Trade Rumors Involving the Jazz

[Handlogten's Heros]

Basketball is a team sport, not an individual sport. Not everyone on the team needs to have the same skills. Gobert helps the team offense.


So, don't orient the team offense toward Gobert post-ups. There's more than one way to skin a cat.

The quick hitter shots where he has a guy sealed at the rim would be an easy source of a few shots. People underestimate what a great skill setting good screens is. They also underrate bigs that do it with the energy Rudy does. Ayton is more skilled offensively but doesn’t have the motor for dirty work that Rudy does. He has a lot offensive value… he has some limitations for sure.

 

[Ferguson_Mellochill]

You want to do it amicably like PG and OKC. Have a meeting and say look you want out… okay… let’s make the best deal we can… let us work and we won’t make you look like the bad guy here.

If he does the “I want out and here’s my list of teams… “and it’s only like NY and Miami… then it’s get tough time.

All the reporting is he kinda wants out eventually but doesn’t want to be a bad guy.

I will say the best thing he can do is not request a trade but just be honest and transparent with his future plans. Then we have to be honest with ourselves and take him at his word. If he says he wants to give it a year but like we all fear there isn’t a realistic scenario where he wants to commit and stay beyond that… then you actively kick tires on what’s out there. Say he’s motivated and playing better to start the season… but we aren’t winning a lot… you can trade him at the deadline to a team that thinks they are in to something great and will give up the treasure chest… might be more than you can get now. But this conversation opens the window to trading him and that is key to getting the best offer imo. You will also have done some pre work on what is really out there.

I think if the Jazz are going to trade him, they need to trade him preemptively before he causes problems or demands a short list of destinations, i.e., before an uncomfortable situation gets worse. Everyone needs to understand that Donovan's interests are not aligned with the Jazz's interests. He'll want to go to a very short list of teams where a) he can win, and b) he's in a good situation for his Adidas contract. It would be a destination like Miami, Brooklyn, Los Angeles, Atlanta, etc. He won't care one iota what the Jazz get back in a trade scenario.

The Paul George-to-the-Clippers scenario you referenced was extremely opportunistic for the Thunder. The Clippers needed PG that week in order to attract Kawhi Leonard, so the Clippers paid through the nose as though it was a trade to acquire two All Stars rather than just one.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

If we believe in a Machiavellian Ainge, I believe the first thing to do would be to tell NYK that they don't even possess a trade package that's good enough for Mitchell. Tell them they need to tank and get a top 3 pick, otherwise they can't have Mitchell. We want all the future unprotected picks and pick swaps, but there has to also be a premium asset coming back. Barrett is premium, neither is their pick this year.

If you got their picks going forward with RJ +11... that's a good enough offer imo to bite now. Picks need to be unprotected though. RJ has good potential as a two way wing and has operated on a team with Randle, Robinson, etc... like its not a great place for a slasher/driver to thrive. I also think he's a pretty good worker. Like if you wanted #4 from sacramento RJ and 11 would likely get it done pretty easily. The biggest premium is those unprotected future picks.

But I think you sell it to NY like you say... "you don't even have enough to make an offer LOLZ" then see if the come back with a "oh really how about 11, RJ, 2023 Dallas pick, 2023 NY pick, 2025 NY pick, 2027 NY pick... that enough for you????" Then we say you are getting close... how about pick swaps in the even years? Then go from there.

I'm all for betting against the Knicks and benefitting from they dumbasses.

 

[416Klawzz]

He doesn’t need to and unless your name is someone like Embiid or Jockic, you don’t need to be trying to create your own offense It’s not good offense. That’s 90’s basketball. All you need your center to do these days is how you explained what Gobert does unless they can also shoot threes, which a lot of 5’s still don’t do.

The blunt reality is if Rudy had offense we would have beaten Dallas this year and LAC last year. We came up short on the score board, Rudy's buckets and fts could have aided our cause

 

[One Brow]

The blunt reality is if Rudy had offense we would have beaten Dallas this year and LAC last year. We came up short on the score board, Rudy's buckets and fts could have aided our cause

Are you saying the problem against Dallas was our offensive efficiency?

 

[KqWIN]

If you got their picks going forward with RJ +11... that's a good enough offer imo to bite now. Picks need to be unprotected though. RJ has good potential as a two way wing and has operated on a team with Randle, Robinson, etc... like its not a great place for a slasher/driver to thrive. I also think he's a pretty good worker. Like if you wanted #4 from sacramento RJ and 11 would likely get it done pretty easily. The biggest premium is those unprotected future picks.

But I think you sell it to NY like you say... "you don't even have enough to make an offer LOLZ" then see if the come back with a "oh really how about 11, RJ, 2023 Dallas pick, 2023 NY pick, 2025 NY pick, 2027 NY pick... that enough for you????" Then we say you are getting close... how about pick swaps in the even years? Then go from there.

I'm all for betting against the Knicks and benefitting from they dumbasses.

To me that’s just not enough. Not enough to pull the trigger right away at least. I think the Knicks will always have their picks on the table. I want a more premium asset than RJ/11. Once RJ is off his rookie deal it will be ambiguous if that’s even a positive deal.

If the Pacers can get Haliburton out of Sabonis, we ought get a better premium asset out of Don. I’m seeking that NOP package where they got all the picks and great prospects.

 

[LoPo]

Are you saying the problem against Dallas was our offensive efficiency?

It was part of the problem. We averaged less than 100ppg in the playoffs. That's pretty awful.

Most importantly, our offense doesn't make the other team work. Doesn't get them into foul trouble. Doesn't put pressure on them. They literally can double Don, cover Rudy's 3sqft of success and suffocate Bojan.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

To me that’s just not enough. Not enough to pull the trigger right away at least. I think the Knicks will always have their picks on the table. I want a more premium asset than RJ/11. Once RJ is off his rookie deal it will be ambiguous if that’s even a positive deal.

If the Pacers can get Haliburton out of Sabonis, we ought get a better premium asset out of Don. I’m seeking that NOP package where they got all the picks and great prospects.

And we’ve talked through this before… I understand where you are and you understand where I am… so no need for me to get into more detail. AD is a much more valuable player and Lakers and I think the Knicks future picks have more value than the Lakers future picks did.

I agree on RJ… I’d try to extend him in the 20M range now and hope he levels up like Miles Bridges did. There’s be some risk to factor in.

I’ve wondered if they could cobble together enough stuff between Toppin/Quickley/Dallas pick to get 4 from Sacramento… might be something they could do to snag the premium asset for us.

 

[Elizah Huge]

It was part of the problem. We averaged less than 100ppg in the playoffs. That's pretty awful.

Most importantly, our offense doesn't make the other team work. Doesn't get them into foul trouble. Doesn't put pressure on them. They literally can double Don, cover Rudy's 3sqft of success and suffocate Bojan.

Spot on. We could really use another offensive playmaker.

 

[KqWIN]

And we’ve talked through this before… I understand where you are and you understand where I am… so no need for me to get into more detail. AD is a much more valuable player and Lakers and I think the Knicks future picks have more value than the Lakers future picks did.

I agree on RJ… I’d try to extend him in the 20M range now and hope he levels up like Miles Bridges did. There’s be some risk to factor in.

I’ve wondered if they could cobble together enough stuff between Toppin/Quickley/Dallas pick to get 4 from Sacramento… might be something they could do to snag the premium asset for us.

I just think we need the Knicks to work harder for their guy. Don isn’t close to AD as a player, but how many more players would the Knicks rather have than Don? They value him more than any team in the league. Use that against them. I’m willing to wait it out.

At the very least, I don’t think there’s a deal that’s “too much” for the Knicks. They’d give everything they have in a heartbeat right now. It feels like a standing offer, and I don’t think it goes away. I’d rather wave the middle finger at them and tell them to get us Wemby (even though I’m a Wemby skeptic).

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I just think we need the Knicks to work harder for their guy. Don isn’t close to AD as a player, but how many more players would the Knicks rather have than Don? They value him more than any team in the league. Use that against them. I’m willing to wait it out.

At the very least, I don’t think there’s a deal that’s “too much” for the Knicks. They’d give everything they have in a heartbeat right now. It feels like a standing offer, and I don’t think it goes away. I’d rather wave the middle finger at them and tell them to get us Wemby (even though I’m a Wemby skeptic).

I think if they had a shot at Wemby they would forego the Donovan sweepstakes. I think they want him for sure... if he were to openly return that love they might go to the lengths I outlined.. I think that might be close to the upper limit though. I think I value the volume we get in the deal... but would be nice to have a premium asset in there of course.

I have a slight worry that the bloom has started to come off the rose with Donovan around the league and if we move Rudy and Donovan puts up good numbers on a team with a bad record that his perceived value would drop. I know you don't necessarily share that concern... but it factors into my thinking.

 

[Shad]

Please just trade everyone (old) on the roster for high picks or young players. I'm tired of all the drama queens on the team and I'd rather watch Jared Butler play seasonal games than another 1st round stomping

 

[One Brow]

It was part of the problem. We averaged less than 100ppg in the playoffs. That's pretty awful.

Our offensive rating was about average in the first round, despite Conley. Our defensive rating was horrible. We lost on defense.

Most importantly, our offense doesn't make the other team work. Doesn't get them into foul trouble. Doesn't put pressure on them. They literally can double Don, cover Rudy's 3sqft of success and suffocate Bojan.

That leaves one guy to cover Royce and Conley. That says just about everything regarding where the problem was.

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

The blunt reality is if Rudy had offense we would have beaten Dallas this year and LAC last year. We came up short on the score board, Rudy's buckets and fts could have aided our cause

We would’ve won if guys like Don and Bogie played defense and made a shot with any consistency as well. Goes both ways idiot!!

 

[416Klawzz]

Are you saying the problem against Dallas was our offensive efficiency?

I'm saying if Rudy could score on his own and and hit fts we could have won. He was unable to take advantage with his mismatches because he can't back down.

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

He should when he’s getting paid like a top-10 player.

Two things. One… it’s not his fault the jazz agreed to that contract, second… they are paying the man because he’s an all time great defender that makes the team offense better.

 

[416Klawzz]

We would’ve won if guys like Don and Bogie played defense and made a shot with any consistency as well. Goes both ways idiot!!

Typical Rudy supporter blame his handicaps on others. The truth hurts. He can't back down, shoot or dribble.

 

[416Klawzz]

Two things. One… it’s not his fault the jazz agreed to that contract, second… they are paying the man because he’s an all time great defender that makes the team offense better.

How far has he got them ? Has he created any shot over the many summers he had the opportunity to work on any offensive tools? He is a 30 year old offensive liability. The front office will get rid of him because he is a one dimensional player. He is too restricted offensively. I cringe when he goes to post up or attempts to do anything other than dunking because it will 1 look stupid 2. Be an air ball or brick or 3 he will get stripped, double dribble or travel.

 

[416Klawzz]

We would’ve won if guys like Don and Bogie played defense and made a shot with any consistency as well. Goes both ways idiot!!

Donovan played on one ankle, Bogey can get locked down and he did. Rudy just sucks at offense.

 

[cowhide]

You want to do it amicably like PG and OKC. Have a meeting and say look you want out… okay… let’s make the best deal we can… let us work and we won’t make you look like the bad guy here.

If he does the “I want out and here’s my list of teams… “and it’s only like NY and Miami… then it’s get tough time.

All the reporting is he kinda wants out eventually but doesn’t want to be a bad guy.

I will say the best thing he can do is not request a trade but just be honest and transparent with his future plans. Then we have to be honest with ourselves and take him at his word. If he says he wants to give it a year but like we all fear there isn’t a realistic scenario where he wants to commit and stay beyond that… then you actively kick tires on what’s out there. Say he’s motivated and playing better to start the season… but we aren’t winning a lot… you can trade him at the deadline to a team that thinks they are in to something great and will give up the treasure chest… might be more than you can get now. But this conversation opens the window to trading him and that is key to getting the best offer imo. You will also have done some pre work on what is really out there.

What reporting is this? Seems more like rumors or speculation and less about facts and finding out if this is true. I agree that the Jazz don't want to find them in a Hayward situation in 3 years and he walks and the Jazz have nothing in return. I hope the Jazz don't act like usual and give up too much when trading any of their players. Jazz always seem to throw in picks instead of getting them. i.e. Conley, Jefferson, Favors. I would like to see if the Jazz could get a decent player for Conley/Royce combo. It is going to be an interesting next month for sure.