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Favs Replacements

infection said:
What if, instead of trading Burks and two second rounders for Korver, we had just traded Exum?
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Sigh

That trade was particularly painful. If we could’ve unloaded Exum for a bag of Doritos earlier this year I would’ve celebrated. Sigh

I truly wonder if the Exum debacle will hinder the Mitchell/Gobert era much like the AK47 contract hindered the Dwill/Boozer/Okur era.

Sigh
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Sure, but saying his contract has the same impact as AK's contract?

Exum is in no way standing in the FO way of putting together a championship team.
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It sounds like you need to exercise your ignore function, because I'm not seeing those posts.
 
The Thriller said:
Sigh

I truly wonder if the Exum debacle will hinder the Mitchell/Gobert era much like the AK47 contract hindered the Dwill/Boozer/Okur era.

Sigh
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Saint Cy of JFC said:
Sure, but saying his contract has the same impact as AK's contract?

Exum is in no way standing in the FO way of putting together a championship team.
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Yup, no way Exum's contract is crippling he franchise or limiting its options the way AK's maximum contract did. Exum has only two more years left and the money is basically what you pay to mid-level players. To say it hinders the DM/Gobert era is a complete reach.
 
latin jazz said:
Yup, no way Exum's contract is crippling he franchise or limiting its options the way AK's maximum contract did. Exum has only two more years left and the money is basically what you pay to mid-level players. To say it hinders the DM/Gobert era is a complete reach.
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1. And in 2 years won’t Mitchell be commanding a max contract? So we receive relief from exum’s contract but then have to pay out of our *** to just retain Mitchell.

2. Mid-level contract players typically play and play effectively. Dante rarely plays and when he’s healthy enough to play, never plays effectively. So we’re essentially playing someone a mid-level contract who contributes less to our team than the cracker-jack sales boy in section HH.
 
The Thriller said:
1. And in 2 years won’t Mitchell be commanding a max contract? So we receive relief from exum’s contract but then have to pay out of our *** to just retain Mitchell.

2. Mid-level contract players typically play and play effectively. Dante rarely plays and when he’s healthy enough to play, never plays effectively. So we’re essentially playing someone a mid-level contract who contributes less to our team than the cracker-jack sales boy in section HH.
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1. Unlike AK's contract, Exum's runs out just when we have to extend Rudy's and DM's. Quite different than AK's, which ran along DWill, Boozer and Okur's, crippling our ability to retain Wes Matthews and acquire other players.

2. Again, even injured, a mid-level contract doesn't affect your cap as a max-level player. Exum's accounted for 9% of the salary cap in 2018, AK's for about 31% in 2010. Apples & oranges.
 
latin jazz said:
1. Unlike AK's contract, Exum's runs out just when we have to extend Rudy's and DM's. Quite different than AK's, which ran along DWill, Boozer and Okur's, crippling our ability to retain Wes Matthews and acquire other players.

2. Again, even injured, a mid-level contract doesn't affect your cap as a max-level player. Exum's accounted for 9% of the salary cap in 2018, AK's for about 31% in 2010. Apples & oranges.
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Except, right now our best window might be during these next two years. Two years that’ll have a midlevel contract wasted on a player who won’t play or when he’s healthy won’t play effectively.

I can already think of more than a few players we could’ve signed last summer that would’ve improved our team. Instead, we wasted a contract on Exum. Won’t get anything out of him while he’s here. And are unable to dump him for nothing.
 
The Thriller said:
Except, right now our best window might be during these next two years. Two years that’ll have a midlevel contract wasted on a player who won’t play or when he’s healthy won’t play effectively.

I can already think of more than a few players we could’ve signed last summer that would’ve improved our team. Instead, we wasted a contract on Exum. Won’t get anything out of him while he’s here. And are unable to dump him for nothing.
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Not arguing about our window but you are portraying Exum's contract like its untradeable and an albatross, to the point of comparing it to AK's contract, which ran for 5 years and became impossible to move. Exum is making mid-level money (9.6M a year plus incentives) and it only has 2 years left. It can be included in other deals this offseason (i.e Conley) or wait and see if he outplays his salary (unlikely but possible). In any case, we will have salary space to sign a max player this offseason, regardless of Exum's contract as it accounts for less than 10% of our salary cap. That was impossible with AK's deal some years ago. You can argue wether or not Exum's is a bust, but comparing his contract to AK's (and their respective impact and opportunity cost) is just ludicrous.

Furthermore, you are blaming Exum for not signing other free agents the previous offseason. You realize we didn't have cap space to begin with right? (unless we gutted half of our team). Just think about how much Udoh and Thabo made combined (yeah, more than Exum). Both Exum and Favors were signed by using their bird rights. In that case, blame DL for not being able to bring guys on bargain deals, like NBelly, but we are not even sure those FA were willing to play in Utah for less than mid-level money anyway.
 
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Here's some comps on some of the other playoff teams that are roughly around Exum's $9.1

GSW: Shaun Livingston, G $8.3
POR: Mo Harkless F, Myers Leonard, C $10.3-5
TOR: Danny Green G, $10; Fred Van Vleet PG, $8.6
MIL: Tony Snell G, $10.6

A few others:
BOS: Marcus Smart G, $11.1
HOU: Iman Shumpert G, $11; PJ Tucker F, $7.9
DEN: Will Barton G, $11.8
OKC: Andre Roberson G, $10; Jerami Grant F, $8.6

All guys that are expected to (and do) make an impact off the bench and stay healthy. Those are production comps vs the usual position comps.
 
Grimmetal said:
Here's some comps on some of the other playoff teams that are roughly around Exum's $9.1

GSW: Shaun Livingston, G $8.3
POR: Mo Harkless F, Myers Leonard, C $10.3-5
TOR: Danny Green G, $10; Fred Van Vleet PG, $8.6
MIL: Tony Snell G, $10.6

A few others:
BOS: Marcus Smart G, $11.1
HOU: Iman Shumpert G, $11; PJ Tucker F, $7.9
DEN: Will Barton G, $11.8
OKC: Andre Roberson G, $10; Jerami Grant F, $8.6

All guys that are expected to (and do) make an impact off the bench and stay healthy. Those are production comps vs the usual position comps.
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Haha Roberson?

I get where you’re going, and valid point. But Roberson hasn’t played a game in like 16 months, player.
 
Grimmetal said:
Here's some comps on some of the other playoff teams that are roughly around Exum's $9.1

GSW: Shaun Livingston, G $8.3
POR: Mo Harkless F, Myers Leonard, C $10.3-5
TOR: Danny Green G, $10; Fred Van Vleet PG, $8.6
MIL: Tony Snell G, $10.6

A few others:
BOS: Marcus Smart G, $11.1
HOU: Iman Shumpert G, $11; PJ Tucker F, $7.9
DEN: Will Barton G, $11.8
OKC: Andre Roberson G, $10; Jerami Grant F, $8.6

All guys that are expected to (and do) make an impact off the bench and stay healthy. Those are production comps vs the usual position comps.
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This is a great example of confirmation bias. You can also make a long list of NBA players with similar salaries who doesn't contribute anything to their team (you think Portland is happy by paying 16.4M to Turner? what about 30M to Haywood?).

And lol at Andre Roberson who hasn't played in more than a year. Also lol at Shumpert (3.6pts on terrible shooting), Livingston (who has declined to the point of being almost unplayable - averaging 3pts during the playoffs-). BTW, Smart basically missed the playoffs due to injury. And Snell is not playing despite being healthy (0.6 pts on 3MPG in garbage time). Harkless is mediocre and has missed about 20 games in each of the last two season due to injuries to his knees/ankles. Leonard is overpaid.

So to the point: you want players whose contribution exceed their salaries (or are equal/close to it). Think of Royce, Crowder and some of the examples you gave (Barton, Tucker, Grant, Green). But every team have examples of bad salaries in their roster too (already mentioned).

In Exum's case, I'm amazed and how easily people blame him as the culprit for not bringing quality free agents. Why not Thabo or Udoh?. And more importantly, we didn't even have cap space last offseason, unless we renounced the bird rights/declined player options of half our team. Also, it was believed we would only consider that route if the right FA committed to our team (remember the timing of the player options), such as Paul George. That was very unlikely. And since no big free agent committed, DL brought the same team.
 
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My problem with Exum is not that we kept him, but that we did so for three years instead of a 2 year (2nd not guaranteed) deal like we did with Favors. We clearly like Derrick and want to keep him. Without the Exum and Korver contracts, the Jazz would start out with a max slot - even with Favors being kept. Now they either have to get rid of him, or they have to attach assets to move Exum. Granted, they need to convince someone to come first. . . but pundits have started to include the Jazz as a FA destination - it would be nice to have the flexibility to follow through.
 
Ellis269 said:
My problem with Exum is not that we kept him, but that we did so for three years instead of a 2 year (2nd not guaranteed) deal like we did with Favors. We clearly like Derrick and want to keep him. Without the Exum and Korver contracts, the Jazz would start out with a max slot - even with Favors being kept. Now they either have to get rid of him, or they have to attach assets to move Exum. Granted, they need to convince someone to come first. . . but pundits have started to include the Jazz as a FA destination - it would be nice to have the flexibility to follow through.
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would old-school rep the **** outta this post
 
Ellis269 said:
My problem with Exum is not that we kept him, but that we did so for three years instead of a 2 year (2nd not guaranteed) deal like we did with Favors. We clearly like Derrick and want to keep him. Without the Exum and Korver contracts, the Jazz would start out with a max slot - even with Favors being kept. Now they either have to get rid of him, or they have to attach assets to move Exum. Granted, they need to convince someone to come first. . . but pundits have started to include the Jazz as a FA destination - it would be nice to have the flexibility to follow through.
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Yeah interesting that they always preached financial flexibility and now when we desperately need they flexibility we have screwed ourselves out of it.

I'm sorry but DL is a failure. I think he was promoted to get him out of the decision making role because the jazz organization doesn't generally fire people.
 
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