Trump vs Pro Athletes

[franklin]

Here's the thing that bothers me about this. THe players are creating resentment and being divisive instead of trying to work toward solutions.

The fact is that African Americans create a disproportionate amount of crime. Of course there is going to be some profiling by police, especially when someone isn't polite and honest with them. The same type of profiling exists in white culture against those who look the part and act the part during police encounters.

Listen to white rapper Yelawolf's song American You (caution - contains the F word a lot). That's how black people often feel and it's how country hillbillies feel too.

The best way for these players to be effective is to push for jobs and jobs training programs targeted at the worst areas of our nation including both urban black areas and rural white hickville. That's a message that everyone should be able to relate to: "help us help ourselves".

 

[DutchJazzer]

Here's the thing that bothers me about this. THe players are creating resentment and being divisive instead of trying to work toward solutions.

The fact is that African Americans create a disproportionate amount of crime. Of course there is going to be some profiling by police, especially when someone isn't polite and honest with them. The same type of profiling exists in white culture against those who look the part and act the part during police encounters.

Listen to white rapper Yelawolf's song American You (caution - contains the F word a lot). That's how black people often feel and it's how country hillbillies feel too.

The best way for these players to be effective is to push for jobs and jobs training programs targeted at the worst areas of our nation including both urban black areas and rural white hickville. That's a message that everyone should be able to relate to: "help us help ourselves".

yelawolf is awesome on of the only few rappers i listen to. you ghained brownie points.


african americans create disporportionate amount of crime, because african americans got the family structure destroyed by years slavery and wellfare thanks to the democrats. thye have no males around to show them how it is done

 

[DutchJazzer]

Well that's embarrassing for you, those aren't opposing headlines.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/nfl-ticket-sales-plummet-179/article/2635955

 

[Ron Mexico]

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/nfl-ticket-sales-plummet-179/article/2635955

Yep, still not opposing statements.

 

[Ron Mexico]

The fact is that African Americans create a disproportionate amount of crime.

And there is a huge part of the problem is that people feel this way.

There color of ones skin has nothing to do with crime rate. Poverty or or issues might but not skin color.

Regardless even crimes that are committed at the same level between different skin colors, like smoking weed, have a very disproportionate rates of arrest.

 

[DutchJazzer]

And there is a huge part of the problem is that people feel this way.

There color of ones skin has nothing to do with crime rate. Poverty or or issues might but not skin color.

Regardless even crimes that are committed at the same level between different skin colors, like smoking weed, have a very disproportionate rates of arrest.

ooh really!


lets face it their are differences between races. otherwise their will be an equal amount of jews and asians as blacks in the nba.

the single mother rate among african ameicans is higher than any other race!
i am not biased or prejudiced against any race, i am just noticing differences, it is no accident that the nab is majority black. while other races dominate other fields!

if you clal it racist i will say the nba is racist because when i was a kid all i wanted to do was play in the nba, but people of my race tend to not be able to outjump other races. that is why i love stockton. i played smart whenever i played basketball, and i had the luck to jhave extreme conditioning and always on the move, so as the games went on, i kept moving while players aorund me got tired. but still not enough to get in the nba!


tl;dr no crime rate ha snothign do do with race. but their are differences. crime rate has to do with upbringing and culture!

 

[LogGrad98]

And there is a huge part of the problem is that people feel this way.

There color of ones skin has nothing to do with crime rate. Poverty or or issues might but not skin color.

Regardless even crimes that are committed at the same level between different skin colors, like smoking weed, have a very disproportionate rates of arrest.

Can you show us some stats backing this up? I mean I have heard both sides of this argument and I would be interested in seeing stats that prove it one way or the other. And real stats, not something with the caveat of "well since white people rule the world half of these crimes were never actually committed" or something, just cold hard numbers would be appreciated. I would take conviction rates maybe, where arrest rates would probably be the most skewed conviction rates would likely be the least skewed, even if we just take it at face value that the numbers are skewed. We could apply some "skew rate" to adjust the numbers. Also, maybe just black on black and white on white crime rates or something. It would be interesting to see.

 

[Ron Mexico]

Can you show us some stats backing this up? I mean I have heard both sides of this argument and I would be interested in seeing stats that prove it one way or the other. And real stats, not something with the caveat of "well since white people rule the world half of these crimes were never actually committed" or something, just cold hard numbers would be appreciated. I would take conviction rates maybe, where arrest rates would probably be the most skewed conviction rates would likely be the least skewed, even if we just take it at face value that the numbers are skewed. We could apply some "skew rate" to adjust the numbers. Also, maybe just black on black and white on white crime rates or something. It would be interesting to see.

https://www.aclu.org/files/assets/aclu-thewaronmarijuana-rel2.pdf

This is a pretty comprehensive report that shows that White and Black people use weed at roughly the same rate but black people are arrested for possession of it 3.73 times more. It is a study from 2001 to 2010.

 

[LogGrad98]

https://www.aclu.org/files/assets/aclu-thewaronmarijuana-rel2.pdf

This is a pretty comprehensive report that shows that White and Black people use weed at roughly the same rate but black people are arrested for possession of it 3.73 times more. It is a study from 2001 to 2010.

So you equate weed use to all other crimes? that's cool i guess, but I don't and I would bet neither do most of the rest of the world. considering weed is gaining widespread popular acceptance this argument is anything but representative of "crime" as a whole. It is an easy way for a cop to harass a black person where the repercussions to the cop if he is called out on it are minimal. How often does this exact scenario play out in violent crime, or property crime, or sexual assaults, etc.

 

[Ron Mexico]

ooh really!


lets face it their are differences between races. otherwise their will be an equal amount of jews and asians as blacks in the nba.

the single mother rate among african ameicans is higher than any other race!
i am not biased or prejudiced against any race, i am just noticing differences, it is no accident that the nab is majority black. while other races dominate other fields!

if you clal it racist i will say the nba is racist because when i was a kid all i wanted to do was play in the nba, but people of my race tend to not be able to outjump other races. that is why i love stockton. i played smart whenever i played basketball, and i had the luck to jhave extreme conditioning and always on the move, so as the games went on, i kept moving while players aorund me got tired. but still not enough to get in the nba!


tl;dr no crime rate ha snothign do do with race. but their are differences. crime rate has to do with upbringing and culture!

It is just as likely you share more in common genetically with someone of a "different race" than someone of "your own race."

We have defined race mostly on things like skin color. We could just as easily assign race based on size of your nose, length of finger, or something else arbitrary and it would carry equal weight.

crime rate has to do with upbringing and culture

Those can be factors but have nothing to do with race as well. They generally have a lot more to do with poverty levels. Again they have nothing to do with your race that is an arbitrary distinction that is meaningless.

 

[Ron Mexico]

So you equate weed use to all other crimes? that's cool i guess, but I don't and I would bet neither do most of the rest of the world. considering weed is gaining widespread popular acceptance this argument is anything but representative of "crime" as a whole. It is an easy way for a cop to harass a black person where the repercussions to the cop if he is called out on it are minimal. How often does this exact scenario play out in violent crime, or property crime, or sexual assaults, etc.

Nope, just a good example of study and what I mentioned before. There are others.

I firmly believe weed should be legal. Despite the fact I dont smoke it and dont really like it I believe it should be legal. Regardless of how I feel about it, it is still a crime most places and every where during this study. The fact we are more relaxed about it as a society gives even more weight to the fact that police arrest people who are black for possession of it almost 4 times more often.

Drugs in general are used about the same amount among white and black people and across the board white people are arrested for it more often.

Other studies are harder to get data for. They do exist and I hope you look into them to see that it is a real problem. But weed use is something people are pretty open about talking about and its easy to track use and arrests for. Most people wont admit even in a survey to more serious crimes like rape and murder, but based on the data we have it is fairly easy to see a correlation to arrests for those crimes. It is also much more likely a black person gets arrested for a crime the did not commit according to data.

 

[DutchJazzer]

https://www.aclu.org/files/assets/aclu-thewaronmarijuana-rel2.pdf

This is a pretty comprehensive report that shows that White and Black people use weed at roughly the same rate but black people are arrested for possession of it 3.73 times more. It is a study from 2001 to 2010.

but whites can hire bette rlawyers. and w eknow when you have a good lawyer you get a better deal

 

[DutchJazzer]

go ahead convince me why hitler is right wing, i am listening.

we can disgard that his party and he are called socialist. jsut as north korea calls it self democratic republic.


but he did have extreme socialist policies, laws and regulation. dispute that!

 

[Gameface]

go ahead convince me why hitler is right wing, i am listening.

we can disgard that his party and he are called socialist. jsut as north korea calls it self democratic republic.


but he did have extreme socialist policies, laws and regulation. dispute that!

What do you think this proves, exactly? Like what the hell would it have to do with 2017 at all?

Do you get that what it means to be a liberal or a conservative changes over time and sometimes they completely flip on specific issues?

 

[Gameface]

You know what, Dutch, forget I asked. You simply try to engage people in an endless game of whack-a-mole where you just pop up one absurd argument after another with no regard at all for the responses you get. Eventually I forget what I even started talking to you about as I've spent several posts whacking your most recent nonsense down.

Have a nice life. Fair winds and following seas.

It'd be weird going through life engaging in conversations without the slightest desire to learn anything from the encounters, but you do you.

 

[LogGrad98]

Nope, just a good example of study and what I mentioned before. There are others.

I firmly believe weed should be legal. Despite the fact I dont smoke it and dont really like it I believe it should be legal. Regardless of how I feel about it, it is still a crime most places and every where during this study. The fact we are more relaxed about it as a society gives even more weight to the fact that police arrest people who are black for possession of it almost 4 times more often.

Drugs in general are used about the same amount among white and black people and across the board white people are arrested for it more often.

Other studies are harder to get data for. They do exist and I hope you look into them to see that it is a real problem. But weed use is something people are pretty open about talking about and its easy to track use and arrests for. Most people wont admit even in a survey to more serious crimes like rape and murder, but based on the data we have it is fairly easy to see a correlation to arrests for those crimes. It is also much more likely a black person gets arrested for a crime the did not commit according to data.

Whatever about weed, yeah it needs to be legal. This does nothing to address the question about crimes committed by different segments of the population. Here is the most basic, wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States

Characteristics of offenders vary from the average for specific types of crimes and specific crimes. In terms of violent crime by gender, in 2011, 80.4% of arrested persons were male and 19.6% were female.[22] Males were 88.2% of those arrested for homicide, while females were 11.8%.[22] Among those arrested for rape in 2011, males were 98.8% and females were 1.2%.[22] For property crime in 2011, 62.9% of arrested persons were male and 37.1% were female.[22]

For violent crime by race in 2011, 59.4% of those arrested were white, 38.3% were black, and 2.2% were of other races.[26] For persons arrested for homicide in 2011, 49.7% were black, 48% were white, and 2.3% were of other races.[26] For persons arrested for rape in 2011, 65% were white, 32.9% were black, and 2.1% were of other races.[26] For property crime in 2011, 68.1% of arrested persons were white, 29.5% were black, and 2.4% were of other races.[26]

In 2011, law enforcement reported 6,222 bias-motivated incidents, known as hate crimes, for which 5,731 offenders were identified.[30] Of these, 59% were white, 20.9% were black, 7.1% were of various races, 1.4% were Asian or Pacific Islanders, 0.8% were Native American, and 10.8% were of unknown race.[30]

Reporting at the annual meeting of the American Sociological Association (August 3, 2008), sociologists at Bowling Green State University found that men who attend college are more likely to commit property crimes during their college years than their non-college-attending peers. The research draws from three waves of data from the National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health and examines education, crime levels, substance abuse and socializing among adolescents and young adults.[31] Also, according to Naci Mocan of the University of Colorado and Erdal Tekin of Georgia State University, "We find that unattractive individuals commit more crime in comparison to average-looking ones, and very attractive individuals commit less crime in comparison to those who are average-looking."[32]

Kind of a weird comment about ugly/attractive people since that tends to be so subjective. However some interesting stuff on the surface. Currently the racial breakdown in American is this:

White 232,943,055 73.6%
Black or African American 39,908,095 12.6%

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demography_of_the_United_States

So whites account for 73% of the population and make up 58% of arrests for violent crime. Blacks make up 12.6% yet make up 38% of arrests for violent crime.

Here is a graph showing homicide convictions from the top wiki article:

There would have to be a SERIOUS level of spin to try to make it out that the rates are actually even. I think it is pretty clear that blacks commit more violent crimes than whites. I would like to see some statistics that prove this to be wrong.


To be clear, I am not making a judgement about a race, just wanting to see the statistics. If anything I think this is a symptom of the fact that we do not do enough to help build up poorer parts of the country, our education system, especially in inner-cities and poor areas, which are disproportionately black, is terrible to say the least, and many other factors we as a society have sorely and shamefully neglected. There are a million reasons for this and few solutions, but that doesn't change the fact that blacks commit crime more frequently than whites, strictly from the numbers.

 

[Ron Mexico]

Whatever about weed, yeah it needs to be legal. This does nothing to address the question about crimes committed by different segments of the population. Here is the most basic, wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States



Kind of a weird comment about ugly/attractive people since that tends to be so subjective. However some interesting stuff on the surface. Currently the racial breakdown in American is this:



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demography_of_the_United_States

So whites account for 73% of the population and make up 58% of arrests for violent crime. Blacks make up 12.6% yet make up 38% of arrests for violent crime.

Here is a graph showing homicide convictions from the top wiki article:

There would have to be a SERIOUS level of spin to try to make it out that the rates are actually even. I think it is pretty clear that blacks commit more violent crimes than whites. I would like to see some statistics that prove this to be wrong.


To be clear, I am not making a judgement about a race, just wanting to see the statistics. If anything I think this is a symptom of the fact that we do not do enough to help build up poorer parts of the country, our education system, especially in inner-cities and poor areas, which are disproportionately black, is terrible to say the least, and many other factors we as a society have sorely and shamefully neglected. There are a million reasons for this and few solutions, but that doesn't change the fact that blacks commit crime more frequently than whites, strictly from the numbers.

I do agree with that last paragraph.

Those are rates of arrested criminals for those crimes. Thats the point of the other study, to find a crime that we can track how much people actually do it and then see who gets arrested for it more often. People with black skin are arrested more, wrongfully accused more, harassed more, stopped more and so on.

Additionally my point still stands that the level of crime has nothing to do with the color of your skin. Just because you are born with a darker pigment of skin does not make you commit more crime. More likely larger things are at play such as poverty levels. Which is my original statement and I will stick by that.

 

[DutchJazzer]

What do you think this proves, exactly? Like what the hell would it have to do with 2017 at all?

Do you get that what it means to be a liberal or a conservative changes over time and sometimes they completely flip on specific issues?

conservative mean conserve the way of live. a conservative in middle east wants to conserve the stupid sharia law system and islamic political syustem.

a conservative in the usa is different, he wants to conserve the constittution and liberty!

i know it is different! i posted this in the wrong thread it wa ssupposed to be posted in the trump white house in general sports!

so socialist policies change over time? because the discusion in their was that hitler calls himself a socialist, he worte socialist drivel. and he almost exclusively passed socialist laws, regulations, policies and programs. and to this days those are still considered socilaist and extreme left wing!

universal healthcare for all! SOCIALIST
gun control socialist! if not left wing
free education! socialist and communistic
passing comprehensive environmental laws protection and regulation! socialist!
mandatory unions! maybe not socialist but left wing
Confiscating wealth and setting up state owned factories! communistic if not socialist but definitely left wing


so yeah! their are 14 yeears of hitler polciies, laws regulations and programs that are considered left wing/socilaist/ and communistic till this day!

 

[BTP]

With those crime and racism debates, I am always baffled how much attention ppl like to spend to statistics, and not just use those statistics to discuss what could be causing them.

 

[DutchJazzer]

With those crime and racism debates, I am always baffled how much attention ppl like to spend to statistics, and not just use those statistics to discuss what could be causing them.

breakdown of the "traditional" family