Will there be American invasion in Syria?

[♪alt13]

Again, bro, you did not lay down a clear path on what you want to do. If you can't figure out what a simple lay out is, how can anyone take your accusations of backdoor deals seriously? "Look at how the US dealt with a problem". You didn't say lets do that, you didn't outline how we'd do that. You just threw some words together and were glad it made a sentence the might reflect your opinion.

Yes I did. You're just dodging my accusation that you don't know the historical context that I am speaking to. I can't fit 40 years of the history of Egyptian/Israeli/US relations here, but I can tell you this(again)the US brought a carrot not a stick. If the US wants a stable, peaceful, syria without WMDs we will get it by working with Assad. There is a lot we could offer him and the people of Syria(lifting of sanctions to start) but we don't even have an embassy there and we refuse to sit down with them. We have been encouraging the destabilization of syria for 2 years now.

If you think Assad is a bad guy I want you to try and imagine a syria with these guys in charge.
[removed by moderator]...and a piece of how you have chosen to tie this all in with your league of masterminds. [/QUOTE]
Putting words in my mouth again. U.S. officials have a bias for or against intervention depending on whether or not there is a "national interest".(financial) I do not see them as "masterminds". I disagree with them because I think what they are doing is fool hardy that doesn't make me a nut case.

I do not desire a conflict.

In the event Syria falls short by even one minute, we should make sure they regret it.

They will fall short by at least 2 minutes and you know it. So don't hedge your position this way.

 

[♪alt13]

Amazing moments happen when US presidents choose to play peace broker instead of policeman.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPtMafxVKeA

 

[Stoked]

I believe i very clearly stated we shouldn't do that before finishing that thought to its own end.

Sent from your moms room.... While she was sleeping.

and that's fine. I'm just saying no thanks.

 

[One Brow]

So does MSNBC. In my opinion they are far worse than Fox in the racism dept. Anytime anyone disagrees with the President on any issue for any reason MSNBC hosts and guests will drop charges of racism.

In principle hate and disdain based on party affiliation is no better than hate based on race. I am not claiming they have the same history so relax One Brow.

I would agree with you on the Huffington Post. I haven't seen enough MS-NBC to judge.

 

[One Brow]

Yes racism is the bigger problem, history alone tells you that.

Edit: I can tell you that people are getting pretty damn sick of being labeled racist if they disagree with anything the President says or does.

At the same time, conservatives have been opposing this President with a ferocity that even exceeds the opposition to Clinton, despite Obama being more conservative than Clinton. It's naive to say that every one exhibiting such dislike is an open, conscious racist, but it's equally naive think that racial judgements play no part in that.

However, that's a discussion we've had before. If we want to discuss that further, let's do it in another thread, and save this one for Syria.

 

[One Brow]

Obviously racism can be worse. But you are seeing a horrendous trend of attacking the moral character of of a person just because they disagree. Where do you think that road leads?

Being ignorant of your racial privilege is not an issue of morals.

 

[Harambe]

You're just dodging my accusation that you don't know the historical context that I am speaking to.

Lets be frank here... I'm not dodging anything. I'm blatantly ignoring it in an effort to keep this thread on track. Your accusation is both unfounded and unwarranted, and trying to fight about it is a moot point.

But then again, you have a hard time with reading comprehension, so in an effort for peace, I'll give you this: Although I'm relatively well read, I'm no middle east expert. Nor do I need to be to understand what's fair and not.

Do not be under the impression that I think, or have ever really thought that "he will just do the right thing". My opinion has not changed or faltered since I started posting in this thread: if we do not give him the chance, we are the dictators. How can we preach freedom from that position?

We, being the UN and not just the US, have now given him that chance. My need to allow that, no matter how low and despicable the person is/was/can be has been satisfied.

 

[♪alt13]

Lets be frank here... I'm not dodging anything. I'm blatantly ignoring it in an effort to keep this thread on track. Your accusation is both unfounded and unwarranted, and trying to fight about it is a moot point.

But then again, you have a hard time with reading comprehension, so in an effort for peace, I'll give you this: Although I'm relatively well read, I'm no middle east expert. Nor do I need to be to understand what's fair and not.

Do not be under the impression that I think, or have ever really thought that "he will just do the right thing". My opinion has not changed or faltered since I started posting in this thread: if we do not give him the chance, we are the dictators. How can we preach freedom from that position?

We, being the UN and not just the US, have now given him that chance. My need to allow that, no matter how low and despicable the person is/was/can be has been satisfied.

What is fair does not matter when weighed against what will create peace and stability. I doubt that an American/NATO military strike will further either. What is the end game if we follow this course?

 

[Stoked]

Being ignorant of your racial privilege is not an issue of morals.

Being a race baiter is not integrity.

 

[Stoked]

https://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/15/world/middleeast/syria-talks.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

America and Russia have reached a deal on the destruction of Syria's chemical weapons. I am thrilled with this as it lessens the possibility of them falling into terrorist hands.

Now if Syria would agree to it...

 

[Harambe]

What is fair does not matter when weighed against what will create peace and stability. I doubt that an American/NATO military strike will further either. What is the end game if we follow this course?

Do not mutate this into your own ambitions with the "Bring peace, freedom, prosperity and stability to these people" attitude. That's not what this is about.

It's about use of Chemical Weapons. Once we get those out of use, they can hurt each other all they want.

Again, please stay on target.

 

[Harambe]

https://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/15/world/middleeast/syria-talks.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

America and Russia have reached a deal on the destruction of Syria's chemical weapons. I am thrilled with this as it lessens the possibility of them falling into terrorist hands.

Now if Syria would agree to it...

This is great and all.. as I really don't want to go into another war. But it's still buying them time, and it's brought up after some very childish behavior from Assad. A part of me feels like we're now rewarding this type of behavior.

But I guess I should really shut up a little in this aspect:

“This situation has no precedent,” said Amy E. Smithson, an expert on chemical weapons at the James Martin Center for Nonproliferation Studies. “They are cramming what would probably be five or six years’ worth of work into a period of several months, and they are undertaking this in an extremely difficult security environment due to the ongoing civil war.”

I had no idea the normal time line was that long. But if Syria signs on with this by Monday/Tuesday, and gets the groundwork set up in earnest, I'm for it.

All in all, I'm glad to see the US and Russia get on the same page(or at least in the same chapter) on this issue.

 

[Gameface]

Being ignorant of your racial privilege is not an issue of morals.

Having racial privilege and being a racist are two very different things. Accusations of racism can be devastating. Levying such accusations should be done with a degree of caution consistent with the destruction they can cause.

 

[♪alt13]

Do not mutate this into your own ambitions with the "Bring peace, freedom, prosperity and stability to these people" attitude. That's not what this is about.

It's about use of Chemical Weapons. Once we get those out of use, they can hurt each other all they want.

Again, please stay on target.

Again, putting words in my mouth I never said anything about bold.

It is very much on target to talk about the stability of a country with large stockpiles of chemical weapons especially when we have a hand in its destabilization. If you're worried about Syrias chemical weapons shouldn't you be worried about them falling into the wrong hands? Tow the line all you want but(and I hate to say this) Putin is the hero of the day.

 

[Harambe]

Again, putting words in my mouth I never said anything about bold.

It is very much on target to talk about the stability of a country with large stockpiles of chemical weapons especially when we have a hand in its destabilization. If you're worried about Syrias chemical weapons shouldn't you be worried about them falling into the wrong hands? Tow the line all you want but(and I hate to say this) Putin is the hero of the day.

You are correct, you didn't put the words in bold out there. You were merely going down that road, which I should have allowed you to go down before jumping you for it. See how someone else assuming you're going to do something or not is absolutely infuriating?

Am I worried about those weapons being in the wrong hands? Yes. But that's why we've said turn them over. As far as I'm concerned, they shouldn't even be allowed to destroy them. But so long as it's a UN approved and/or managed disposal facility, I won't be unreasonable.

Is Russia a savior? No. A huge, likely non-replaceable part in this? Yeah. Am I very thankful? Yes. But that was all outlined yesterday, so don't act like this is coming out of left field when I say Putin was very much not the villain he's portrayed in this day and age, and acted quite reasonable.

 

[♪alt13]

You are correct, you didn't put the words in bold out there. You were merely going down that road, which I should have allowed you to go down before jumping you for it. See how someone else assuming you're going to do something or not is absolutely infuriating?

Am I worried about those weapons being in the wrong hands? Yes. But that's why we've said turn them over. As far as I'm concerned, they shouldn't even be allowed to destroy them. But so long as it's a UN approved and/or managed disposal facility, I won't be unreasonable.

Is Russia a savior? No. A huge, likely non-replaceable part in this? Yeah. Am I very thankful? Yes. But that was all outlined yesterday, so don't act like this is coming out of left field when I say Putin was very much not the villain he's portrayed in this day and age, and acted quite reasonable.

No, we didn't. Obama looked for approval to strike Syria and Russia proposed the compromise. If it wasn't for opposition at the UN in Congress and from the American people we would have bombed Syria earlier this week. Why don't you and the rest of the trigger happy camp go ahead and take credit for a diplomatic solution that was forced on y'all.

 

[Harambe]

No, we didn't. Obama looked for approval to strike Syria and Russia proposed the compromise. If it wasn't for opposition at the UN in Congress and from the American people we would have bombed Syria earlier this week. Why don't you and the rest of the trigger happy camp go ahead and take credit for a diplomatic solution that was forced on y'all.

Correct. As in, after a YEAR of warnings on the subject, we went with force. See "red line" speech in August 2012.

The end goal of this has always been getting rid of these, whether that's destruction or handing them over.

 

[addictionary]

It's official. The Turkish government is aiding the Syrian rebels with weaponary. A truck that was carrying the so told package was stopped by the police and was reported to be driven by the Turkish Intelligence personell who are directly connected to the prime ministry.

The police that stopped the truck is working for the Gülen cult. The int. personell are for the PM. The government and the cult are at cold war. Enes is from the Cult. So colton might wanna move this thread to the Jazz forum. Hehe.

 

[Stoked]

It's official. The Turkish government is aiding the Syrian rebels with weaponary. A truck that was carrying the so told package was stopped by the police and was reported to be driven by the Turkish Intelligence personell who are directly connected to the prime ministry.

The police that stopped the truck is working for the Gülen cult. The int. personell are for the PM. The government and the cult are at cold war. Enes is from the Cult. So colton might wanna move this thread to the Jazz forum. Hehe.

Also the Syrian war has officially spilled into Iraq. Fallujah and another Iraqi city (not town or village) are under Al Qeada control. Then the maneuvering between Iran and Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan v. Taliban, Pakistan v. Taliban and Pakistan v. India, Israel and Palestine, Yemen and Al Qaeda, Egypt protests, Hezbollah v. Hamas...

The middle east is clearly at war. It has spread beyond containment. It's region wide and has been for some time. Now it's finally known world wide (dumb masses).

Will it spread further? Every month it seems it escalates a little further. Look at all the foreign countries/entities involved. US, Russia, NATO...

 

[Scat]

Also the Syrian war has officially spilled into Iraq. Fallujah and another Iraqi city (not town or village) are under Al Qeada control. Then the maneuvering between Iran and Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan v. Taliban, Pakistan v. Taliban and Pakistan v. India, Israel and Palestine, Yemen and Al Qaeda, Egypt protests, Hezbollah v. Hamas...

The middle east is clearly at war. It has spread beyond containment. It's region wide and has been for some time. Now it's finally known world wide (dumb masses).

Will it spread further? Every month it seems it escalates a little further. Look at all the foreign countries/entities involved. US, Russia, NATO...

After all is said and done, whatever the new borders become, they will all have a ruling party that is no better than what they currently have. Look at Egypt. They had a revolution and then overwhelmingly vote into a power a group that is arguably worse than that which they ousted. They at least got to vote I guess. I suspect that many will just have their new ruler forced upon them.