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Obama Government Shutdown?

Our national government has become completely out of touch with the people they serve. From the President to the Senate to the House of Representatives they ALL have major flaws. Our government on a federal level is more about the show and the glitz than they are about the meat and potatoes. Draft a law with input from people who know? Read? Be informed? Spend time actually doing my job instead of speaking to people about how special I am?.. that can't be right? I wanna see somebody put their money where their mouth is and refuse their federal pay and subject themselves to the same laws we all get. And LIFETIME benefits? That is bull! I con't claim to have all the answers, but what our government has become needs reform. Democracy is still worth it, just not like this.


My $0.02
 
Elections work both ways. America is divided enough that compromise is a must. Since neither side is they are both to blame. Nice attempt to paint the Presidents election as the only one that matters though. This shutdown shows that is wrong.

Why have elections then? I guess you forgot how after winning back the House in 2010 the Republicans used this victory to continue their nonsense of saying NO to everything that the president wants to do. They actually said it was the people who were voicing their dissatisfaction with "failed" Obama policies. Yet when the president is re-elected they ignore the people and continue to act like spoiled 2 year olds.

Sorry the winning side does the least amount of compromise. Bush got to invade Iraq because he "won" the election. Besides the Democrats rolled over and made comprises about taxes. They had to or Boehner would have kept crying. No one wins and both sides share some of the blame.

However, most polls show the GOP getting most of the blame which they have earned with their 40+ attempts at defunding a law and 240 + filibusters. They are going against a Conservative Supreme Court decision and the majority of the people. Yes the majority of the people because Obama won the majority of the votes running on implement Obamacare.
 
Actually imo this happens because Americans are lazy. They largely refuse to truly get into the issues and understand the implications of legislation or candidate positions and vote how their friends or the media tells them to. Or vote on one or two hot button topics for them personally. "That guy needs to be voted down, he is against abortion." Or whatever.

Politicians understand this very well and turn every election and every debate on legislation into soundbites and sharp witty remarks aimed at the lowest common denominators. Get people pissed off or outraged and you get their support regardless of what is really best, or even relevant.

Romney makes a lot of money? That *******! **** him! I'd like to go golfing with Obama, he'd make a great president. He has a nice smile and sounds so smart! He's got my vote!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using JazzFanz mobile app

So only smart people vote for Romney. LMAO!! I remember how many republicans said they voted for GW because they could see having a beer with him. My landlord didn't vote for Obama because he didn't want a N@#%$ in the White house. Sorry both sides have knuckleheads voting.
 
It is not a generality, it is a fact. The nation voted in a Republican house that ran on removing Obamacare.

Edit: To be clear I am not defending the republicans as I see no sign of compromise from those idiots either.

There you going again, Obama won both elections and the debate about Obamacare so says the final decision-maker in the land: The Supreme Court (Conservative one).
 
The majority of people don't want this method of fighting obamacare. This is NOT what they voted for.

They have lost the fight, and now just acting like spoiled children. Give it up. You've milked the process for all it's worth, and lost.
Accept it, and move to improve.
 
I think democrats should vote to defund the Iraq war like they ran on for a decade.

Well the democrats missed their chance but this is an example of how the democrats rolled over/compromised their principles to the majority party to keep things moving along.
 
Term limits, no more life time pay or health insurance, they are subject to any law they pass, cannot vote themselves raises, removal of their 5 star catering. Make them spend that money into the local economy.

Pass those and things will start to change.

That's a start. How about getting rid of lobbying and campaign financing.
 
"We're very excited," Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minnesota) told the Washington Post. "It's exactly what we wanted, and we got it."

someone's happy :cool:
 
I like some things about the ACA. Such as no copays for preventative appointments for minor kids. Covering kids on your insurance till they are 26 (didn't go far enough in my opinion)...

Obamacare isn't perfect but a least it isn't ignoring the problem. What most republicans don't get is that Obamacare is the compromise. Democrats wanted a one payor system and that is why no healthcare passed during the Clinton years. ACA is similar to what the GOP brought to the table. So they were ok with Romneycare but once it became a democratic/Obama idea then it became a socialists program.
 
This is one example on the left side of things. There are plenty of examples of this on the right side of things. The right had control under Bush and they did a lot of bad deals as well.

Are you actually comparing Iraq to Obamacare? The point of candrew's post is that the president won the election and debate over this issue so he shouldn't have to compromise. Yes it is true that Bush invading Iraq was a bad thing but he still got to do what he wanted to even though he didn't have the majority wanting him elected. The way the system works is the winners get to have more of their stuff passed because they won. You don't have to like or agree with it but that has pretty much worked that way until recently when the GOP/TP think they can ignore the will of the people regardless of the election results. Do you actually think the republicans would compromise if they were in charge? They didn't on Iraq!!!
 
For the government shut down absolutely one party is to blame.

Which party is that?

The party that passed spending programs that we don't have money for?

There is blame on both sides. I want to help those out who are down on their luck and need some help to get back on their feet. When I see people driving nice cars and buying candy bars and pop and beef jerky at the gas station with food stamps...that's not what I had in mind.

BOTH parties are to blame. Anyone who can't see that is part of the problem.
 
Part of the problem is you cant vote in primaries for both parties can you? You can't go vote on the Republican side as they whittle down the field, and vote on the Democrat side as they do the same? Am I missing something? If you like one person from the Dems for one spot and one Repub for something else you can't vote for both unless they both happen to make it to the final vote between repubs and dems... this sound right?

Depend on the state. I'm pretty sure that in Maryland people can vote in both primaries.
 
Right?

This is law. Not proposed law, actual law. They refused to find a way to fund it because they don't agree with it even though it's been through 40+ votes to repeal, and a judgement from the Judicial branch.

How is this not the GOP's fault?

Aren't we running at huge deficits? How are you supposed to fund something you don't have money for?

Come on now. Your post is EXACTLY what is wrong with this country.

Here are some facts:

We have more social/defense programs than we can afford.

Raising taxes is a STUPID argument, because if you taxed the rich at 100%, we would still be running deficits.

Until both sides realize that we are in over our heads AND ONLY THROUGH CUTS can we get back on stable ground, then politics is pointless because no one wants to fix the problem. They just want theirs.

The only other option is to pull out of the "world", tax all imports through the butt, and force manufacturers to bring jobs back to the US.
 
Why have elections then? I guess you forgot how after winning back the House in 2010 the Republicans used this victory to continue their nonsense of saying NO to everything that the president wants to do. They actually said it was the people who were voicing their dissatisfaction with "failed" Obama policies.

If I recall correctly, the Democrats were the first party to filibuster laws/supreme court appointees, etc.

Again, BOTH SIDES are at fault. BOTH SIDES ARE DOING THE SAME THING.
 
You're seeing a party in crisis at the moment. You've got about 40 members of the GOP (this number is from Peter King R-NY) who are wagging the dog. Boehner isn't really in charge and can't bring them in line without losing his job as speaker in the process. Cruz seems bound and determined to make a name for himself as being the guy who defunded Obamacare. After years and years and years of negotiating against himself, Obama has finally decided that he's not going to respond to hostage taking anymore. To the extent Obama is to blame, it's because he's given in to these tactics previously and encouraged the GOP to do it again and again.


Stoked, you keep repeating that the people elected this house to do what it's doing now. That's only kind of true. Gerrymandering played a huge role in the party make-up of the house. Even though the House GOP outnumbers the Dems by 32 seats, the reality is that Democrats won an aggregated popular vote in house races by more than a million votes. In fact the discrepancy between popular vote and seat representation is the largest it's been in more than 60 years.

https://election.princeton.edu/2012/11/09/the-new-house-with-less-democracy/
 
There you going again, Obama won both elections and the debate about Obamacare so says the final decision-maker in the land: The Supreme Court (Conservative one).

Do you understand what the Supreme Court said about it exactly? They didn't make a sweeping statement that Obamacare is the final law of the land. You seem confused.

Their ruling was simply that it was legal for congress to pass Obamacare because it qualified as a tax and congress has constitutional authority to levy taxes. That's it. No more, no less. All it means is that Obamacare is not against the constitution, not that the Supreme Court has declared it the final end-all be-all law as you seem to think. It proves nothing other than it is legal. It doesn't mean it is right, or good, or even publicly supported, or what the majority wants, rather just that it is legal, from a constitutional standpoint. Their ruling has no weight other than legality.

You also seem to miss another point. Electing Obama does not equal voting in favor of Obamacare. Nowhere on the ballet I filled out was there any proviso that I accepted or rejected Obamacare based on how I voted in the election. Making that connection is a false dichotomy. That is, in fact, why I used the examples I did earlier of rhetoric that sways voters. Obama ran as much on an anti-Romney campaign as he did on any other platform. In fact Obamacare, or "The Affordable Care Act" didn't even exist in it's legislated form during the election. The part of Obama's platform that addressed this was that he was committed to reforming healthcare, presumably so everyone had access to insurance. The details were not hammered out until well after the presidential election, and the vote in the senate happened on December 24, 2009. To state unequivocally that a vote for Obama is exactly equivalent to a vote for Obamacare is just absurd and is proof of brainlessly following party rhetoric.

Also, do you know why the Republicans are against Obamacare, and what the main difference is from Ronmeycare that has them up in arms? Do you know the turning point from what started as a fairly decent bi-partisan exercise and turned into the mess it is now? It is actually pretty interesting if you take the time to understand what both sides are saying and their traditional stands on such issues.

But to do that you would have to acknowledge that both sides might have a point, and actually be willing to accept that one side isn't perfect. I don't expect that from you given your assumptions and rhetoric, but I encourage you to try anyway.
 
Obamacare isn't perfect but a least it isn't ignoring the problem. What most republicans don't get is that Obamacare is the compromise. Democrats wanted a one payor system and that is why no healthcare passed during the Clinton years. ACA is similar to what the GOP brought to the table. So they were ok with Romneycare but once it became a democratic/Obama idea then it became a socialists program.

This is a lie. We don't know what Obamacare is yet. More rhetoric. Again, as long as rhetoric is more important than reality and compromise, then we are screwed.
 
Are you actually comparing Iraq to Obamacare? The point of candrew's post is that the president won the election and debate over this issue so he shouldn't have to compromise. Yes it is true that Bush invading Iraq was a bad thing but he still got to do what he wanted to even though he didn't have the majority wanting him elected. The way the system works is the winners get to have more of their stuff passed because they won. You don't have to like or agree with it but that has pretty much worked that way until recently when the GOP/TP think they can ignore the will of the people regardless of the election results. Do you actually think the republicans would compromise if they were in charge? They didn't on Iraq!!!

Ahem, democrat filibusters, ahem.

Sorry, both sides are doing the same thing.
 
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