Longest Thread Ever

[babe]

Where people peaceably can hold and use property with maximum personal discretion, populations grow. The freer the individual, the wealthier that state will become in a few years. Mothers and their babies get better nutrition and better clothing/homes/tools. People roll outta bed and find something worth doing. . . .

The more socialist a State is, the more private property is "at risk" politically, the poorer a nation will become in a few years. Mothers will worry about having babies. . .. they and their young will have less food, stuff. . . health will deteriorate. . . . . People won't roll outta bed or find anything worth doing because The State owns the means of production in some sort of cabal with a few tyrants/corporatist cartel holders. . . . Government will try to keep the people in circuses and carnivals and sports arenas, but nobody will do anything, and everyone will expect a little support from the powerful clique. . .. and get less and less of that support as time goes on. . . . people will not get healthcare, food, fiber, shelter. . . . and will be subject to higher mortality rates. . ..

 

[babe]

But probably the strongest determinant for any national prosperity, under any system of government, is the right to think differently and try things that haven't been tried, yet. . . . Intellectual endeavors, so to speak.

The nation with the highest talent in creativity is gonna take the lead on the world stage in a few years. . . .

 

[VINYLONE]

Everyone wants something that is beyond the control of the master who is behind the strings of the theatre.

 

[♪alt13]

I know this is a little late but...

I always considered myself pro-choice because I was under the false impression that it was always performed when the fetus was a clump of cells. My friend just had a baby boy at 27 weeks and while he does require oxygen while his lungs develop, he is clearly a child.

I would be for reexamining how late abortion should be allowed. I think this would require us all though to put aside our 'beliefs' on the matter and decide upon some new rational criteria to replace 'viability'. If you would like to see terminating a pregnancy banned from conception I have news for you, it ain't gunna happen. By supporting a position without compromise you are diverting attention from later term abortions which should be the focus.

If you(like I did for many years) think that babies don't get aborted just lumps of fetal cells I would ask you to research the subject a little more. I would also ask you to think about the pressure that some girls feel to have an abortion. I have seen it and I have met young women that are horribly emotionally scarred by the experience of having an abortion.

I never really cared for the heartbeat argument because pigs have heartbeats, a heartbeat does not make something human. I do think that a brain does however. 24 weeks is almost 6 months pregnant and is imo way too late.

 

[8]

But probably the strongest determinant for any national prosperity, under any system of government, is the right to think differently and try things that haven't been tried, yet. . . . Intellectual endeavors, so to speak.

The nation with the highest talent in creativity is gonna take the lead on the world stage in a few years. . . .

And naturally, the nation that creates the best environment to foster such activity will be the frontrunner

 

[ema]

I know this is a little late but...

I always considered myself pro-choice because I was under the false impression that it was always performed when the fetus was a clump of cells. My friend just had a baby boy at 27 weeks and while he does require oxygen while his lungs develop, he is clearly a child.

I would be for reexamining how late abortion should be allowed. I think this would require us all though to put aside our 'beliefs' on the matter and decide upon some new rational criteria to replace 'viability'. If you would like to see terminating a pregnancy banned from conception I have news for you, it ain't gunna happen. By supporting a position without compromise you are diverting attention from later term abortions which should be the focus.

If you(like I did for many years) think that babies don't get aborted just lumps of fetal cells I would ask you to research the subject a little more. I would also ask you to think about the pressure that some girls feel to have an abortion. I have seen it and I have met young women that are horribly emotionally scarred by the experience of having an abortion.

I never really cared for the heartbeat argument because pigs have heartbeats, a heartbeat does not make something human. I do think that a brain does however. 24 weeks is almost 6 months pregnant and is imo way too late.

Don't know the last subject of the thread because I read only this post but I wanted to say that I agree with what you say here.

I've never liked that motto "My body, my choice" and the ones like it, etc.. Helloo!!! It's not only your body anymore. Not after a certain point.

Really, the main focus should be on the abortion time.

 

[PearlWatson]

Don't know the last subject of the thread because I read only this post but I wanted to say that I agree with what you say here.

I've never liked that motto "My body, my choice" and the ones like it, etc.. Helloo!!! It's not only your body anymore. Not after a certain point.

Really, the main focus should be on the abortion time.

By the time a female starts suspecting she might be pregnant (misses her period) she is already 2 weeks along, and already past the "clump of cells" stage.
Most abortions occur between 4 and 8 weeks where the baby looks very much like a baby.

 

[PearlWatson]

I never really cared for the heartbeat argument because pigs have heartbeats, a heartbeat does not make something human. I do think that a brain does however. 24 weeks is almost 6 months pregnant and is imo way too late.

Flawed logic. No one believes everything with a heartbeat is human. Everything with a heartbeat also has a brain of some kind.

The heartbeat argument ain't about whether a fetus is a "human," it is about whether a fetus is a "life" with constitutional protections.

If you go with the brain over heartbeat argument you would come into the degree of development problem as well.

 

[♪alt13]

Flawed logic. No one believes everything with a heartbeat is human. Everything with a heartbeat also has a brain of some kind.

The heartbeat argument ain't about whether a fetus is a "human," it is about whether a fetus is a "life" with constitutional protections.

If you go with the brain over heartbeat argument you would come into the degree of development problem as well.

If you had a heart transplant you would be the same person. If you had a brain transplant you would be essentially donating your body to someone else. A human brain is something special because it is the lump of flesh thatcontains who we are.

There would be disagreements about development but right now there are disagreements anyway. My understanding is that at 24 weeks what makes a fetus not viable is underdeveloped lungs. I think we should ask ourselves a hypothetical "If all other organs were developed enough for survival would this fetus have reasonable brain function." We may disagree a little on the answer to that question but if we are being honest we should be close.

 

[♪alt13]

@pearl

 

[PearlWatson]

If you had a heart transplant you would be the same person. If you had a brain transplant you would be essentially donating your body to someone else. A human brain is something special because it is the lump of flesh thatcontains who we are.

There would be disagreements about development but right now there are disagreements anyway. My understanding is that at 24 weeks what makes a fetus not viable is underdeveloped lungs. I think we should ask ourselves a hypothetical "If all other organs were developed enough for survival would this fetus have reasonable brain function." We may disagree a little on the answer to that question but if we are being honest we should be close.

There is no such thing as a brain transplant. The brain argument can only be applied to killing off down syndrome or brain damaged babies in the womb... or keeping brain damaged/brain dead people alive on ventilators.

The human brain ain't a "lump of flesh" any more than the embryo is.

 

[♪alt13]

There is no such thing as a brain transplant. The brain argument can only be applied to killing off down syndrome or brain damaged babies in the womb... or keeping brain damaged/brain dead people alive on ventilators.

The human brain ain't a "lump of flesh" any more than the embryo is.

I know that there is no such thing as a brain transplant. derp

I have been extolling the importance of the brain, please don't let my choice of words offend you.