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Never Trump

Siro said:
I asked that before. He said he liked that Trump is patriotic and not afraid of speaking his mind. Among other things. It was a long post, but I do remember him mentioning those 2 things.
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My opinion of Trump has followed an arc. At first I thought his candidacy was a bad joke. I didn't take anything about it seriously. Then, as I saw his tactics and heard his words I began to hate him. The only candidate I ever supported was Kasich, but I was never what you would call an enthusiastic supporter. I wished Romney had run.

Around the time it became obvious Trump was going to win the nomination I watched one of his rallys. His appeal in that format was obvious, although he was not appealing to me. The crowd adored him, and he gave an excellent performance. I made a post saying that I could see why people were reacting positively to his non-politically correct speech. I found it refreshing as well. I still appreciate that he says what he thinks (even though I don't agree with a lot of it). I don't recall saying that I thought he was patriotic but I probably did say that it was refreshing to see a candidate who believed that America was a great country (instead of one you need to go around the world apologizing for). Eventually I reached a point where I said I would vote for him simply because I thought Clinton is worse. Then he made the moronic quotes about the Hispanic judge and permanently lost my support.

For the first time ever I feel grateful that it doesn't really matter who I vote for because I'm in Utah. I will continue to follow the election, though because it's a crazy reality show that is going to have an impact on my life.
 
Joe Bagadonuts said:
Unbelievable. I have not said anything in support of Trump. I've said he is a terrible candidate and I'm not voting for him. I said that he wouldn't have a chance in hell of winning if he weren't running against Hillary. Do you consider those compliments? You are getting pissed at me for saying that people should not hurl unfounded criticism at him and his family. His detractors (you included)hate him so bad that they are making up things to hate him for. It's absurd.
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What have people made up about him?
 
Boris said:
Oh you mean like Chappaquiddick? Have you thought that maybe is true libertarians are tired of the lies an hate an hypocrisy of the left? That is why we support an fully endorse Trump. Enough is enough!
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True libertarians aren't anymore anti-left than anti-right. Tea-bag fake *** libertarians on the other hand...
 
Joe Bagadonuts said:
The two I have reacted to on this board are that he's not a hard worker (GF said he would probably quit when he discovered the presidency involved work) and that his kids are douches. Nobody has shown any evidence of either of these claims.
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Lack of evidence doesn't necessarily = made up.
 
Siro said:
Since evidence is how you evaluate whether something is made up, in practice the distinction is non-existent.
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What I said is still true. Lack of evidence does not = made up.

I saw a badger one time while fishing fish creek. I have no evidence. I didn't make it up.
 
Gameface said:
True libertarians aren't anymore anti-left than anti-right. Tea-bag fake *** libertarians on the other hand...
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Scuse me? This is at least the fifth time I ask you which brand of libertarian you are. Some libertarians are socialist some are opposite. There is no debating this.

What is also true is the left hates America, drives divisive rhetoric an attacks anything not PC TO CHILDREN AN TEENS.

What kind of philosophy wants to indoctrinate teens that your country is evil an everybody owes you something an you should not work because?
 
fishonjazz said:
What I said is still true. Lack of evidence does not = made up.

I saw a badger one time while fishing fish creek. I have no evidence. I didn't make it up.
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I saw an elephant in the exact same place. I have no evidence. I don't even know where the place you're talking about is. I just decided to say it because I wanted to make a point (same as the people who have no knowledge of Trump's work habits or his children's personalities who decided to make negative claims about them simply because they don't like his candidacy).
 
Joe Bagadonuts said:
I saw an elephant in the exact same place. I have no evidence. I don't even know where the place you're talking about is. I just decided to say it because I wanted to make a point (same as the people who have no knowledge of Trump's work habits or his children's personalities who decided to make negative claims about them simply because they don't like his candidacy).
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I never said lack of evidence = truth or fact..... I just said lack of evidence doesn't necessarily always = made up.


Sometimes evidence does not even equal truth/fact. Evidence can be doctored.
 
Joe Bagadonuts said:
My opinion of Trump has followed an arc. At first I thought his candidacy was a bad joke. I didn't take anything about it seriously. Then, as I saw his tactics and heard his words I began to hate him. The only candidate I ever supported was Kasich, but I was never what you would call an enthusiastic supporter. I wished Romney had run.

Around the time it became obvious Trump was going to win the nomination I watched one of his rallys. His appeal in that format was obvious, although he was not appealing to me. The crowd adored him, and he gave an excellent performance. I made a post saying that I could see why people were reacting positively to his non-politically correct speech. I found it refreshing as well. I still appreciate that he says what he thinks (even though I don't agree with a lot of it). I don't recall saying that I thought he was patriotic but I probably did say that it was refreshing to see a candidate who believed that America was a great country (instead of one you need to go around the world apologizing for). Eventually I reached a point where I said I would vote for him simply because I thought Clinton is worse. Then he made the moronic quotes about the Hispanic judge and permanently lost my support.

For the first time ever I feel grateful that it doesn't really matter who I vote for because I'm in Utah. I will continue to follow the election, though because it's a crazy reality show that is going to have an impact on my life.
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I can't stand the non-PC reason for voting for Trump. Most that I hear saying this are catholic conservatives who eventually admit that all they really want is a conservative supreme court judge voted in.

Red said:
It's true that one of the favorite criticisms of Trump, by his detractors/critics/haters is that he makes unsupported claims. And that would seem to be the case:

https://www.youthdebates.org/t/list-of-donald-trumps-lies/104706

His many campaign misstatements in 2015 earned him Politifacts "2015 Lie of the Year":

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-...lie-year-donald-trump-campaign-misstatements/
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I don't think that gets to the base of it at all. Most politicians are bull****ers. Isn't that the lifelong joke about them?

With Trump it is the abrasive way he spouts off.
 
fishonjazz said:
I never said lack of evidence = truth or fact..... I just said lack of evidence doesn't necessarily always = made up.


Sometimes evidence does not even equal truth/fact. Evidence can be doctored.
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I know dude. The whole thing was specifically about unsupported claims that people were making about Trump. Not only is there no evidence of what they say, but there is evidence of exactly the opposite. Everyone who actually spends time around him, including those who don't like him, say he's a workaholic.

So why you're making these arguments about lack of evidence is beyond me. Not only is there not a lack of evidence, but your argument does not even make sense. Evidence is literally what we use to tell what is the truth...every...single...time. You believe you saw that badger because of evidence. I believe that you saw it because of evidence as well. You don't believe I saw the elephant because of evidence.
 
franklin said:
I can't stand the non-PC reason for voting for Trump. Most that I hear saying this are catholic conservatives who eventually admit that all they really want is a conservative supreme court judge voted in.
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I think there are millions of people (not simply Catholic conservatives) who are completely fed up with PC. They think "safe spaces" are a stupid idea. They think "cultural appropriation" is reaching idiotic levels. They think that describing our enemies by their obvious characteristics is just plain common sense. It goes on and on.
 
Joe Bagadonuts said:
I think there are millions of people (not simply Catholic conservatives) who are completely fed up with PC. They think "safe spaces" are a stupid idea. They think "cultural appropriation" is reaching idiotic levels. They think that describing our enemies by their obvious characteristics is just plain common sense. It goes on and on.
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Or people want to go back to saying stupid stuff with no consequences. Anti-PC crowd doesn't seem to like people fighting back against inanity. So they complain about PC ridiculousness or come back with even harsher vitriol.

I am sorry that all Americans don't take to "Mexicans are rapists" well, or "trangenderism is a disease," or things like that.
 
Joe Bagadonuts said:
I think there are millions of people (not simply Catholic conservatives) who are completely fed up with PC. They think "safe spaces" are a stupid idea. They think "cultural appropriation" is reaching idiotic levels. They think that describing our enemies by their obvious characteristics is just plain common sense. It goes on and on.
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I realize that. I was merely sending my own personal experiences.

Darkwing Duck said:
Or people want to go back to saying stupid stuff with no consequences. Anti-PC crowd doesn't seem to like people fighting back against inanity. So they complain about PC ridiculousness or come back with even harsher vitriol.

I am sorry that all Americans don't take to "Mexicans are rapists" well, or "trangenderism is a disease," or things like that.
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They also fail to realize their anti-PC rhetoric is a part of the PC rhetoric for their crowd. They're basically complaining about their own mentality without realizing it. Yet, that is the basis of most political rhetoric as I've come to understand it. "Do as I say not as I do".

I am guilty of as much, even if my crowd is only myself.
 
franklin said:
They also fail to realize their anti-PC rhetoric is a part of the PC rhetoric for their crowd. They're basically complaining about their own mentality without realizing it. Yet, that is the basis of most political rhetoric as I've come to understand it. "Do as I say not as I do".

I am guilty of as much, even if my crowd is only myself.
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That's true, I suppose. If you're not pandering to your base without saying stupid things you're kowtowing to the other end. I guess that's where the biggest problem lies, is being proud of how close your record is to the party line. If your voting record is 100% what the Republican/Democratic party deems the proper decision, they're no difference between you and an inanimate object the party could use to punch a vote.
 
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