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lol obama robbed you guys!(utah guys)

D

DutchJazzer

Banned
hahahahha

lol obama still trying to cement his legacy. does he not know that his legacy is gone like a fart in the wind.
based on executive orders.


obama robbed utah of land
 
DutchJazzer said:
hahahahha

lol obama still trying to cement his legacy. does he not know that his legacy is gone like a fart in the wind.
based on executive orders.


obama robbed utah of land
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Executive order??? The two new national monuments were created by Obama by authority granted to the President by the Congress through the Antiquities Act of 1906, which law was passed primarily to protect archaeological sites on federal land. In the case of Bears Ears, it was already land managed by the Federal Bureau of Land Management(BLM) It was not created by executive order, it cannot be erased by executive order. Only Congress can remove designation as national monument.

It is contentious. Very much so. The Sagebrush Revolution would have more state control and private usage of federal lands. The creation of Bears Ears is seen as a victory for Native Americans in general, and the 5 tribes in particular:

https://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Polit...mericans-new-national-monument-a-rare-victory

Bears Ears contains the greatest concentration of archaeological sites in the entire Southwest. More then all 5 of Utah's national parks combined. A great deal of archaeological looting by artifact collectors, grave robbing, and destruction of petroglyph panels has taken place at Bears Ears. With only two federal employees patrolling the vast property, it is hoped designation through the Antiquities Act of 1906 will result in more manpower to try and protect this incredible national archaeological heritage.

https://www.grandcanyontrust.org/bears-ears-cultural-landscape?gclid=CIHr1cHzm9ECFUuRfgodsUcCkw

Nice video of the monument at this link:

https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2016/12/bears-ears-gold-butte-national-monument-utah-nevada/

There are two sides to this particular designation, some of that is described in the above links. But I'm sure those conservatives and proponents of the Sagebrush Rebellion can speak up for that side. Myself, I clearly side with the 5 tribes and the protection of archaeological heritage and tribal spirituality....
 
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The creation of Bears Ears National Monument has clearly divided the citizens of Utah, just as Clinton's designation of the Escalante management area did in the 90's. Even some members of the 5 tribes in question opposed it, fearing they would no longer be allowed to collect medicinal plants on the designated land, visit sacred sites associated with their people, etc. but provisions were included to ensure they would not lose those privlages, and the designation created a native commission that will help oversee management. One reason it was regarded as a victory for Native Americans. Utah's Congrssional delegation and governor are against it very much. Republicans are going to fight it, but a national monument designation has never been overturned before. Trump certainly can't use executive order to overturn it.

I have read that local opposition in earlier instances of monument designation has dissipated over time once tourism dollars are seen as actually helping the local economy.
 
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Obsession.... for dutch.
 
Red said:
Executive order??? The two new national monuments were created by Obama by authority granted to the President by the Congress through the Antiquities Act of 1906, which law was passed primarily to protect archaeological sites on federal land. In the case of Bear Ears, it was already land managed by the Federal Bureau of Land Management(BLM) It was not created by executive order, it cannot be erased by executive order. Only Congress can remove designation as national monument.

It is contentious. Very much so. The Sagebrush Revolution would have more state control and private usage of federal lands. The creation of Bears Ears is seen as a victory for Native Americans in general, and the 5 tribes in particular:

https://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Polit...mericans-new-national-monument-a-rare-victory

Bear Ears contains the greatest concentration of archaeological sites in the entire Southwest. More then all 5 of Utah's national parks combined. A great deal of archaeological looting by artifact collectors, grave robbing, and destruction of petroglyph panels has taken place at Bear Ears. With only two federal employees patrolling the vast property, it is hoped designation through the Antiquities Act of 1906 will result in more manpower to try and protect this incredible national archaeological heritage.

https://www.grandcanyontrust.org/bears-ears-cultural-landscape?gclid=CIHr1cHzm9ECFUuRfgodsUcCkw

Nice video of the monument at this link:

https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2016/12/bears-ears-gold-butte-national-monument-utah-nevada/

There are two sides to this particular designation, some of that is described in the above links. But I'm sure those conservatives and proponents of the Sagebrush Rebellion can speak up for that side. Myself, I clearly side with the 5 tribes and the protection of archaeological heritage and tribal spirituality....
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As usual, dutch has no idea what he is talking about lol.
 
He's just trying to counter what he thinks Trump is going to do/make one last sacrifice to his Agenda 21 Gods. And he would be right in thinking Trump is about to hand a bunch of land back to the West. And that is the ultimate act of decentralization - something Obama and his authoritarian ilk are clearly opposed to. What's Utah's land fed ownership right now? 60ish % or something? I predict it's less than 30 when Trump is done.
 
] The creation of Bears Ears is seen as a victory for Native Americans in general, and the 5 tribes in particular:[/quote]

I can not wait till we turn the entire country back over to the indians an let them fight there old land battles again an let them trade squaws as script.



]Bears Ears contains the greatest concentration of archaeological sites in the entire Southwest. More then all 5 of Utah's national parks combined. A great deal of archaeological looting by artifact collectors, grave robbing, and destruction of petroglyph panels has taken place at Bears Ears. With only two federal employees patrolling the vast property, it is hoped designation through the Antiquities Act of 1906 will result in more manpower to try and protect this incredible national archaeological heritage.[/quote]

So what? Everybody should be allowed to collect artifacts on public land. This is are land not something some special interest group called "native Americans" can claim to own for free. This is government largess, it is welfare. An not to mention they can allow oil drilling an get all the royalties. We all know how that worked out with the free casino money checks

Nice video of the monument at this link:

https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2016/12/bears-ears-gold-butte-national-monument-utah-nevada/

There are two sides to this particular designation, some of that is described in the above links. But I'm sure those conservatives and proponents of the Sagebrush Rebellion can speak up for that side. Myself, I clearly side with the 5 tribes and the protection of archaeological heritage and tribal spirituality....[/QUOTE]
 
BTW you guys are dumb. Obama did this for the oil cartel now they do not need a executive order to drill in Indian territory. This land grab was designed an controlled by big oil an the Indian pawns went along with it for obvious reasons. Follow the money guys it is always about the money.
 
basiclaly he doesnt trust local state government to be responsible and take care of their land themself!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

it is pretty unconstitutional for the government to "own" land.

john locke said so in the federalist papers, the way a republic is preserved
 
would post a nice long article from libertarian constitutional lawyer Krisanne Hall about federal government and owning land. but lefties consider it hate speech. and i already got banend for 6 months for speaking the truth about socialism. so i will not post the clip from krisseanne hall about this. but hey gameface said he is well versed in libertarianism so he might take a chance and post it! the video is from February 2016!
 
Duck Rodgers said:
He's just trying to counter what he thinks Trump is going to do/make one last sacrifice to his Agenda 21 Gods. And he would be right in thinking Trump is about to hand a bunch of land back to the West. And that is the ultimate act of decentralization - something Obama and his authoritarian ilk are clearly opposed to. What's Utah's land fed ownership right now? 60ish % or something? I predict it's less than 30 when Trump is done.
Click to expand...

Duck Rodgers said:
He's just trying to counter what he thinks Trump is going to do/make one last sacrifice to his Agenda 21 Gods. And he would be right in thinking Trump is about to hand a bunch of land back to the West. And that is the ultimate act of decentralization - something Obama and his authoritarian ilk are clearly opposed to. What's Utah's land fed ownership right now? 60ish % or something? I predict it's less than 30 when Trump is done.
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Here's my problem with this line of thinking. With all the gerrymandering, Utahn's don't get their voice heard.

40% of Utah isn't LDS and a lot higher percentage doesn't have much to do with the church (if you go by the stat that only 30% of LDS in Utah attend Church at least once a month, then that puts Utahn's that are active LDS at around 18% of the state's population). Yet, 90% of Utah's legislature is LDS.

Not really representative of Utah, don't you think?

I lived in St. George and realized that my congressman was also over SLC. Weird, right? Why would such a rural place as St. George have to do with a metro area like SLC. How could the congressmen do a good job with both areas, when both areas have such drastically different needs?

Right, this is how:

SLC votes democrat.
St. George votes republican.

So, by putting St. George together with SLC, you can minimize the democrat vote.

Shady as hell. But, mix politics with Utah's god inspired religion, and shady as hell is fantastic.

So, until Utah fixes their districts to more accurately reflect the population, I'm grateful for a little protection from someone other than the LDS Church.

And, I'm active LDS.
 
I don't have a problem with protection for the Bears Ears. But overall the amount of federal ownership of land in the western US is absurd. Especially Utah and Nevada.
 
Boris said:
BTW you guys are dumb. Obama did this for the oil cartel now they do not need a executive order to drill in Indian territory. This land grab was designed an controlled by big oil an the Indian pawns went along with it for obvious reasons. Follow the money guys it is always about the money.
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Red, Rev, and other dreamy progressives, if they really believe in their causes, are the ultimate redneck ignoramuses. Outclassed entirely, intellectually eclipsed by the real interests, the movers and shakers, who use law to eliminate their competitiors but are above the law and lawless players themselves. That is what globalism is all about. Fascist Governance.

That's why "mainstream" controlled media won't hold an Obama, a Hillary, or even a Bush/Romney accountable publicly so long as they comply with the wholesale concentration of power and control under the levers of the real interests they serve.

Archaeologists will be kept out of the sites and we will never know the past that could have been understood. Local ranchers/Mormons and callow cityslicker youths of today would indeed destroy the sites, just as "native Americans" have always done as well, but Obama doesn't care about antiquities any more than street gang thugs.

These places hold coal and oil reserves that David Rockefeller wants locked up, until the day comes that he and his cartel buddies will apply for the rights and get them, and then they will develop the resources whiles local yayhoos hyperventilate about having a job someday.
 
green said:
Here's my problem with this line of thinking. With all the gerrymandering, Utahn's don't get their voice heard.

40% of Utah isn't LDS and a lot higher percentage doesn't have much to do with the church (if you go by the stat that only 30% of LDS in Utah attend Church at least once a month, then that puts Utahn's that are active LDS at around 18% of the state's population). Yet, 90% of Utah's legislature is LDS.

Not really representative of Utah, don't you think?

I lived in St. George and realized that my congressman was also over SLC. Weird, right? Why would such a rural place as St. George have to do with a metro area like SLC. How could the congressmen do a good job with both areas, when both areas have such drastically different needs?

Right, this is how:

SLC votes democrat.
St. George votes republican.

So, by putting St. George together with SLC, you can minimize the democrat vote.

Shady as hell. But, mix politics with Utah's god inspired religion, and shady as hell is fantastic.

So, until Utah fixes their districts to more accurately reflect the population, I'm grateful for a little protection from someone other than the LDS Church.

And, I'm active LDS.
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I think you've logically trapped yourself. There is no real "Mormon" Church, the LDS is owned and manipulated by political progressives who pretend to be conservative, but are not so in fact.

Some Mormons, and a lot of Baptists and Catholics, jackMormons and other little people who don't care to pin a badge on themselves, actually believe in principles of "American" government roughly the image of people having a government they can influence with their vote. A lot of "democrats" have some of those ideas, and people like you, Green.

When you think "Mormon Church" you should draw and equals sign between LDS leadership and Federal land management under cartel or fascist governance. The little Mormons, like Red, and Rev, are just people who believe lies.
 
A national monument benefits the people of Utah. Private usages provides a huge short term benefit to developers with connections to the governor's office.

Win for the regular folks of Utah. Tourism helps our state far far more than developing land in the middle of nowhere.
 
Gameface said:
A national monument benefits the people of Utah. Private usages provides a huge short term benefit to developers with connections to the governor's office.

Win for the regular folks of Utah. Tourism helps our state far far more than developing land in the middle of nowhere.
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yah. Like the tribal reservations were a "win" for natives who once could live anywhere, putting resources under federal locks is a win for Utah little people who will be ready for a low-paying job one day when cartelists invent a national emergency that demands production of the locked resources.

socialism, and property controlled by those who control government, will always reduce living standards for ordinary folks, who used to take care of themselves and their own.
 
jimmy eat jazz said:
Holy sh** but the word to thought ratio is mighty high in this thread.
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ya know, if you think there's a problem, maybe you should show the better way.

With a simple "Duh", anyone can beat your post. 1/0 is what? a big ratio. But the key thing is to actually have a thought, maybe not just propaganda or mindless slogans. I know you can do it if you try.
 
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