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Summer League Thread

stitches said:
Well... then... then you would have really ****ed up with your analysis of Bilal. His whole career until this point would be null and void and everything that would matter would be that single game on a July afternoon.
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Look people will crow about a missed pull-up and a block in a summer league game as proof his talent is so obvious… if Bilal scores 25…

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stitches said:
The problem is that we don't have access to a universe splitter so we can see what happens with that counterfactual where Bilal plays in college. We don't know what he would have done for Villanova or Florida or Arkansas... Maybe he's better and is given more responsibility... maybe he's even worse...
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Saint Cy of JFC said:
If you put Keyonte on a French league team and he produced the way he did at Baylor, they would barely play him and he'd be shooting 35% from the field.


But would that make him an unworthy prospect all the sudden?
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Cy has the universe splitter… just have him run it.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
If you put Keyonte on a French league team and he produced the way he did at Baylor, they would barely play him and he'd be shooting 35% from the field.


But would that make him an unworthy prospect all the sudden?
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Yep... but my biggest problem with that type of conjectures is that we don't really know if both Bilal would have been this productive in college and Keyonte would have been this inefficient in France. It's kind of pointless to even think much about it.
 
stitches said:
Yep... but my biggest problem with that type of conjectures is that we don't really know if both Bilal would have been this productive in college and Keyonte would have been this inefficient in France. It's kind of pointless to even think much about it.
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It's just wild to me a guy who was hugely important to his team in his league playoff run just gets dismissed as being unproductive trash. 18 years old in a pro league.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I don't know much... but I know that based on my recent luck Bilal will go for 25 today in summer league today. All you degenerates should find out what the over/under is and pound the over. Your are welcome.
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They don’t even have him listed as an option to get 15+ points so unfortunately you can’t.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Look people will crow about a missed pull-up and a block in a summer league game as proof his talent is so obvious… if Bilal scores 25…

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I have to agree with them though... that missed pull up after the snake dribble with the left into the midrange was kind of nice. I know it ultimately matters that he missed it... and that he has been missing them all year(few of them but missing them)... but it did look like he was comfortable taking this shot... it looked natural... like it should be going much more than it has been so far for him. Of course, you would need development from him and this is where part of the allure of Bilal is... in certain situations you can see the potential of him being more than he is right now. I've already stated that I don't think the chance of him realizing that potential to the fullest extend of what people imagine is very high. But there definitely is a chance it happens IMO.
 
stitches said:
I have to agree with them though... that missed pull up after the snake dribble with the left into the midrange was kind of nice. I know it ultimately matters that he missed it... and that he has been missing them all year(few of them but missing them)... but it did look like he was comfortable taking this shot... it looked natural... like it should be going much more than it has been so far for him. Of course, you would need development from him and this is where part of the allure of Bilal is... in certain situations you can see the potential of him being more than he is right now. I've already stated that I don't think the chance of him realizing that potential to the fullest extend of what people imagine is very high. But there definitely is a chance it happens IMO.
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I mean to each their own but I wasn't super impressed with that highlight... the blocks are impressive. I just thought it was funny that we have so little to do off that we are like "check out this missed middie".

I'm definitely lower than consensus on the guy but I'm not out. I just think if some are going to slobber over a few highlights its okay for others to throw cold water based on the aggregate results.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I mean to each their own but I wasn't super impressed with that highlight... the blocks are impressive. I just thought it was funny that we have so little to do off that we are like "check out this missed middie".

I'm definitely lower than consensus on the guy but I'm not out. I just think if some are going to slobber over a few highlights its okay for others to throw cold water based on the aggregate results.
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Is it? The fact is that potential and talent are largely based off the flashes of brilliance and demonstrating an ability to increase your consistency over time (which Bilal did if you followed his season, to a very impressive degree)

Keyonte is a great example. He had a lot of stinker performances, but as a prospect he also had some of the best performances. Early returns, but it looks like the high moments were more stronger indicators than the poor performances.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I mean to each their own but I wasn't super impressed with that highlight... the blocks are impressive. I just thought it was funny that we have so little to do off that we are like "check out this missed middie".

I'm definitely lower than consensus on the guy but I'm not out. I just think if some are going to slobber over a few highlights its okay for others to throw cold water based on the aggregate results.
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His defensive ability has been his best quality and the blocks have been super impressive.

Everything else has been pretty bad. Out of control and can’t shoot.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Is it? The fact is that potential and talent are largely based off the flashes of brilliance and demonstrating an ability to increase your consistency over time (which Bilal did if you followed his season, to a very impressive degree)

Keyonte is a great example. He had a lot of stinker performances, but as a prospect he also had some of the best performances. Early returns, but it looks like the high moments were more stronger indicators than the poor performances.
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Lol... I guess I just have a higher standard for what qualifies as a "flash of brilliance"
 
KqWIN said:
The thing that sparked this whole argument is a guy saying that French guys are overrated and they are overrated because they are French. What me and @stitches have been saying this whole time is that it's dumb to dislike Bilal on the basis of being French. Questioning his production is not a dumb argument. I think there are reasons to believe he's better than the raw production, but that's besides the point. If we had a problem with the production based argument, we would not have said "you should actually be talking about his low production/rawness" multiple times. One of the reasons this French = Overrated stuff is ridiculous in the first place is that there are very obvious question marks about Bilal.
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What if you question his production AND also point out that he is playing in a league that, for whatever reason, doesn't produce much nba talent? Would you allow that or is it too insane?
 
stitches said:
IMO if you just evaluate the player the whole is he French or Spaniard or Greek or German becomes completely irrelevant. There is nothing about being French that should make his shooting and offensive polish any better than it is on the tape. There is nothing about being French that will make his 7'2" wingspan any shorter or his athleticism any less impressive. Just freaking evaluate the player, his skills and his tools. "French" doesn't tell me anything about him as a basketball player. "French" is not a basketball attribute and you should ever see it as a basketball descriptor on a basketball scouting report. "Well, he's long and athletic but his jumpshot is very French"...

To me focusing on him being French adds nothing and describes nothing about him that we don't already know by just... watching him play.
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But there is a competition level to look at. Just like in other sports. Like HH mentioned, when nfl teams draft a player from a school like BYU or UNLV they need to look at the talent level in those conferences and determine if the good things about a player might have something to do with the competition of the opponents.
Then there is also the style of play being different from the nba. There is also a different set of rules in the nba vs the french league. Different culture. Etc. That all can be considered as well when evaluating a prospect.
 
KqWIN said:
Saying that a prospect is bad because he is French or that a prospect is bad because he played in the French league is dumb.
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He said none of that. he said french prospects are over rated and haven't done anthing in the league in a period of time. Prove him wrong.
 
I enjoy this forum a lot, am a daily reader and appreciate everyone that contributes, but some of the discussions make me lose the will to live...
 
stitches said:
The problem is that we don't have access to a universe splitter so we can see what happens with that counterfactual where Bilal plays in college. We don't know what he would have done for Villanova or Florida or Arkansas... Maybe he's better and is given more responsibility... maybe he's even worse...
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Yep. So we can only speak in facts. Fact is that prospects from that league have been overrated and aint done ****.
 
Lmao love that Elizah backtracked to it not being about being French and now Fish is back to saying it's because they are French.

Got to love it
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Lmao love that Elizah backtracked to it not being about being French and now Fish is back to saying it's because they are French.

Got to love it
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Link to where I posted anything is because anyone is french? What I posted is that eliza statements were true. If you have any evidence to the contrary then by all means post it.
 
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