SoUjazzfan
Well-Known Member
Not going to lie. I really laughed at this.
Hmmmm you don’t say?
- Thread starter oneye
- Start date
Rudy already has done plenty, and I’ll always like Rudy, nearly no matter what, including if he plays for another team. (Pst Rudy is more popular with the fanbase now and that’s a good thing). I like Rudy because he’s real and genuine. He doesn’t say or do things for just publicity. Rudy does things (I know for a fact) that don’t make headlines. Donovan makes sure every thing he does is a social media post or article. Real, and fake. Simple as that.
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Tim MacMahon in regards to Donovan today on ESPN700:
Checketts "If the Jazz go out in the first round or even the second round how loud does the noise get this offseason?"
Tim: "I think the noise will get loud, I do. It's kind of a constant noise right now."
Tim is trustworthy source. If you don't think Mitchell is an utter and total snake, even beyond what Hayward was. Idk what to tell you. The dude has been given nothing but whatever the f*** he wants. A successful career thus far. Is 25, and in his 5th season with his team. Most players don't sniff the finals or anything close until years 7,8,9. This is the thanks for getting whatever the f*** you want Donovan? F*** right off. And f*** Dennis Lindsey for being incompetent to the max level for giving in on a player option. The dude was and is a snake and it's been obvious for 2 f******* years now.
Checketts "If the Jazz go out in the first round or even the second round how loud does the noise get this offseason?"
Tim: "I think the noise will get loud, I do. It's kind of a constant noise right now."
Tim is trustworthy source. If you don't think Mitchell is an utter and total snake, even beyond what Hayward was. Idk what to tell you. The dude has been given nothing but whatever the f*** he wants. A successful career thus far. Is 25, and in his 5th season with his team. Most players don't sniff the finals or anything close until years 7,8,9. This is the thanks for getting whatever the f*** you want Donovan? F*** right off. And f*** Dennis Lindsey for being incompetent to the max level for giving in on a player option. The dude was and is a snake and it's been obvious for 2 f******* years now.
LoPo
Well-Known Member
Take a deep breath...
Donovan is tired of playing with Rudy. Reporters know he's unhappy, and they speculate that it's about market size. It's not about market size. It's not even all about winning at this point. I think he's sick and tired of doing everything around what Rudy wants and needs, and I think Rudy's recent public comments about defensive effort put the team into a tailspin.
I think this is all about a fractured relationship they have tried to make work for 18 months. They are both to blame, but one has to go.
What are the things Don doing is for Rudy? I am just curious.
LoPo
Well-Known Member
Like it or not, Don is a superstar playing in a system built around a teammate, and that teammate constantly goes public to rant about how things aren't to his liking. When you see guys not trying as hard or collapsing like we have been, it's because something is wrong behind the scenes.
After Rudy made his comments, Clarkson said: "We don't need anybody else coming out in the media saying stuff like that, though, but it's all good," he added.
Mitchell added: "I think we all, as a group, find ways to hold each other accountable. That's just his way about it, I guess. I'm not really concerned about it. At the end of the day, we all find ways to get better. That's really it. We all have individual ways of doing it, and he just happens to be this way. So, cool."
LogGrad98
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In the gutter? Wow. We really have fallen.
You didn't answer my question.
Also just a simple stat. Mitchell is the most efficient PnR scorer in the league. Rudy sets the most screens and is the best at it. There is synergy there you just don't want to admit. Mitchell has also been slightly below average in isos and Rudy is not a shot creator. The system maximizes both of them by giving Mitchell a constant screen setter and stopping Rudy from spending time with the ball.
Clarkson's and Mitchell's comments are irrelevant. The question was what was Don doing for Rudy.
LoPo
Well-Known Member
Yes, there are many statistics that show that Rudy and Don compliment each other. However, they don't like each other. You could show every statistic in the world to Kobe and Shaq, but they didn't like each other. Those guys were entrenched superstars, and they couldn't make it work despite the stats. Our guys are borderline superstars, and although some stats show they can work well together, you can't get past not enjoying playing with somebody.
In terms of what Don "does" for Rudy. I think Don does try to do everything offensively in the regular season to run the system built around Rudy. Sure he goes solo some, but that's just basketball these days. Guys go off script, but Don and Conley run the sets most of the time.
So Don uses what Rudy does for him? What else?
The system isn't solely build around Rudy. It's built to maximize every player. Rudy is an integral part of what makes it work but he is not necessarily a beneficiary of it like Don is. He doesn't need to be. It would have been great if the team found him on deep seals but no team is perfect and Jazz's offense is pretty good as it is.
Don definitely doesn't do everything offensively. He is not a full-time playmaker. Conley picks up PG duties Don can't and also gives Don someone to pass when he is blitzed. Don is rarely double teamed and that's because of offensive threaths Jazz brought to get the burden off Mitchell.
My fear is they will choose to build around Donovan, and send Rudy somewhere else. Donovan will still leave before his contract is up because he thinks he's too important to exist in a smaller market and because Utah is too white. Regular season Donovan is a poor defender with a propensity to ball watch, has poor +- stats, is moody, and his disdain for Rudy is obvious 80% of the time. Efficient offense can be built around Rudy, not sure the same is true for Donovan.
Donovan has shown the ability to defend better in the postseason and sometimes is just great offensively with the ability to create/take/make big shots. However, imo, his great will never translate to a chip if he is the focal piece (ironically, paired with Rudy is the exception). Future proves past, and you simply don't win chips when your dominant player is only 6', possible exception is Steph, but then there was also Barnes, Draymond, KD, Klay, Iggy, etc. Utah does not have that lineup.
Trading Donovan could bring back a piece, or pieces, that could immediately produce a contender i.e. Jaylen Brown. IMO, this is what should happen. In addition, keeping Conley at a reduced rate would be great because now that Ingles is done, Conley is the only decent lob thrower in the p&r, and Rudy needs a lob thrower/interior passer. Rudy will never have a wandering eye. Defense and offense can be built around Rudy. Ideally, if Donovan was traded, his best buddy Royce, who is criminally overrated on this board, and Clarkson could go too.
My prediction: Rudy will be traded and some fans will no longer give a rip and the front office will have seller regret almost instantly. The Jazz are a below average team without Rudy.
Donovan has shown the ability to defend better in the postseason and sometimes is just great offensively with the ability to create/take/make big shots. However, imo, his great will never translate to a chip if he is the focal piece (ironically, paired with Rudy is the exception). Future proves past, and you simply don't win chips when your dominant player is only 6', possible exception is Steph, but then there was also Barnes, Draymond, KD, Klay, Iggy, etc. Utah does not have that lineup.
Trading Donovan could bring back a piece, or pieces, that could immediately produce a contender i.e. Jaylen Brown. IMO, this is what should happen. In addition, keeping Conley at a reduced rate would be great because now that Ingles is done, Conley is the only decent lob thrower in the p&r, and Rudy needs a lob thrower/interior passer. Rudy will never have a wandering eye. Defense and offense can be built around Rudy. Ideally, if Donovan was traded, his best buddy Royce, who is criminally overrated on this board, and Clarkson could go too.
My prediction: Rudy will be traded and some fans will no longer give a rip and the front office will have seller regret almost instantly. The Jazz are a below average team without Rudy.
You somehow post something more stupid every time.
The allure of being the star of NY because he’s a 25 year old immature self deluded child?
I also listened to Andrew Boguts podcast, he talked about it yesterday. He essentially said, he hopes he stays, but he doesn’t see it, that this is how it starts. It goes from an anonymous source, to an agent on record not much longer down the road, goes to creating all sorts of issues for Utah. Bogut/those on his pod essentially agreed with you that NY wouldn’t be as good, but that all of them think he’s as good as gone.
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LoPo
Well-Known Member
Of course you respond without adding anything of value.
Hey, maybe you should post some more lies.
I agree that this is what will happen and it’s naive of the FO. My hope is that Ainge is connected enough he can talk to Ryan about the writing on the wall here. McMahon essentially said to end this discussion “listen the Jazz #1 priority has been and will be keeping Donovan Mitchell happy(notice Lopo he didn’t say Rudy)” he went on to say “but it really might not matter when it comes down to it how much they try to do to make him happy, such as things beyond their control.” Reading between the lines McMahon basically says they’ll kiss Donovan’s ***, but he’s also saying, it’s not going to work. MacMahon is close to the Jazz, covers this market, and has undoubtably heard some things recently because he was not saying this stuff or anything close to it a year ago.
You have earned nothing of value to be said to you.
MItchell is electrifying when he is on, but he's not a superstar. He need to be more efficient to achieve that.