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Jazz and Knicks discussing Donovan Mitchell trade per Shams Charania and Tony Jones

LoPo said:
System

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Cannot disregard individual effort. No way the "system" required anyone to stand still and just let guy run around them causing haphazard rotations. Get your blinders off man. Mitchell straight sucked on D, made no effort. It is undeniable. And the "system" is not a valid excuse.
 
LogGrad98 said:
Cannot disregard individual effort. No way the "system" required anyone to stand still and just let guy run around them causing haphazard rotations. Get your blinders off man. Mitchell straight sucked on D, made no effort. It is undeniable. And the "system" is not a valid excuse.
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This. While some may not agree with the system and yes the system design is to funnel players into Gobert, that doesn’t mean you let someone just go by you as long as they are going where you want them, hell, you’re not even supposed to let them by you let alone unabated and free. The defense is design is to force a player into specific area, but you still don’t let them past you like shown on the video. And isn’t it reasonable to say the system was flawed because the players didn’t execute the system properly? I think so.
 
www.theringer.com

Is Donovan Mitchell Really the Right Star for the Knicks?

New York has the pieces to bring Utah’s All-Star guard to Broadway, but it should be hesitant to go all in. As good as Mitchell is, questions remain about his ability to carry a team.
www.theringer.com www.theringer.com

There is two minutes and 40 seconds of Donovan getting destroyed on D from the Dallas series in this Ringer article

One of my faves was at 2:20 when Dinwiddie does a straight line drive and all Donovan does is a weak *** flop.

105-102 with 6 minutes left in the game and Mitchell was playing pre-season defense.

That's why we lost close games and why we lost the series.
 
LoPo said:
System

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Sorry Lopo, I haven't posted in 3 months but I just can resist replying to this. You can't just ignore how awful Donovan has been on D. Can't blame the system. Perhaps @LogGrad98 can create a new thread about the worst Jazz Defenders of all Time. Log, just give me credit :D

Also, I see you are bringing up Rudy when you were the first to complain about discussing players on other teams. Please keep this in mind when we trade Donovan, as you should never talk about him again, unless you join the Knicks RealGM message board of course.
 
LogGrad98 said:
Cannot disregard individual effort. No way the "system" required anyone to stand still and just let guy run around them causing haphazard rotations. Get your blinders off man. Mitchell straight sucked on D, made no effort. It is undeniable. And the "system" is not a valid excuse.
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I have already addressed Mitchell's piss poor effort.

Our system and coaching were still our biggest issues despite how much yall want to blame one player.

I hope he gets traded to NY. Most of yall don't deserve great players. Bunch of negative whiners.

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yamers said:
are draft picks really that important if they aren't lottery?
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alperen sengun, quentin grimes, bones hyland, herb jones, saddiq bey, tyrese maxey, immanuel quickley, jaden mcdaniels, desmond bane, jordan poole, keldon johnson, brandon clarke, grant williams, anfernee simons, robert williams, jalen brunson, gary trent jr, mitchell robinson, jarred vanderbilt, john collins, jarrett allen, og anunoby, derek white, josh hart, dillon brooks, monte morris.

these are all guys who were drafted outside the lottery and into the early second round in just the last four years (not including the 2022 draft as we don't know on those guys yet).

you decide if picks outside the lottery are that important. i guess it depends on one's definition of "that", but all those guys are key rotation pieces in the league, most for playoff teams and contenders.
 
latin jazz said:
Sorry Lopo, I haven't posted in 3 months but I just can resist replying to this. You can't just ignore how awful Donovan has been on D. Can't blame the system. Perhaps @LogGrad98 can create a new thread about the worst Jazz Defenders of all Time. Log, just give me credit :D

Also, I see you are bringing up Rudy when you were the first to complain about discussing players on other teams. Please keep this in mind when we trade Donovan, as you should never talk about him again, unless you join the Knicks RealGM message board of course.
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I have already addressed Mitchell's piss poor effort.

Our system and coaching were still our biggest issues despite how much yall want to blame one player.

I hope he gets traded to NY.

I wonder who everybody scapegoats when we actually try to start winning again.

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LoPo said:
I have already addressed Mitchell's piss poor effort.

Our system and coaching were still our biggest issues despite how much yall want to blame one player.

I hope he gets traded to NY.

I wonder who everybody scapegoats when we actually try to start winning again.

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What kind of mental gymnastics does it take to admit our star player is giving terrible effort in a playoff series, but still blame a gameplan and the dudes coaching on the bench?

Please tell me what system, or coaching adjustment would have made Mitchell care more. And then ask yourself why he didn't care already.
 
LoPo said:
I have already addressed Mitchell's piss poor effort.

Our system and coaching were still our biggest issues despite how much yall want to blame one player.

I hope he gets traded to NY.

I wonder who everybody scapegoats when we actually try to start winning again.

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Somebody obviously giving piss poor or minimal effort is not a ****ing scapegoat dude... Mitchell will be learning that in NY. You want to call him a ****ing star franchise player and in the same breadth call him a scapegoat? Guess what dude, he either carries that responsibility or he doesn't, and all indications are that he doesn't- he ****ing checked out and now he's getting traded.
 
SoberasHotRod said:
Regarding the PK rumor. Since I don't live in Utah, I really don't know who that is and couldn't vouch for him. The other Utah media guys seem to think he wouldn't just make that up, so I'll assume he really did hear something. My guess is his source is a lower level guy since none of the national guys / more connected guys ran with the story. So assuming those two things either,

A) the lower level guy misunderstood what was going on and a deal is not close
B) the lower level guy jumped the gun and the higher level guys aren't ready to leak the information yet.

I have a friend who used to be a statistician for an NBA team. He said that he would be super busy around the trade deadline running analysis for a bazillion situations. I assume there are a bunch of lawyers and accountants involved in the process as well. It seems likely that there are plenty of lower level guys with a peripheral view of what's going on in an NBA front office. They all have friends. Thus the crazy amount of rumors we hear about.
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PK sucks. His shtick is too rile people up by saying outlandish things. He also thinks he is hilarious. His morning show partner, DJ, is much better and more level headed and serious. I much prefer DJ to PK.


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Bawse Dawg said:
What kind of mental gymnastics does it take to admit our star player is giving terrible effort in a playoff series, but still blame a gameplan and the dudes coaching on the bench?

Please tell me what system, or coaching adjustment would have made Mitchell care more. And then ask yourself why he didn't care already.
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You think we lost a playoff series because one of our players sometimes didn't try as hard as possible? That's pretty stupid.

Our roster construction and system have been the main issues for a while now. Don has to try more, but the lack of perimeter defenders period is more important. Conley's performance was more damning.

Our whole team tried damn hard against the Clippers, and we still fell apart.


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Mongoose said:
Somebody obviously giving piss poor or minimal effort is not a ****ing scapegoat dude... Mitchell will be learning that in NY. You want to call him a ****ing star franchise player and in the same breadth call him a scapegoat? Guess what dude, he either carries that responsibility or he doesn't, and all indications are that he doesn't- he ****ing checked out and now he's getting traded.
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He carries blame as he should. Carrying all the blame is stupid.

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fishonjazz said:
PK sucks. His shtick is too rile people up by saying outlandish things. He also thinks he is hilarious. His morning show partner, DJ, is much better and more level headed and serious. I much prefer DJ to PK.


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Good context. Like I said I don't really know who he is, I was going off other media guys like Andy Larsen saying they don't think he would make it up.

Definitely sounds like he could be saying stuff based off the sketchiest of leads.
 
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