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Central tank command : the official thread

yamers said:
nobody likes the truth, i know. We need talent or we're going to be stuck in limbo for ever.
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Yup, there is no difference between facing the Rockets and Cavs on the road and facing the Mavs and Bobcats on the road. Totally...
 
Stoked said:
Correct, I was thinking "after December" my bad. Point still stands. Schedule gets much easier starting in January.
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It gets a little easier. Only 4 of the 13 opponents are under .500. And 3 of those 4 are on the road, where we have utterly sucked.
 
Stoked said:
Yup, there is no difference between facing the Rockets and Cavs on the road and facing the Mavs and Bobcats on the road. Totally...
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Difference between losing by 30 and losing by 10. A loss is still a loss. Jazz have been horrible on the road against ALL teams. January schedule is easier in terms of caliber of opponents, but 8 of 13 games are on the road. So don't worry, Jazz should still have a losing record in January.
 
Jack Strop said:
Difference between losing by 30 and losing by 10. A loss is still a loss. Jazz have been horrible on the road against ALL teams. January schedule is easier in terms of caliber of opponents, but 8 of 13 games are on the road. So don't worry, Jazz should still have a losing record in January.
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But not enough to truly be tanking. Jazz have sucked on the road but easier opponents means they will win more frequently.
 
Wes Mantooth said:
He's right though. We're not that good. Just because we play, say, the Lakers or the Hornets, doesn't mean it's even close to an automatic win.
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lmfao, the Jazz are playing NBA teams so yes, they can lose any individual game. But again, the quality of opponents going down = more Jazz wins. I'm not arguing a 7 game win streak or anything. Just that the Jazz will win more than they did in December and that it'll keep any notions of "truly tanking" dead.
 
Stoked said:
lmfao, the Jazz are playing NBA teams so yes, they can lose any individual game. But again, the quality of opponents going down = more Jazz wins. I'm not arguing a 7 game win streak or anything. Just that the Jazz will win more than they did in December and that it'll keep any notions of "truly tanking" dead.
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If we go 0-6 or 1-5 over the next six, will you join the dark side?
 
Wes Mantooth said:
If we go 0-6 or 1-5 over the next six, will you join the dark side?
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No, because the Jazz will end up winning 7 in March and 6 in February or some such crap. Sure a high draft pick would be awesome. But the Jazz won't do what it takes.

Also if the Jazz are going to fully tank than just losing games isn't enough for me. Turn some of these players into picks and other assets. Favors, Burks, Udoh, Jerebko, Rubio... no half assing. Try to win them all or go whole hog in on the dark side. That's not the Jazz though...
 
The worst team in the NBA has 9 wins. The next level is 11 wins. We have won 15 games while trying to win. If our injuries and poor play continue, we dont have to try to lose to be in top lottery contention.

Sent from my VS995 using JazzFanz mobile app
 
LoPo said:
The worst team in the NBA has 9 wins. The next level is 11 wins. We have won 15 games while trying to win. If our injuries and poor play continue, we dont have to try to lose to be in top lottery contention.

Sent from my VS995 using JazzFanz mobile app
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There is a cluster of teams and I could see Charlotte and Memphis getting it together with Batum and Conley getting healthy. We are 2 games out of the 6 spot. There is a real opportunity to tank the eff out of this B... and we will 100% not have the Cajones to do it.

We are as close to the bottom as we are to the playoffs. Definition of stuck in the middle. What would we have to trade to move from #13-14 in the lotto to #6-7? Plus the small chance that you land a superstar like Doncic... I think we are dumb for chasing the playoffs... there I said it.
 
Maybe we are tanking...

Keep running out the Rudy, Favs, Rubio... add in a finished Joe Jesus... sit Thabo at random... Jonas with the short leash. Tank recipe.

Let's say we moved Thabo, Favs, maybe Hood and just got draft capital or offloaded cap cloggers like Rubio or AB, but no really good players coming back could we be a few games worse than the Suns, Kings, Hornets, Brooklyn, Lakers... I think we could.

It's tank SZN.... let's do this!
 
LoPo said:
If we traded Favors and Thabo while bringing back Gobert slowly (which we should do anyway to make sure he has a long, healthy career), I think we would have a top 8 pick.
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So instead of choosing between Knox, Carter, Walker we'd be picking from Sexton, Mikal B, Miles B., maybe Trae Young. To move from 13-14 to 7-8 it would cost us at least a first maybe more. Maybe Bamba is there and you can move him and slide back down while collecting a premium.

It's so close right now and there are some teams below us that are much better than their records when healthy. There are a couple teams that have no incentive to tank, and there are some teams that are so poorly run they will eff up their tanks... looking at you Sacramento and Phoenix.

Add in the assets you can collect in selling off stuff and its just a no brainer for me. I know it effects the players in season, but the long term affects of tanking are completely overstated. GSW tanked about as hard as anyone could and Klay and Steph seem to be okay.
 
I hear you HH. I just want to label it as "getting assets for guys we are going to lose anyway". Favors isn't staying. He shouldn't for his or our sake. JoeJ should retire or go be a specialist vet on a contender. Same exact thing goes for Thabo.
 
Trade everyone for anything of value/shed salary outside of Mitchell /Gobert + Exum/Ingles/Hood/Bradley (unless someone overpays). Favors + our depth is what is currently keeping us afloat. Without it, I could see us finishing in the top 10. Also, if I'm not mistaken, freeing salary would enable us to pursue J.Parker/etc in the off-season.

Making the playoffs is always ideal but winning a championship is the long-term goal & while talented, our current roster is clearly not championship caliber. It could have the potential to be down the line but IMO it would be extremely short-sighted not to take advantage of the opportunity to add a possible 3rd elite young talent. As well as not heavily pursue Parker.

These decisions could be the difference between consistent contention & multiple finals appearances/(hopefully) victories. IMO we're one more dynamic player away from being a potential powerhouse/dynasty.

Draft position isn't the end-all as far as finding talent but it would be to our's & DL's advantage for him to have as large of a draft pool as possible, as well as be in a good position to move up (if necessary). The difference between the chance of finding a stud at #7/8 vs #14/15 is much higher than the chances of this year's team winning the championship.
 
LoPo said:
I hear you HH. I just want to label it as "getting assets for guys we are going to lose anyway". Favors isn't staying. He shouldn't for his or our sake. JoeJ should retire or go be a specialist vet on a contender. Same exact thing goes for Thabo.
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I think Thabo has a ton of value... like more than Favs... easy contract to move... cheap second year... fits on every team basically.

I wouldn't trade him unless he was part of a deal for a first... won't get a first by himself I think unless someone really thinks they can beat the Warriors or Cavs.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I think Thabo has a ton of value... like more than Favs... easy contract to move... cheap second year... fits on every team basically.

I wouldn't trade him unless he was part of a deal for a first... won't get a first by himself I think unless someone really thinks they can beat the Warriors or Cavs.
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The Cavs have a $5.8 million exception from the Kyrie trade. They could trade us their 2018 1st for Thabo and our 2nd pretty easily. That's a win, win trade for both of us I think. It would make them pay a ton more in luxury tax, but Gilbert said he's not worried about that right now.
 
LoPo said:
The Cavs have a $5.8 million exception from the Kyrie trade. They could trade us their 2018 1st for Thabo and our 2nd pretty easily. That's a win, win trade for both of us I think. It would make them pay a ton more in luxury tax, but Gilbert said he's not worried about that right now.
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He's lying... that'd be like $20M more in LT in addition to salary. I could see Thabo/Udoh for Shump and a first... saves them a bunch and they can cut Rose to get the roster spot... gives them an excuse to move on.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
He's lying... that'd be like $20M more in LT in addition to salary. I could see Thabo/Udoh for Shump and a first... saves them a bunch and they can cut Rose to get the roster spot... gives them an excuse to move on.
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They aren't trading Shumpert unless they get a really good player for him. Cleveland lacks perimeter defenders so they can't trade one to get somebody like Thabo.

We could always trade Thabo for Osman and a couple nonguaranteed two way type contracts ($800,000 per year types). They wouldn't have that big of a luxury hit but they lose Osman. I doubt we can get the first in that deal.
 
LoPo said:
They aren't trading Shumpert unless they get a really good player for him. Cleveland lacks perimeter defenders so they can't trade one to get somebody like Thabo.

We could always trade Thabo for Osman and a couple nonguaranteed two way type contracts ($800,000 per year types). They wouldn't have that big of a luxury hit but they lose Osman. I doubt we can get the first in that deal.
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I have heard they want him gone. He would save them money next year. He isn't durable and isn't the lock down guy people think he was at one time. I think they'd see it as a huge bonus... plus Thabo gives them what he is supposed to, but he's a smarter player.
 
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