Jazz and Knicks discussing Donovan Mitchell trade per Shams Charania and Tony Jones

[Handlogten's Heros]

Pretty much where I’m at. The Knicks aren’t including Barrett and now they only want to include 2 1sts and Knicks fans were still complaining about that Andy trade when it was terrible lmao. At this point tell them you’re going to take the Miami offer and make them beat it. If they don’t and it comes out they had the chance to I think Leon Rose could be packing his bags (he’s trash regardless of what happens). The one saving grace for us is James Dolan is their owner and he will likely step in here pretty soon to make sure the deal gets done.

And if I’m Ainge and these guys go “find an offer for us to beat” and if my ****s with other stuff I’m trying to do… when I come back to you then you will have to beat it by more than a little or I’ll eff ya.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Also the Washington first doesn’t really count as a first. That pick has a 50% shot at conveying imo.

 

[Elizah Huge]

At minimum to beat the Heat offer the Knicks need to be offering this:

- 3 unprotected 1sts
- 3 draft pick swaps
- 2 protected 1sts
- Toppin
- Quickley or Grimes

Even then I’m not sure if that’s enough. Is Toppin + Quickley or Grimes + a protected 1st worth the same as Herro? I don’t think so.

 

[stitches]

I don’t think Ainge would let it happen but it sounds like NY is doing the boiling the frog thing. Take RJ off the table and it’s based around premium draft capital which we should get 90% of it if true. Then Grimes is a pivot point too? Nah… Heat or Toronto can beat the package they are selling at that point. We have other ways to get the ****** protected picks… don’t get me wrong I will take em… but the Heat unprotected picks are more valuable than those… pick swaps are interesting too. Herro is a really good young player… I truly don’t get the hate with him. He closer to becoming Bradley Beal than JC.

At this current moment Herro is better than every single one of NYK's young players. Barrett included. Not sure he will be better assett on his new deal, but yah...

 

[Elizah Huge]

Also the Washington first doesn’t really count as a first. That pick has a 50% shot at conveying imo.

If they trade Beal that pick might not convey at all. They will be terrible for years to come.

 

[Elizah Huge]

At this current moment Herro is better than every single one of NYK's young players. Barrett included. Not sure he will be better assett on his new deal, but yah...

At 5/135 with a descending contract like the Knicks just gave Brunson he will be an amazing asset especially when the cap spikes.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

At minimum to beat the Heat offer the Knicks need to be offering this:

- 3 unprotected 1sts
- 3 draft pick swaps
- 2 protected 1sts
- Toppin
- Quickley or Grimes

Even then I’m not sure if that’s enough. Is Toppin + Quickley or Grimes + a protected 1st worth the same as Herro? I don’t think so.

I think there are lots of shenanigans we can pull with Don/CAA and the Knicks.

Donovan we’d love to send you home but they are just low balling us… Riley will basically give us everything he can… why does CAA want you in NY so bad Is that what is best for your career. How much do they really value you if they are risking not getting you because of a couple picks in 27/29… Riley was like **** those picks.

See if you can create some distrust with Don/CAA and get CAA to go to the Knicks and be like “dude can y’all pay up already we are about to lose our client”. Agencies get fired real easy and it maybe we can use the CAA ties to hurt them a bit.

I’m cool playing this out until the fall too… the later they get Don the worst they will be.

 

[Ferguson_Mellochill]

Katz on the RealGM show said something interesting - it seems like the Knicks want to keep enough picks so they would be able to pursue another big time player in 2024. With that said... here's what I came up with...

Filler, Topin, Grimes/Quickley
23 NYK, 29NYK
DAL 23
WAS 23
DET 23
Pick swaps 26, 28

This leaves NYK 4 picks to try to get another star in 24 - NYK 25, NYK 27, NYK 31, MKE 25 + swaps. (they might even include whoever they draft in 24 in the deal after the draft(like we got Kessler).

The awkward thing is... this is starting to become ridiculous for us with the number of picks in the 2023 draft. This would be 7 1st rounders if they all convert. But reality is - a lot of those won't (DAL converts, DET - probably not, WAS probably not)...

We still get one premier assett in an unprotected 29 NYK pick and we get two valuable swaps in case NYK collapses after Don's contract is up.

The Knicks '23 pick would need to be in the top 8 or so before I'd consider that. Otherwise, I want three unprotected 1sts from NYK. Hence, I'd wait until the pre-draft process before making this kind of deal. I'd be making a conscious choice to trade Mitchell for a Cam Whitmore-caliber player.

 

[Ferguson_Mellochill]

I think there are lots of shenanigans we can pull with Don/CAA and the Knicks.

Donovan we’d love to send you home but they are just low balling us… Riley will basically give us everything he can… why does CAA want you in NY so bad Is that what is best for your career. How much do they really value you if they are risking not getting you because of a couple picks in 27/29… Riley was like **** those picks.

See if you can create some distrust with Don/CAA and get CAA to go to the Knicks and be like “dude can y’all pay up already we are about to lose our client”. Agencies get fired real easy and it maybe we can use the CAA ties to hurt them a bit.

I’m cool playing this out until the fall too… the later they get Don the worst they will be.

Speaking of shenanigans, is it true that Mitchell's agent at CAA is Leon Rose's son?

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

At 5/135 with a descending contract like the Knicks just gave Brunson he will be an amazing asset especially when the cap spikes.

Last 3 years when we are trying to be competitive it’s like a 3/70 and the cap could be 50% higher… a 25-26 yo in his prime on an inflation adjusted 15M deal… really helps roster construction.

 

[margodydek]

I think there are lots of shenanigans we can pull with Don/CAA and the Knicks.

Donovan we’d love to send you home but they are just low balling us… Riley will basically give us everything he can… why does CAA want you in NY so bad Is that what is best for your career. How much do they really value you if they are risking not getting you because of a couple picks in 27/29… Riley was like **** those picks.

See if you can create some distrust with Don/CAA and get CAA to go to the Knicks and be like “dude can y’all pay up already we are about to lose our client”. Agencies get fired real easy and it maybe we can use the CAA ties to hurt them a bit.

I’m cool playing this out until the fall too… the later they get Don the worst they will be.

Whenever anyone talks about Donovan/CAA, they always allude to the idea that Donovan/CAA could eventually start putting pressure on the Jazz to get this done. But couldn't it just as easy go the other way and they start putting pressure on the Knicks to get it done. Seems like if they really wanted to get this done, that's where they'd focus their energy.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Speaking of shenanigans, is it true that Mitchell's agent at CAA is Leon Rose's son?

No. I don’t know his name but I’ve met him and I can confirm he’s not Leon’s kid.

 

[Ferguson_Mellochill]

Jazz should also sit back and see what happens in BRK, POR, SAC by mid-season. Any one of those teams could be looking to make a big swing at Mitchell if their season isn't tracking the way they want.

 

[margodydek]

Speaking of shenanigans, is it true that Mitchell's agent at CAA is Leon Rose's son?

Not true.

 

[Ferguson_Mellochill]

Whenever anyone talks about Donovan/CAA, they always allude to the fact that Donovan/CAA could eventually start putting pressure on the Jazz to get this done. But couldn't it just as easy go the other way and they start putting pressure on the Knicks to get it done. Seems like if they really wanted to get this done, that's where they'd focus their energy.

Mitchell's preferred destination is purportedly Miami. That's likely another reason why Mitchell and CAA aren't pressuring the Jazz to send him to the Knicks.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

At this current moment Herro is better than every single one of NYK's young players. Barrett included. Not sure he will be better assett on his new deal, but yah...

Yeah, he is better than Grimes, but I would rather have Grimes if I'm doing a rebuild and want to build an optimal team.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Mitchell's preferred destination is purportedly Miami. That's likely another reason why Mitchell and CAA aren't pressuring the Jazz to send him to the Knicks.

Isnt that based off the Fat Joe rumor?

 

[stitches]

Yeah, he is better than Grimes, but I would rather have Grimes if I'm doing a rebuild and want to build an optimal team.

How certain are we Grimes will be good, let alone great? Like... what he did in SL was good, but ... that was SL. SL is made for ballhandling guards and tons of them can't translate what they do in SL to the league.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

How certain are we Grimes will be good, let alone great? Like... what he did in SL was good, but ... that was SL. SL is made for ballhandling guards and tons of them can't translate what they do in SL to the league.

He was already good his rookie year....

 

[David Hume]

Isnt that based off the Fat Joe rumor?

I heard from Small Saul that Mitchell wanted to go to Sacramento.