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Utah Trade Deadline Discussion

SCS said:
This was probably brought up yesterday but I missed it. Is there any reason why the following trade doesn't work?

Pelicans get: Derrick Favors
Bulls get: Omer Asik and the Pelicans 1st
Jazz get: Nikola Mirotic

The Pelicans want a serviceable big to help keep them in the playoff hunt with Boogie out. But they don't want to be locked into the second year Mirotic has with his team option. So they get Favors instead.

The Bulls get the 1st round pick that they want for Mirotic.

The Jazz get the stretch 4 they want and are fine with the Bulls picking up his team option for next year before he's dealt.

Mirotic gets his contract picked up like he wants and he ends up in his preferred destination.

Seems like a win-win-win-win for all parties. The only thing I can think of is maybe NO doesn't want Favs for whatever reason?
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Was discussed and yup makes sense... not sure which team if any would hold that trade up.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
There will be a move but I think we are holding out for best return. Likely have fall back deals in place.

With all the injuries it makes sense to wait. Favs would not have been a great add for NO last week but now he would be very important.

Patience is good as long as our trade assets stay healthy.
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Good post and so true.
 
infection said:
I think that's a common narrative that comes up, though (not from you, just in general), about "not making a trade just to make a trade." There are often valid reasons to make a trade and many not-valid, and the FO (under KOC, really) pushed back saying he wouldn't make a trade to make a trade. I'm not desperate for a trade -- but I am desperate for us to make a move to pick up a stretch four and there's really only one available right now. Favors should be moved, even if it's for a second round pick, but I'm not certain how optimistic I am about any moves happening, really.
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Yeah it has definitely been used in the past by KOC and the media. I think DL is a much better GM than KOC so I'm ok with giving him the benefit of the doubt for now. I think he's made mostly logical moves before this season. This year is the first one where it seems like they really need to make a couple moves at the deadline. If he doesn't make any I think it will be a failure. Like you said he should at the very least move Favors and JJ (even if it's just buying him out).
 
Ive always liked Favors and placed the blame on Snyder for not using an offense that highlighted Gobert and Favors together. Whipping GS last night showed they could impose their style on all other teams than being a copycat to GS and Houston 's style which Jazz aren't as good as BUT

if Jazz are to be copycats than a pkg of Favors for Mirotic would change the Jazz look

AND pkging

Hood for Stanley Johnson (Detroit) OR Mario Hezonja (Orlando) would bring some super athleticism on the perimeter with Exum and DM
 
I think Favors can be a part of the future here. I don't think it's likely at this point, but I'd try to resign him. That doesn't mean that you don't go out and get Niko... we've got Hood, Burks, and JJ that we can use for that. All good teams need 3 bigs anyways.
 
David Stern said:
I think Favors can be a part of the future here. I don't think it's likely at this point, but I'd try to resign him. That doesn't mean that you don't go out and get Niko... we've got Hood, Burks, and JJ that we can use for that. All good teams need 3 bigs anyways.
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I think we could keep Favors here, but I do feel like we would keep him for one main reason - Gobert insurance. If we feel that Gobert may be an injury prone player, it's okay to invest $10ish per year in another big who works best at center. However, if we feel that Gobert will be here most of the time, don't spend around $10 million on a guy who can't share the floor with him much in the playoffs.

I'm pretty sure I posted this before; about 80% of the bad contracts in the NBA are big men who just don't live up to their contracts. The list is massive: Mahinmi, Biyombo, Noah, Leonard, TT, Asik, Jefferson, Faried, Lopez, Plumlee, Teletovic, Chandler, and more. I'm not saying that Favors is as bad, worse or better than those guys, but they are considered bad contracts because the money could be spent better elsewhere on the roster. This is a wing driven league and spending $10+ on a back up big in the playoffs can destroy a team's chances.
 
tleikheen said:
Ive always liked Favors and placed the blame on Snyder for not using an offense that highlighted Gobert and Favors together. Whipping GS last night showed they could impose their style on all other teams than being a copycat to GS and Houston 's style which Jazz aren't as good as BUT

if Jazz are to be copycats than a pkg of Favors for Mirotic would change the Jazz look

AND pkging

Hood for Stanley Johnson (Detroit) OR Mario Hezonja (Orlando) would bring some super athleticism on the perimeter with Exum and DM
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Don't recall Gobert and Favors playing together other then the first and third quarters


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Despite Favors being a much better offensive player than Udoh, I think we'd be a lot more elite with Udoh as the primary backup if we had someone like Niko. Jerebko/Udoh could do a pretty good poor man's Niko/Gobert.
 
I like that people that think that they are bolder and more strategically competent than the dude who flipped Trey Lyles and a pick in the 20's for the best player in last year's draft. DL knows who is available and what they cost and if that is a price that we want to pay. The ONLY times he makes mistakes is when he had to take 3rd party morons into account (Trey Burke for Corbin, stuff to make Hayward happy.)

Just trading to appease those of us who "want to see something happen" would be the absolute worst case of humoring third party morons. I say this as someone who would like to see a trade.
 
hgb said:
Maybe both us and the Pels are skeptical about helping a rival? We're fighting for the same playoff spot, after all.
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Nah... I think we have a better chance getting Denver tbh. I don't think teams put a ton of stock in that when trading non-stars.

We better not hold up a deal because of that... Niko could be a good long-term piece. Favs would help them fo sure and help them clear space. I think we want them to re-sign Cousins because it will destroy their team and they will have to trade AD at some point.
 
LoPo said:
This guy is a reporter who is quoting sources:
Ryan McDonald @ryanwmcdonald
about 44 minutes ago

Atlanta, Boston and Philadelphia are the teams that have multiple first-round picks both this year and next. All three have been mentioned as possible destinations for Rodney Hood. Seems like any of them are in position to be involved with a Nikola Mirotic deal
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This guy is indeed a reporter. I have no reason to believe that he's someone with NBA sources, however. And even if he does have some, there's no indication that he's relying on them in this text. The more likely explanation is that, like you and me, he's read around on the Internet and tried to figure out possible landing spots for Hood with the idea that ideally he might bring a first in a trade.
 
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infection said:
I think the problem we have is a repeating pattern of:

Training camp: We'll move them at the deadline when they have value to a contender.
Deadline: We'll move them on draft night.
Draft night: We'll move them when FA opens up.
Training camp: We'll move them at the deadline when they're a valuable expiring.
Deadline: They'll be more valuable after we re-sign them and we can move them at the deadline.
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You say this like it's a problem unique to the Jazz. It isn't. It's inherent in the nature of the NBA with its ever fluid markets involving a small number of total assets, each rather unique and unpredictable.

I'm not arguing that DL is the best in the league, but I'm quite confident that we have a good GM who generally makes appropriate moves at appropriate times.
 
idiot said:
You say this like it's a problem unique to the Jazz. It isn't. It's inherent in the nature of the NBA with its ever fluid markets involving a small number of total assets, each rather unique and unpredictable.

I'm not arguing that DL is the best in the league, but I'm quite confident that we have a good GM who generally makes appropriate moves at appropriate times.
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I don't think it's a phenomenon exclusive to us. What I'm pointing out is it's a very weak argument of rationalization when it comes up. Also, I'm on record saying I think DL is an elite GM and probably top three. He, like any of the reset of us humans, has blind-spots, biases, and faults. The fact that he's landed Gobert and Mitchell doesn't mean that he executes every move with precision and exactness. It's funny that we critique players on what they do, while we still like them, but somehow there's a huge appeal to authority with FOs (again not a Utah phenomenon) where we rationalize their moves through something akin to Papal infallibility.
 
I find it a little strange that we're beginning to get bent out of shape 8 days (and longer) before the trade deadline itself. We may end up being disappointed in the lack of moves, but that's something that is yet to be determined. We all should know by now that most NBA deadline trades are still to come, yeah?
 
infection said:
I don't think it's a phenomenon exclusive to us. What I'm pointing out is it's a very weak argument of rationalization when it comes up. Also, I'm on record saying I think DL is an elite GM and probably top three. He, like any of the reset of us humans, has blind-spots, biases, and faults. The fact that he's landed Gobert and Mitchell doesn't mean that he executes every move with precision and exactness. It's funny that we critique players on what they do, while we still like them, but somehow there's a huge appeal to authority with FOs (again not a Utah phenomenon) where we rationalize their moves through something akin to Papal infallibility.
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There is a very significant difference in evaluating players and front offices though. Excepting things like unknown nagging injuries, personal life issues, etc., we get to see everything about players' performances on the court. We can see how they play with others -- both with and against, see their shooting and playmaking abilities, etc. The data is there, and we can put together a pretty complete picture.

The situation couldn't be any different when it comes to evaluating front office moves. As much as we like to think we know (myself absolutely included), we really probably don't even have 10% of the information that is being worked with. No idea what trades are available, being discussed, etc.

So, I don't think there's any kind of "papal infallibility" being credited to the front office, but at a certain point we can't critique too hard, just because we simply don't know what there is to work with.
 
infection said:
I think the problem we have is a repeating pattern of:

Training camp: We'll move them at the deadline when they have value to a contender.
Deadline: We'll move them on draft night.
Draft night: We'll move them when FA opens up.
Training camp: We'll move them at the deadline when they're a valuable expiring.
Deadline: They'll be more valuable after we re-sign them and we can move them at the deadline.
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So in the same quandary as virtually every other team.
 
idiot said:
I find it a little strange that we're beginning to get bent out of shape 8 days (and longer) before the trade deadline itself. We may end up being disappointed in the lack of moves, but that's something that is yet to be determined. We all should know by now that most NBA deadline trades are still to come, yeah?
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I wouldn't be heartbroken over no moves, but what would (and does) bother me is our fairly apathetic attitude toward landing a key piece on the market.
 
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