

I would have drafted Anfernee Simons, but getting a rotation player in the 20s of the draft is a win normally.
 
homeytennis said:
Shandon Anderson played on a team that went to the NBA finals and he was a 2nd round pick.
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Yep.

I seem to remember Greg ostertag, Bryan Russell, Andrei Kirilenko, and Paul Millsap all either starting or playing significant time during their rookie seasons too. Maybe the real issue is that Sloan didn’t give crappy rookies a lot of playing time? I know I know everyone on here wanted to give deshawn Stephenson and CJ Miles 82 games and 48 mins a game. But... neither exactly ended up being Michael Jordan or Ray Allen (as they were compared to in pre-draft scouting reports).
 
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Wes Mantooth said:
His combine showed? If we based two-way potential on combine numbers, well, a bunch of guys who suck and aren’t in the league any more would be.
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Combines and pre draft scouting reports are everything. That’s why deshawn Stephenson and Kirk Snyder ended up being HOFers.
 
The Thriller said:
Yep.

I seem to remember Greg ostertag, Bryan Russell, Andrei Kirilenko, and Paul Millsap all either starting or playing significant time during their rookie seasons too. Maybe the real issue is that Sloan didn’t give crappy rookies a lot of playing time? I know I know everyone on here wanted to give deshawn Stephenson and CJ Miles 82 games and 48 mins a game. But... neither exactly ended up being Michael Jordan or Ray Allen (as they were compared to in pre-draft scouting reports).
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Sloan played Rookies just fine. He just never handed them a starting spot based on draft position, mainly because we were never much in the lottery during his tenure. You left out Blue Edwards, Wesley Matthews, and Raul Lopez (played in all 82 games and started 11 of them.)
 
framer said:
Sloan played Rookies just fine. He just never handed them a starting spot based on draft position, mainly because we were never much in the lottery during his tenure. You left out Blue Edwards, Wesley Matthews, and Raul Lopez (played in all 82 games and started 11 of them.)
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I wasn’t trying to make a comprehensive list but appreciate your added names. I forgot Jarron Collins too. Started in 68 games and averaged 20 mins his rookie year. @JazzyFresh people might be too young to remember these names and how Sloan handled their playing time.
 
Catchall said:
Grayson looks like he'll be a gritty back-up guard. He plays hard, has some IQ, tries to defend, can shoot off the catch and can get off a decent floater in the paint. My expectations aren't super high for him. I think of his role being something similar to Matthew Dellavadova, but teams need a guy like that.

I would have drafted Anfernee Simons, but getting a rotation player in the 20s of the draft is a win normally.
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Teams “need” players who average 6 pts and 39 percent shooting?

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/dellama01.html

Just to compare, Raul Neto averages 5 pts and 45 percent shooting for his career and was drafted in the 2nd round. Delly was drafted in the second round. Allen was taken 21st overall in the first round and is averaging 4 pts and 31 percent shooting.

Seems to me like we spent a first round draft pick on production easily found in the second round or free agent market. If Delly is the role you see Allen aspiring to, then why did we draft Allen at 21?
 
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this is my problem with Allen right now. He was suppose to be a gym rat. That means some one that is always in the gym working (see mitchell) It is the all star weekend and the player have a week off. I can understand the players that have played a lot need some rest but Allen hasn't been playing he should be in the gym working on his game.

But where is he? https://thebiglead.com/2019/02/16/grayson-allen-girlfriend-morgan-reid/

He is in the Caribbean banging his girlfrield. I have seen her i would be banging her too but i am not a player in the midst of a crappy rookie season that needs time to get better. This tells me a couple of things

1st maybe he isnt the gym rat i thought he was. or
2nd after looking at the pics his girlfriend is posting they are alllllllll about her that might mean she controls their relationship. That she is the alpha in the relationship and that she doesnt seem to care about him and his basketball career as much as she cares about herself.
3rd he is still to young mentally to be the player we need.

I am concerned about Allen right now and we should be
 
The Thriller said:
Deron Williams started 47 games and averaged 29 mins per game his rookie year. Should Sloan have played him 39 mins per game? Just to compare, Chris Paul started 78 and averaged 36 mins per game. The jazz also won 3 more games that season than New Orleans and finished 41-41.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/willide01.html
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Sloan definitely should have played/started Deron a little more in his rookie year. I remember being frustrated that he consistently started Milt freaking Palacio over Deron for a large part of the season. I mean I would have understood a solid starting PG starting over Deron in his rookie year. But it was Milt freaking Palacio lol.

I may or may not be remembering correctly but didn't Sloan decide a little after the all star break to finally give Deron the starting job? And didn't he admit near the end of that season that he thought he waited too long to put him in that role? So, Jerry even admitted he was wrong if I'm remembering correctly.
 
The Thriller said:
Deron Williams started 47 games and averaged 29 mins per game his rookie year. Should Sloan have played him 39 mins per game? Just to compare, Chris Paul started 78 and averaged 36 mins per game. The jazz also won 3 more games that season than New Orleans and finished 41-41.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/w/willide01.html
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Deron would have dropped dead if he played 39mpg his rookie year. He was woefully out of shape.

That was Sloan's main problem with him.
 
Xthren said:
He is in the Caribbean banging his girlfrield. I have seen her i would be banging her too but i am not a player in the midst of a crappy rookie season that needs time to get better. This tells me a couple of things

1st maybe he isnt the gym rat i thought he was. or
2nd after looking at the pics his girlfriend is posting they are alllllllll about her that might mean she controls their relationship. That she is the alpha in the relationship and that she doesnt seem to care about him and his basketball career as much as she cares about herself.
3rd he is still to young mentally to be the player we need.

I am concerned about Allen right now and we should be
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Definitely looks like a couple that's into pegging.

Those abs don't belong on a woman.
 
Deciding a rookie’s potential early gives me the same feeling that job ads which sound like “at least ten years of experience - age maximum twenty years old” give. You can’t know how far a young person can go in his career w/o giving him the necessary experience.
 
The Thriller said:
I wasn’t trying to make a comprehensive list but appreciate your added names. I forgot Jarron Collins too. Started in 68 games and averaged 20 mins his rookie year. @JazzyFresh people might be too young to remember these names and how Sloan handled their playing time.
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I could go on and explain how I feel these guys weren't utilized enough their rookie years(Deron, Hayward(5 ppg), Milsap) and how many of the other guys brought fourth were very Allen like as far as stats(Stockton(5ppg) turned out fine) but this is an absolute terrible discussion. Judging a rookie is honestly one of the worst sports conversations I can think of. Calling a player a bust or saying "we could done this in the second round" is completely unfair and has been proven wrong time and time again. Hell I remember Jerry Rice being labeled a bust. LOL I remember that dude calling Donovan a bust after 5 games. It's so incredibly stupid to me.

Is Grayson going to be a good player? I don't know. But to harp on a guy, especially a 21st pick, for not producing his rookie year is just dumb.
 
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