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Welcome back to Salt Lake - Mo Williams

billyshelby said:
So to get Mo for one year is FAR less valuable than being patient and playing for a pick.
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Mo can still be flipped for players with longer contracts and picks. KOC figured Mo might be worth more to teams up to the deadline than the TPE until it expired. The Jazz keep their flexibility AND add a player.
 
There is a silver lining to this. If KOC is ruthlessly pragmatic, he can still parlay Mo into a pick/asset down the road. But it would require willingness to handcuff us if we're in the playoff hunt. And if he keeps Mo/Harris, he'd have leverage to do that.

But it still doesn't change the fact that he should have gotten something more for Mo out of this deal -- a mistake he doesn't usually make. If all Mo does is drop off the cap, the mistake will be magnified.
 
billyshelby said:
Yes, it did save Detroit big money. But they paid for that by giving Charlotte a 1st. Whether Mo is overpaid is irrelevant to that, but just to play along, Mo is an MLE player at BEST. And at his age, he would get a 3 year deal MAX. That means he's solidly 3 million overpaid which is nearly 40%. In the new CBA, a backup point making 8.5 million is not a desirable commodity at all.
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I guess it comes down to what happens with Harris. I believe Mo would be an upgrade, and if KOC can then flip Harris for a late 1st rounder, early second rounder, or even another TPE, it would be a successful turn of events.
 
GVC said:
Mo can still be flipped for players with longer contracts and picks. KOC figured Mo might be worth more to teams up to the deadline than the TPE until it expired. The Jazz keep their flexibility AND add a player.
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Addressed this before I saw your post. I don't think you're wrong, I just don't think this was handled at the level of Presti/Buford excellence.
 
Broncster said:
Fair points I would disagree with the strength of our position though. They could have found another team willing to take Mo since he has value and theoretically teams have cap space to absorb him. Secondly Dallas had a deal arranged to buy Odom out and money is not an issue to Dallas cap space is.
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Missing a huge variable. Yeah, I think LA could have found a swap for Mo. But only by taking back contracts. Even if they got only expirings back, they would have then had to lure Odom in FA. Net: they're still paying for Mo's salary (in other players) + Odom's deal (say 5) for a rough total of 13 million. In THIS deal, they pay Odom's 9ish saving 4 million without the hassle of dead weight players/contracts.
 
Why does it matter if we get a second round pick or 1 million dollars? We added a shooter who is better than Harris. We solved two issues. I don't care that Kevin could have squeezed a crappy second round pick out of some one. We filled a need, we should be happy.
 
So if we flip Tinsley or Watson + Al Jeff for Iguodala can we laugh at anyone hating on KOC for actually getting something with a TPE for once?
 
Jazz4ever said:
I guess it comes down to what happens with Harris. I believe Mo would be an upgrade, and if KOC can then flip Harris for a late 1st rounder, early second rounder, or even another TPE, it would be a successful turn of events.
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This is probably my last attempt at fighting this battle. Whatever happens with Harris is totally irrelevant. That's a separate deal. The only thing that ever matters is getting the most out of every individual deal. We did not do that.
 
Verlin said:
Why does it matter if we get a second round pick or 1 million dollars? We added a shooter who is better than Harris. We solved two issues. I don't care that Kevin could have squeezed a crappy second round pick out of some one. We filled a need, we should be happy.
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Well, he did squeeze a 2nd-round pick. Shan Foster has been playing in Europe since being selected in 2008 and will compete for a backup SG role. Can't say the same about Dragicevic
 
Im a huge fan of this move. I have thought for awhile Mo would be a really good fit with this team. Gives a good outside threat, and he his a fierce competitor. Even if it's just for this year, I find it hard to believe we would get a better player for the TPE (who didn't have an awful contract). Mo and Devin could be fun if they decide to go that way.
 
Verlin said:
Why does it matter if we get a second round pick or 1 million dollars? We added a shooter who is better than Harris. We solved two issues. I don't care that Kevin could have squeezed a crappy second round pick out of some one. We filled a need, we should be happy.
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I'll just use the money example since it's more easily quantifiable. If you're paying 8.5 million for your new summer home, and the seller agrees to knock off 1 million, do you say, "Nah, what's the difference between 7.5 and 8.5?"
 
billyshelby said:
Missing a huge variable. Yeah, I think LA could have found a swap for Mo. But only by taking back contracts. Even if they got only expirings back, they would have then had to lure Odom in FA. Net: they're still paying for Mo's salary (in other players) + Odom's deal (say 5) for a rough total of 13 million. In THIS deal, they pay Odom's 9ish saving 4 million without the hassle of dead weight players/contracts.
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That is assuming they could not find a team under the soft cap who wanted him or another team (which may or may not exist for both, I dont know) that has a trade exception that large enough to absorb him. I think off the top of my head Raptors might be the only other team under the cap but they are saving their money for Nash is FA. If there was no other team in a position to absorb Mo and they did not want to amnesty him then you are correct we should have gotten a solid 1st round pick for next year or future.
 
billyshelby said:
I'll just use the money example since it's more easily quantifiable. If you're paying 8.5 million for your new summer home, and the seller agrees to knock off 1 million, do you say, "Nah, what's the difference between 7.5 and 8.5?"
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Perhaps it's not your summer home. Maybe you have a primary residence you really want to sell. For various reasons, you just don't want to live there any longer. You have some decent offers, but you can't sell until you have a new residence. Otherwise you may be stuck in a crappy apartment in the 'hood waiting for next year's crop of homes to become available (in this scenario, there are a limited number of truly desirable homes on the market).

So the value of getting a deal done is worth overpaying on the new home because you can now get rid of the other one.
 
Barring any Future trades, this Mo Williams trade feels more like its about getting to the playoffs rather than something greater...I feel like Burks' and Murphy's development is going to go slower as well.
 
billyshelby said:
This is probably my last attempt at fighting this battle. Whatever happens with Harris is totally irrelevant. That's a separate deal. The only thing that ever matters is getting the most out of every individual deal. We did not do that.
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Maybe KOC is playing this like chess where you are always thinking couple of moves ahead.

If getting Mo helps move other peices around then yes this is a great move!

If not we see how he plays and then determine.
 
Cyrone Torbin said:
What? How does picking up Harris change any leverage?
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You mean Mo I assume and it changes because any attempt to trade Harris will scream to teams that we're simply trying to unload an expiring who doesn't really have a strong place on our team any more. Especially with four points now on the roster.
 
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