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Williams, Sloan put the past where it belongs

Kyoto said:
It was who was/is better at this stage of their careers. NOT who would be better suited in today's NBA.

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If you're comparing players of different eras and asking who is better, asking yourself how each would do in the other's era is kind of important. Gobert would be better than Eaton in Eaton's era and Eaton couldnt hang in Gobert's. Therefor Gobert > Eaton.

Gobert would be better than Eaton in Eaton's era and Eaton couldnt compete in Gobert's, therefore he is better.
 
dalamon said:
bullseye.

I like this, Deron was in the wrong and it's super obvious that he knows he ****ed up. There isn't anything more he can do at this point. I'd clap for him at the next game.
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I think you can separate what he did for us that was good and the way he ended his time here. If I hung out with him over a night of drinking I'd congratulate him on his great times but on about the tenth drink I'd probably let it slip that he turned into a douchebag for a while there.
 
Deron should be strong enough to play small-ball stretch four, no? Let's clear out some roster room.
 
JimLes said:
You know what's way easier than apologizing? Not doing stupid **** in the first place.

It may be Yom Kippur tomorrow, but I don't know if I believe in atonement. Or forgiveness. I'm also not sure what exactly Williams did her to deserve forgiveness. Words are cheap.
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This is just stupid, man. Williams swallowed his pride and expressed sincere regret in person. Sloan is a wealthy guy in his final years, still hard-nosed to the end, but willing to meet with D-Will and depart on good terms. He's more mature and has the benefit of hindsight to see his missteps.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
If you're comparing players of different eras and asking who is better, asking yourself how each would do in the other's era is kind of important. Gobert would be better than Eaton in Eaton's era and Eaton couldnt hang in Gobert's. Therefor Gobert > Eaton.

Gobert would be better than Eaton in Eaton's era and Eaton couldnt compete in Gobert's, therefore he is better.
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You're an idiot

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Great article. It's awesome to hear that they cleared the air and settled their differences. I never blamed Deron for what happened. Both guys were fierce competitors with incredibly stubborn attitudes. Two guys like that are bound to butt heads at times. There's no doubt that Deron pushed Jerry's buttons and did some things he probably shouldn't have done. But I think at that point in his career Jerry was just to tired to deal with it too. Its sad the way things ended but I'm happy they're working towards putting it in the past. Hopefully Deron will be around at Jazz games/events more often. Would be cool to see Jazz fans cheer him.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
How else do you suggest we compare Eaton and Gobert?
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You cant compare different players from different eras. If Malone was drafted today, he would have already developed a 3pt shot and would probably be a stretch 4 or 5. Players from different eras developed different skills optimized for their competition. By just saying, "oh gobert would fit in both eras but Eaton wouldn't" is just stupid.

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JimLes said:
Gotta love the historical revisionism here. The over-the-hill, already demented, didn't-like-the-three, hall-of-fame coach had us at 27-13 and on pace to win 55 games before Deron checked out and a few weeks later ultimately caused all the **** he caused. Tied for third in the west and 5 games ahead of the NY Knicks, coached by that modern-day Naismith and inventor of the three point shot(and a 0-time NBA champion) Mike D'Antoni.

The Jazz at that point were 17th in the league in 3PA and 18th in 3PM. Solidly middle of the pack. The Jazz were also 8th in the league in opponent 3P%.

But yeah, let's all remember how the Jazz were playing a 4-corners offense back in 2011.
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Keep in mind Williams himself has never gone out and said Sloan was washed up and should have retired. And in this recent instance he still praised the coach. Williams showed great maturity here. Good for him. Jazz Nation should welcome him back.
 
Kyoto said:
You cant compare different players from different eras. If Malone was drafted today, he would have already developed a 3pt shot and would probably be a stretch 4 or 5. Players from different eras developed different skills optimized for their competition. By just saying, "oh gobert would fit in both eras but Eaton wouldn't" is just stupid.

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We cant compare players from different eras? This is news to me.
 
LifeOnaPlate said:
Keep in mind Williams himself has never gone out and said Sloan was washed up and should have retired. And in this recent instance he still praised the coach. Williams showed great maturity here. Good for him. Jazz Nation should welcome him back.
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Again, sorry if I find apologies self-serving. Vast majority of them are. From you apologizing to your little brother for pushing them so your mum wouldn't ground you, to politicians apologizing for any number of misdeeds. I don't think Williams is apologizing for Jerry's sake, but for his own sake. That's just how people are. I find it hard to believe sudden changes of heart. Just like I don't believe that Tim Hardaway is suddenly a friend to the gay community. If Williams really wanted to apologize, it wouldn't have taken Steve Starks calling him and suggesting it. He knows how to contact the Jazz. This just reeks of someone trying to apologize to a dying man to make themselves feel better.

And you ought to remember that this set the Jazz as an organization back a decade. A player refusing to acknowledge the basic concept that players play and coaches coach and nothing good ever comes out of trying to mess with that. Especially in a situation where the freaking team has a .675 record. The team won 53 games in 2010. They were on a pace to win roughly that many in 2011 before Williams decided to stage his rebellion. If luck with injuries serves us, we may win 53 again this year. 9 years later, and almost a decade of rebuild later. Think about it. That's a quarter of this franchise's history in Utah.

And while you and Williams try to pin what happened on youth(I love apologies where someone says they were young and/or stupid), he was 26 at the time. He was also the the leader of the team. Or he was supposed to be, anyway. Rudy is our current captain. Compare and contrast. And I hate this idea that as long as you offer an apology(contrite, no less!), forgiveness should follow. I think certain things can't be undone. A decade in the wilderness for our franchise is one of those things. We all make choices and we have to live with them. I still don't think Williams realizes how much damage he did. He just feels bad that his career went off the rails and that he has no home, in basketball terms, anymore. Oh, and that people blame him for making the last season of a HOF coach's career a sad spectacle.
 
Kyoto said:
You cant compare different players from different eras. If Malone was drafted today, he would have already developed a 3pt shot and would probably be a stretch 4 or 5. Players from different eras developed different skills optimized for their competition. By just saying, "oh gobert would fit in both eras but Eaton wouldn't" is just stupid.

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There is absolutely no chance in hell that Eaton could have developed the foot speed to compete in this era. It isn't a matter of optimization... or era... or anything else. There are physical limitations that are insurmountable.
 
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