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The Bell Effect

LogGrad98 said:
Tell that to Bruce Bowen. He was nowhere near the fastest guy on the court, but he was a serious lock-down defender.
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...the last two years of Bowens career he was ANYTHING but lock-down defender! He was getting beat like a drum on defense....and couldn't hit an open shot to save his neck! And why does he wear that silly bow-tie now, anyway? Is he emulating Louis Farrakhan?
 
gomretat said:
As long as Raja stays the best defensive wing we have .
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This is as far as you need to read. Howard is far and away our best defensive wing. Burks, CJ and Hayward are also better defensively than Bell. Hell play Watson or Harris at 2 guard and they would be better at defending SG's than Bell.
 
billyshelby said:
At first I couldn't understand why Hollins didn't shift Allen to Hayward so Gay could have the night off on defense. Then I saw his genius. Allen literally didn't guard Bell. He'd make a token effort to run at Bell and make a loud sound if he was going to shoot, but he mostly played the paint. He even got tagged with a defensive 3 seconds! This had 2 very noticeable effects:

1. On defense, his presence down low was able to deter entry passes. He also stuffed a Harris drive and picked up several rebounds.
2. On offense, he was murder in transition. He abused Bell on the perimeter a few times, but because he was not actually defending Bell, he was able to get out on the break without anybody to slow him down.

Also very interesting: Hollins subbed out Allen in the 1st and 3rd EXACTLY when Ty replaced Bell. In other words, this was all a very designed strategy. And it worked beautifully. When Bell was taken out in the first, we were down 6. In the 3rd, we went down a net of 6. In BOTH cases, after Bell was taken out, we went on runs.
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Lol this is the funniest "Raja is the worst player in the NBA" joke I've ever heard.
 
carolinajazz said:
...the last two years of Bowens career he was ANYTHING but lock-down defender! He was getting beat like a drum on defense....and couldn't hit an open shot to save his neck! And why does he wear that silly bow-tie now, anyway? Is he emulating Louis Farrakhan?
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So everyone will be judged only on the last 2 years of their career? Interesting.
 
LogGrad98 said:
So everyone will be judged only on the last 2 years of their career? Interesting.
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...not the point at all! The poster made the comment that Bowen was a lock down defensive player up until the day he retired. He was very good when he was younger. However, his last couple of years he was average defensively at best.
 
gomretat said:
He helps set a tone to start the game from a defensive standpoint.
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This is one of my favorite cliches. What do you suspect the tone is for every other starting 2 in the league when the Jazz come to town? I'll give you a hint. They have that game circled on their calendar. Being guarded by Bell, and especially having to guard Bell, is the most stress free night any player can possibly dream of.
 
gomretat said:
As long as Raja stays the best defensive wing we have - which he has been so far - he will continue to start against the other teams best 2 guard. It is that simple. I am not a Raja lover. I openly disagreed with bringing him back to Utah when we signed him last year. But he is our best wing defender, he runs the sets on D the way Ty wants them run, and he doesn't make rookie mistakes on defense. He helps set a tone to start the game from a defensive standpoint. Fairly obvious why Ty is using him the way he is.
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Bell allows 55% shooting, and a 19 PER from his opponent. The jazz out score opponents by 11 points per 100 possessions when he is off the court. When he is on the floor, the jazz are outscoredby 32 per 100.

Howard at 2 guard allows 40% shooting, and a PER of 2.2 from opposing 2 guards. the jazz out score opponents by 13.5 per 100 possessions when howard is on the floor.

raja is far from the best defender
 
Bell played greta tonight.

but just wnated to point something out.

it was mentioned early that bell does not make rookie mistakes.
well he made rookie mistakes. he missed a jumper then on the rebound he fouled the guy with no fouls to give.

but i gotta give credit where its due tonight bell traveled back in time maybe to the year he clotheslined kobay
 
Bell may be replaced as the best wing defender we have but he so far he is by measurably the best we have. Proved it once again tonight.
 
Bell is still a fast break killer, pretty ineffective on offense and overall just old. He has his moments though and I think his shot will eventually come back to him. I still like what he brings to the team defensively. I think he has a lot of respect from the team and is a good guy to teach Burks and Hayward to defend.
 
Agreed here.
He is definitely a defensive hound, and he obviously has more left in his defensive tank than a lot of us were giving him credit for.
 
So, Raja beat out CJ for minutes tonight in a big way.

CJ is up at the end of this year, Raja has 2 left, and he's starting. Will Raja outlast CJ? Wow, wouldn't have called that one.
 
billyshelby said:
At first I couldn't understand why Hollins didn't shift Allen to Hayward so Gay could have the night off on defense. Then I saw his genius. Allen literally didn't guard Bell. He'd make a token effort to run at Bell and make a loud sound if he was going to shoot, but he mostly played the paint. He even got tagged with a defensive 3 seconds! This had 2 very noticeable effects:

1. On defense, his presence down low was able to deter entry passes. He also stuffed a Harris drive and picked up several rebounds.
2. On offense, he was murder in transition. He abused Bell on the perimeter a few times, but because he was not actually defending Bell, he was able to get out on the break without anybody to slow him down.

Also very interesting: Hollins subbed out Allen in the 1st and 3rd EXACTLY when Ty replaced Bell. In other words, this was all a very designed strategy. And it worked beautifully. When Bell was taken out in the first, we were down 6. In the 3rd, we went down a net of 6. In BOTH cases, after Bell was taken out, we went on runs.
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Just reading this thread for the 1st time. Great observation!
 
cctrackstar said:
So, Raja beat out CJ for minutes tonight in a big way.

CJ is up at the end of this year, Raja has 2 left, and he's starting. Will Raja outlast CJ? Wow, wouldn't have called that one.
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It seems like just yesterday, everybody thought Raja would be removed as a starter, if not from the rotation completely. This is just one game. The important part is that it looks as though Ty is committed to giving Burks minutes, regardless of where they come from.

As far as CJ and Raja go, I wouldn't be surprised to see both of them gone by next year, if Utah has a losing season. If Utah can find their way into the playoffs this year, then you never know what might happen.
 
First of all, kudos to Raja Bell. He had his best game of the year. Now I want to see him play with the same effort and make some jump shots. The biggest thing I notice is that when the team plays on the road the rookies still seem like deers caught in headlines so it is nice that the veterans stepped up last night.

It was nice to see Hayward play with more aggression, when the kid doesn't think and just plays he can be the player I think he is. Again nice road win for the team.

As far as CJ goes, (I only saw the first half), his body language is just bad. You it seemed as though he was pouting when he finally got in the game. Personally, I would trade CJ simply because the team doesn't really need him anymore. Try to get at least a second round pick for him.
 
Wow, monster game from R. Bell: he made 3 shots! The fact that he is being praised for such a good game shows just how bad he has been. 9 points from your starting SG is very weak and that is by far his best output of the season. Yes, he played good D but overall his D does NOT make up for a non-existent O.

It was very interesting to see how the Jazz were able to jump out to an early lead with their wings hitting a few shots. I have tended to correlate the slow starts with Big Slow but now I see it is more likely R. Bell and 4 on 5 offense.

Looks like we are stuck with Bell as a starter for quite awhile now. Lets hope he keeps it up.
 
downside to his "great" game is that is deserved spot on the bench will stay empty for the moment. and he will continue to start
 
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