A Mitt Romney and Condoleeza Rice ticket?

[bordelais7]

The original point was that a darkly skinned, or female, VP candidate would demotivate a substantial part of the Republican base, and from what I can tell, a larger part than would be motivated by it.

Once again, you've never supported this interesting claim with anything other than anecdotal hateful generalizations. Have you got any data to support your assertion that the choice of a minority VP would lessen the election chances of a Republican presidential candidate?

 

[One Brow]

Once again, you've never supported this interesting claim with anything other than anecdotal hateful generalizations. Have you got any data to support your assertion that the choice of a minority VP would lessen the election chances of a Republican presidential candidate?

No, I do not. While it would be interesting to run controlled experiments, I'm not sure that's feasible (OK, I'm sure it is not). Therefore, I don't see how any such data can be assembled. I'm open to suggestions on how such data would be accumulated outside of polling, or if there were any way to poll this questions and get honest responses.

Very few people like to think of themselves as racist (or sexist). The interviewer who takes one candidate's attempt to negotiate salary as being a positive, and the other as a negative, does not think of themself as racist; it's just one guy was assertive and the other was aggressive. There have been experiemental studies on these sorts of relationships. You think it doesn't extend to voter's opinions of politicians? Maybe not.

 

[bordelais7]

No, I do not. While it would be interesting to run controlled experiments, I'm not sure that's feasible (OK, I'm sure it is not). Therefore, I don't see how any such data can be assembled. I'm open to suggestions on how such data would be accumulated outside of polling, or if there were any way to poll this questions and get honest responses.

Very few people like to think of themselves as racist (or sexist). The interviewer who takes one candidate's attempt to negotiate salary as being a positive, and the other as a negative, does not think of themself as racist; it's just one guy was assertive and the other was aggressive. There have been experiemental studies on these sorts of relationships. You think it doesn't extend to voter's opinions of politicians? Maybe not.

I suppose the more relevant question for this election cycle would be that if there IS indeed a significant effect on the voter, what would be the result? I don't imagine that people would say "I'm not voting for a minority -- I'm voting for Obama instead!"

Given the analysis from many pundits that Republicans were casting votes for Herman Cain partially as an over-reactive response to cover for their own suppressed racist sentiments, coupled with the fact that the sitting president is a minority, I don't really see what Romney(?) would stand to lose by having Rice on his ticket (from a race relations standpoint, anyhow).

It was all the rage in 2008 to be able to say "Hey, I voted for Obama; therefore, I'm open-minded!" I don't see that mentality changing in 2012.

 

[bordelais7]

...and I don't have any data either, but I was assuming you had some polling data or some 2008 study to back up your point.

 

[Stoked]

Thank goodness I have a person with lighter-skinned privilege explaining to me what's relevant for those with darker skin. I'm so enlightened!

If you want to act like an *** I can easily start treating you like one. I am comfortable with my example. I disagree with your assertion that because some one claims something is rascist that it automatically is.

 

[GVC]

I suppose the more relevant question for this election cycle would be that if there IS indeed a significant effect on the voter, what would be the result? I don't imagine that people would say "I'm not voting for a minority -- I'm voting for Obama instead!"

I think one brow would contend that more people would choose not to vote (or vote for a third party candidate) than would be motivated to vote for a bi-racial GOP ticket (who would have voted for someone else or no one at all).

This may be a surprise to you, but a lot of people don't vote.

 

[GVC]

and what the **** is "rascist"?

 

[TroutBum]

I just wanted to point out that OneBrow is a moron. A lightly-skinned, old (you have to be at least XX years old to really understand the world), jerk face. The same person who thinks the word, "Nìgga" as in, "What's up my nìgga?" is the same thing as "Nìgger", also thinks the BPP were not racists.

Sometimes I hate you.

 

[One Brow]

I suppose the more relevant question for this election cycle would be that if there IS indeed a significant effect on the voter, what would be the result? I don't imagine that people would say "I'm not voting for a minority -- I'm voting for Obama instead!"

Given the analysis from many pundits that Republicans were casting votes for Herman Cain partially as an over-reactive response to cover for their own suppressed racist sentiments, coupled with the fact that the sitting president is a minority, I don't really see what Romney(?) would stand to lose by having Rice on his ticket (from a race relations standpoint, anyhow).

It was all the rage in 2008 to be able to say "Hey, I voted for Obama; therefore, I'm open-minded!" I don't see that mentality changing in 2012.

I agree with the first paragraph. That's why I referred to demotivating the base, the result of which could be not voting, or voting for Ron Paul.

I never say Cain as more than a flash-in-the-pan, and I don't recall him ever polling at higher than 30%. When push came to shove, Cain may have been less personally, morally odious than Gingrich. Do you think that a couple of putative victims being lighter-skinned may have played a part in his plummet? Was Thomas hurt less because Hill had dark skin? I don't have definitive answers there.

The people who voted for Obama probably have a minimal intersection with the Republican base. I'm not saying you're wrong about the prior group people.

 

[One Brow]

If you want to act like an *** I can easily start treating you like one. I am comfortable with my example. I disagree with your assertion that because some one claims something is rascist that it automatically is.

You should be uncomfortable with such an assertion. I'm uncomfortable with such an assertion. I don't recall making tht assertion. Could you point it out?

However, feel free to treat me like an *** if you want, regardless of motive. It will not bother me at all.

 

[Nate505]

First, I apologize for the bad proofreading in the post you quoted.

I didn't introduce the KKK nor the New Black Panther party into this discussion. Racism is a daily issue for people with darker skin colors, not something you face only when you see the KKK. For you, racism by darker people only affects your life when you see it directly. For those with darker skin, the experience is a daily thing.

I don't buy that, but it's all dependent on where you live. I grew up in the uber liberal Bay Area paradise. How did people with darker skin in Oakland experience racism on a daily basis, especially when in many neighborhoods they were the large majority? Or even a city like Alameda where the demographics, particularity on the west side, were very multi-cultural?

 

[TheDude]

Does anyone else think that no matter who gets the nomination or ultimately elected, we won't be happy with our next president? I am not a huge Obama fan, and other than possibly Ron Paul, I don't really have a candidate from other side I am excited about.

When was the last time we had a leader in this country that most Americans could rally around and support?

It's sad, really.

 

[One Brow]

I just wanted to point out that OneBrow is a moron. A lightly-skinned, old (you have to be at least XX years old to really understand the world), jerk face. The same person who thinks the word, "Nìgga" as in, "What's up my nìgga?" is the same thing as "Nìgger", also thinks the BPP were not racists.

Sometimes I hate you.

Well, I'm 49, so still about ten years too young to have experienced the environment of the Black Panther Party in any significant way, but old to some people. I am curious why you think you know how light my skin may or may not be.

I think, when you are a person of privilege, it's very natural to to see a response to racism as being racist, rather than corrective.

It's good to hate me sometimes. Keeps me sharp.

 

[One Brow]

How did people with darker skin in Oakland experience racism on a daily basis, especially when in many neighborhoods they were the large majority? Or even a city like Alameda where the demographics, particularity on the west side, were very multi-cultural?

In pretty much the same way they experience such racism in certain neighborhoods in Brooklyn, East St. Louis, etc. Please read the links, and let me know if they don't make sense to you.

 

[Beantown]

Does anyone else think that no matter who gets the nomination or ultimately elected, we won't be happy with our next president? I am not a huge Obama fan, and other than possibly Ron Paul, I don't really have a candidate from other side I am excited about.

When was the last time we had a leader in this country that most Americans could rally around and support?

It's sad, really.

After Obama's acceptance speech promising all this change I think the majority of the country was rallying around him. I thought that speech was amazing. The problem is that the change never came.

 

[Stoked]

Does anyone else think that no matter who gets the nomination or ultimately elected, we won't be happy with our next president? I am not a huge Obama fan, and other than possibly Ron Paul, I don't really have a candidate from other side I am excited about.

When was the last time we had a leader in this country that most Americans could rally around and support?

It's sad, really.

I do not think any president will enjoy over 50% for long if at all. The country is to divided into left and right. YOu are right it is sad.

 

[Stoked]

Well, I'm 49, so still about ten years too young to have experienced the environment of the Black Panther Party in any significant way, but old to some people. I am curious why you think you know how light my skin may or may not be.I think, when you are a person of privilege, it's very natural to to see a response to racism as being racist, rather than corrective.

It's good to hate me sometimes. Keeps me sharp.

For the same reason you profess to know my skin tone.

 

[Stoked]

You should be uncomfortable with such an assertion. I'm uncomfortable with such an assertion. I don't recall making tht assertion. Could you point it out?

However, feel free to treat me like an *** if you want, regardless of motive. It will not bother me at all.

My motive will only be if the shoe fits.

 

[One Brow]

For the same reason you profess to know my skin tone.

Your words are soaked in the privilege of those with lighter skin.

 

[One Brow]

My motive will only be if the shoe fits.

I accept that you earnestly mean this. I want to be clear: throughout this discussion, I have assumed that you feel you are being fair, impartial, and not racist in the slightest. I have no ill thoughts of you as a person.