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Congresswoman shot.

Duck Rodgers said:
The problem with your ridiculous assumption and categorizing is that huge swaths of people believe them to be truth. Look at any polls on 9/11 or the Kennedy assassination. You're better off assuming the people are more like you, rather than smoking pot aboard the Death Star.

And lets be real here, there aren't that many conspiracy theories out there, so I really don't think it's a slippery slope. It really doesn't take a Jedi Mind trick to differentiate between conspiracy theories. They all have their different qualifications. It's intellectually lazy to just write them off.
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You don't have to answer if you don't want to, but what conspiracy theories do you believe and why?
 
Duck Rodgers said:
Trout, how the hell did you ever find Mormonism? You seem to be more the L. Ron Hubbard Scientology type.

BTW, you're only allowed to believe in Orson Scott Card. I hear he has a direct conduit to God. Plus, he is extremely good looking.
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It found me, dog.

L. Ron's stuff is highly entertaining -- if you've never given it a go, I would suggest you read some of it.
 
TroutBum said:
It found me, dog.

L. Ron's stuff is highly entertaining -- if you've never given it a go, I would suggest you read some of it.
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His science fiction or his non-fiction religious work?...
 
Duck Rodgers said:
The problem with your ridiculous assumption and categorizing is that huge swaths of people believe them to be truth. Look at any polls on 9/11 or the Kennedy assassination. You're better off assuming the people are more like you, rather than smoking pot aboard the Death Star.

And lets be real here, there aren't that many conspiracy theories out there, so I really don't think it's a slippery slope. It really doesn't take a Jedi Mind trick to differentiate between conspiracy theories. They all have their different qualifications. It's intellectually lazy to just write them off.
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I'll admit I basically write off conspiracy theories. Anything that would take more than 6 people to pull off, and that if discovered would change the way "common folks" see the world is just too risky, in my opinion. Anyone involved would have much more to gain individually by exposing the conspiracy then by trying to keep it secret.
 
The Pearl said:
You don't have to answer if you don't want to, but what conspiracy theories do you believe and why?
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I'll tackle this one more in-depth tomorrow. I'm getting my *** kicked on the Asian markets right now, so I don't think my piecemeal breakdown going back and forth through screens would be very solid right now.

Though in general:

9/11
Kennedy
Bolsheviks ran by US government
World Government(and that's the one that requires the most explaining because it sort of encompasses a lot).

Those are the ones I focus in on because I think they are the most important.
 
Really not sure how this thread ended up here...

Anyway, if you ignore the terrible travesty of a movie that Travolta tried to pull off, Battlefield Earth was a great read. Hella long book but reads fast as the pace and action never stop. Smartly written too with great creativity.
 
Millsapa said:
I guess since the killer didn't pull out his bow and arrow, he couldn't have have been influenced by the Daily Kos bullseye against a "Blue Dog" Democrat who just voted against Pelosi.
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Just as an aside, I've seen her described as a "blue dog" several places and I don't think it's that clear she's a conservative Dem. She voted for the health care bill, she's pretty left-leaning on immigration (which is THE issue in Arizona), she's very strongly pro-choice, gets horrible scores from gun groups, criticizes No Child Left Behind and supports traditional public schooling, voted for bailouts, and she doesn't score as a centrist on a fair number of margins.

Near as I can tell the basis for calling her a "blue dog" is that she's a member of the blue dog caucus. She's also a member of the New Democrat Coalition. Why is she uniformly described as a Blue Dog but not a New Democrat? Given her voting record I don't think it's a stretch to call her a BDINO. She's certainly not one of those people like Ben Nelson who were publicly hemming and hawing over every little thing for the last two years. All I'm saying is that when I think of Blue Dogs in the House I'm thinking of guys like Jim Cooper, not Gabby Giffords.
 
LogGrad98 said:
Really not sure how this thread ended up here...

Anyway, if you ignore the terrible travesty of a movie that Travolta tried to pull off, Battlefield Earth was a great read. Hella long book but reads fast as the pace and action never stop. Smartly written too with great creativity.
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Really not sure how this POST ended up here!

Wrong thread perhaps? Or part of a conspiracy?
 
Mr. Loughner had complained to a friend about how he was treated by the Arizona lawmaker during an event several years ago, which aggravated Mr. Loughner, according to the friend....

Interviews with people who knew Mr. Loughner suggest the shooting followed a slow unraveling in the life of a seemingly peaceful young man.

Mr. Loughner was a scrawny, average teenager with a mop of curly hair. He played saxophone at football games and jammed with a friend's garage band. In his freshman and sophomore years at Mountain View High School, Mr. Loughner flew under the radar....

Alex Montanaro, who described himself as once having been one of "Jared's best friends" said his buddy was a good, smart kid who was close to his parents. "Throughout our time together all I saw was a normal, loving relationship," he said.

But around the 10th grade, Mr. Loughner seemed to have "a mental downfall" following his break-up with a girlfriend, said Mr. Montanaro, who responded to questions via email....
...Mr. Loughner started acting strangely, Mr. Montanaro said, and "his friends changed from people like us to more, drug oriented people I suppose." He quit playing saxophone and was eventually ignored by his old friends. "Jared really became an outcast," he said.

Friends say by his junior year Mr. Loughner used drugs and his grades slumped. He didn't return for his senior year.

In 2007, the year he would have graduated from high school, Mr. Loughner was arrested in Pima County and charged with possession of drugs and drug paraphernalia, according to court records. His case was dismissed....

...Mr. Loughner later enrolled in classes at Pima Community College, where he became disruptive and unstable....

...Pima College spokesman Paul Schwalbach said the school didn't notify law enforcement officials about Mr. Loughner because he didn't appear to be a threat....

...Zach Osler, a high school friend, also noted Mr. Loughner's slide. During his sophomore and junior years, Mr. Loughner became "progressively more weird," Mr. Osler said. He described an erratic young man who would talk excitedly about his theories of "conscious dreaming"—but would also fall into unnerving, long stupors of silence and stare fixedly at his buddies.

....

Mr. Montanaro said his friend "was never really political," but "really tried to be philosophical." Mr. Loughner liked "contemplating the meaning of words and the origin of language," Mr. Montanaro said.

That interest might have triggered Mr. Loughner's first meeting with Ms. Giffords in 2007. Mr. Loughner said he asked the lawmaker, "How do you know words mean anything?" recalled Mr. Montanaro. He said Mr. Loughner was "aggravated" when Ms. Giffords, after pausing for a couple of seconds, "responded to him in Spanish and moved on with the meeting."

Mr. Montanaro recalled his friend developed "a hate for government and just how everything was systematic...He thought government controlled people too much."

"I really can't understand why Jared was so interested in Giffords," Mr. Montanaro said. "I imagine it was simply because she was the most accessible."
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from today's Wall St. Jnl
https://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703667904576071191163461466.html

maybe it's just me, but I think this sort of reinforces the idea that the shooting was more just the action of a mentally-unhinged young man than anything truly politically motivated.
 
moevillini said:
from today's Wall St. Jnl
https://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703667904576071191163461466.html

maybe it's just me, but I think this sort of reinforces the idea that the shooting was more just the action of a mentally-unhinged young man than anything truly politically motivated.
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The dude was obviously a lunatic and a ticking timebomb. You'd have to be in order to do something like that. But I don't see how you can carry out a planned assassination of a member of congress (that you don't personally know) without it being politically motivated.
 
SaltyDawg said:
The dude was obviously a lunatic and a ticking timebomb. You'd have to be in order to do something like that. But I don't see how you can carry out a planned assassination of a member of congress (that you don't personally know) without it being politically motivated.
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I think what I meant is that I don't think it's his primary motivation. And even though there's a political connection, I don't think it's because he was trying to foment a revolution or anything that concrete. I think it has more to do with the feeling that she disrepected him when he asked her that question back in 2007. Perhaps he tried to communicate with her in other ways as well, like writing, calling or e-mailing her office, and perhaps did not get any responses that satisfied him.

But I could be completely wrong.
 
SaltyDawg said:
The dude was obviously a lunatic and a ticking timebomb. You'd have to be in order to do something like that. But I don't see how you can carry out a planned assassination of a member of congress (that you don't personally know) without it being politically motivated.
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And what about John Hinckley Jr.'s assassination attempt on President Reagan? That had absolutely no political connection whatsoever.
 
Sirkickyass said:
Just as an aside, I've seen her described as a "blue dog" several places and I don't think it's that clear she's a conservative Dem. She voted for the health care bill, she's pretty left-leaning on immigration (which is THE issue in Arizona), she's very strongly pro-choice, gets horrible scores from gun groups, criticizes No Child Left Behind and supports traditional public schooling, voted for bailouts, and she doesn't score as a centrist on a fair number of margins.

Near as I can tell the basis for calling her a "blue dog" is that she's a member of the blue dog caucus. She's also a member of the New Democrat Coalition. Why is she uniformly described as a Blue Dog but not a New Democrat? Given her voting record I don't think it's a stretch to call her a BDINO. She's certainly not one of those people like Ben Nelson who were publicly hemming and hawing over every little thing for the last two years. All I'm saying is that when I think of Blue Dogs in the House I'm thinking of guys like Jim Cooper, not Gabby Giffords.
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Apparently the NPR article called her a "Blue Dog" because she is pro gun rights. To win the last election she had to play the centrist, especially on the immigration issue. After her narrow win in November "Giffords said more centrist House leadership for Democrats will be key to her party’s survival." Daily Kos "Boyblue" was upset enough @ her vote against Pelosi as minority leader that he claimed she was DEAD to him.

I can see why MSNBC jumped so quick on the Sarah Palin target besides the obvious desire to demonize her and the Tea Party. Giffords did some political posturing of her own when she blamed Sarah Palin's target map for her glass office door being smashed after the Health care vote.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8oQi1ty1hs
 
Duck Rodgers said:
Never seen it. I don't watch documentaries. But 9/11 inside job? Absolutely.

You know what's funny? You're the guy posting the Alien topics on this forum and then you have so much disdain when I question something. I don't believe in Aliens - at least to the extent that anybody is ever going to be able to make contact with us or vice versa.
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Wait, didn't you just say you believe in conspiracies because you read about them in "original sources" and "government papers"? Yeah, because you know, there would never be such a thing in regards to extraterrestrial life, right?
 
SaltyDawg said:
The dude was obviously a lunatic and a ticking timebomb. You'd have to be in order to do something like that. But I don't see how you can carry out a planned assassination of a member of congress (that you don't personally know) without it being politically motivated.
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Anyone read the emails from a classmate of his from a couple of years ago? Man, she pegged the kid,.
 
Archie Moses said:
Wait, didn't you just say you believe in conspiracies because you read about them in "original sources" and "government papers"? Yeah, because you know, there would never be such a thing in regards to extraterrestrial life, right?
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Naw, I said a lot of the stuff is based around those. You always have to fill in some blanks. Especially in regards to things like 9/11 where the government never supplied a case against Al Qeada, even though they claimed numerous times they were going to release a white paper to prove their case. But hey, I'm always open. I just don't believe in Aliens based upon what I know up until this point.

Anyway, on the subject of the Arizona Shooter:

https://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/2011/01/10/2011-01-10_chilling_shrine_in_madmans_yard.html

That's creepy to me. I wish one these major papers would go after that whole scene because a lot of people in government that claim they are Christians are involved in similar practices. Everybody that has ever been a member of Skull and Bones should be questioned, everybody that's ever been to Bohemian Grove should be questioned, everybody that's ever been a Free Mason should be questioned. These aren't good people, that's the myth.
 
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I am going to wait for all the information to come out before I start trying to pin this on Palin or conservatives (unlike others on this board). That people would use this tragedy to try to paint their opponents with mud is sickening. Especially when so little is known about his motives.
 
I really think Sarah Palin bankrolled this assassination. At some point it'll come out that Bristol gave him the money to buy the Glock in one of the classes they shared...
 
VINYLONE said:
I really think Sarah Palin bankrolled this assassination. At some point it'll come out that Bristol gave him the money to buy the Glock in one of the classes they shared...
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+1

After reading some of the stupidity posted in this thread you would seriously think that some people believed that.
 
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