What's new
By:

Off-Season Rumblings

Handlogten's Heros said:
No... If we acquire him he needs to improve his value. Its kind of a win-win situation. If he plays well then we bought low... if he's hurt then he sits out and you lose more. Just pissing him off would be worst of both worlds imo.
Click to expand...
Or he could just be bad and be a huge expiring salary at some point...

He's coming off foot surgery. He might not even be ready to start the season. It could very well be a tank move.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Or he could just be bad and be a huge expiring salary at some point...

He's coming off foot surgery. He might not even be ready to start the season. It could very well be a tank move.
Click to expand...
If he is that injured then maybe yes. If its that serious then I could see the deal outlined making sense and yes... maybe we would move Caruso separately to take some profit there. I just think if he's healthy enough to play then he would only come off the bench for a limited time. If its that big of an issue long term he shouldn't be playing.

The plan shouldn't be to piss him off so he can be a big expiring contract later. If DA does the deal I am sure the logic is buying really low and hoping he plays well. There are less expensive more flexible ways to tank.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
If he is that injured then maybe yes. If its that serious then I could see the deal outlined making sense and yes... maybe we would move Caruso separately to take some profit there. I just think if he's healthy enough to play then he would only come off the bench for a limited time. If its that big of an issue long term he shouldn't be playing.

The plan shouldn't be to piss him off so he can be a big expiring contract later. If DA does the deal I am sure the logic is buying really low and hoping he plays well. There are less expensive more flexible ways to tank.
Click to expand...
Ok but what other way to tank gets you Caruso which gets you an additional lottery pick?

Danny doesn't seem interested in adding assets unless they are high quality and that deal gets you the high quality asset.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Ok but what other way to tank gets you Caruso which gets you an additional lottery pick?

Danny doesn't seem interested in adding assets unless they are high quality and that deal gets you the high quality asset.
Click to expand...
Trading Walker, Sexton, or Lauri... if you add Lavine while keeping all those guys its generally not with an eye to the tank imo. It may turn out that way (hence the win-win). It chews up a bunch of cap space the next few years.

I'm just trying to view it from DA's lens and there is no way he does that trade thinking we will bring Zach off the bench long term because we don't care about pissing him off. I think he would see it as either 1- We get an AS talent on the cheap with a great defensive player to win now. 2- Maybe they flip AC and get that pick from Sac and get the pick plus get the buy low on Zach. If he is awesome again we chase the play in to make Lauri happy... if he's hurt we end up bottom 6-7 (but no guarantee because Sexton/Lauri/Walker may be okayish enough to get you to the 9-12 range we love.

If the idea is to tank there are better ways to do it. The tank would be a side benefit to the deal not working out... a silver lining type of thing... but not the motivation behind the deal imo.
 
Ron Mexico said:
Not me. I think they did very solid. Built assets, drafted well, developed some players well, kept flexibility, and didn't waste any assets. Also did not completely **** our team by going scorched earth. We have a borderline all NBA player that's a unicorn and easy to build around with a million picks plus a handful of very young players with solid upside.

We could not have tanked more the first year. The team surprised us and played better than expected and we got a great player emerge that's worth way more than any pick that year besides the very low chance at #1. After the break we fully tanked which is the only time we could have. We got great players that are arguably just as valuable as anyone after the first pick.

This year we went into the year with the same team that lost a ton. The only way we could have been worse was trading away Lauri, which is really stupid. Also this years draft at the top sucks and it isn't worth it. But we did move up as much as possible at the end and got extra assets to do it.

Jazz did a great job.
Click to expand...
You can argue it was a good decision and you like where we ended up, but if tanking was the goal it was done very poorly. If tanking was the primary goal, either of the last two years, you simply dont wait for the trade deadline to blow it up. IMO we have been stuck in the middle two years in a row and then punched the team in the gut at the trade deadline. Glad someone thinks it was managed well. For me it is a sign of being 100% opportunistic with no plan.
 
gomretat said:
You can argue it was a good decision and you like where we ended up, but if tanking was the goal it was done very poorly. If tanking was the primary goal, either of the last two years, you simply dont wait for the trade deadline to blow it up. IMO we have been stuck in the middle two years in a row and then punched the team in the gut at the trade deadline. Glad someone thinks it was managed well. For me it is a sign of being 100% opportunistic with no plan.
Click to expand...
I completely disagree, but hey that's fine it's an opinion board. I guess we agree that we are being opportunistic, but that's a great plan to optimize our chances of greatly improving.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Trading Walker, Sexton, or Lauri... if you add Lavine while keeping all those guys its generally not with an eye to the tank imo. It may turn out that way (hence the win-win). It chews up a bunch of cap space the next few years.

I'm just trying to view it from DA's lens and there is no way he does that trade thinking we will bring Zach off the bench long term because we don't care about pissing him off. I think he would see it as either 1- We get an AS talent on the cheap with a great defensive player to win now. 2- Maybe they flip AC and get that pick from Sac and get the pick plus get the buy low on Zach. If he is awesome again we chase the play in to make Lauri happy... if he's hurt we end up bottom 6-7 (but no guarantee because Sexton/Lauri/Walker may be okayish enough to get you to the 9-12 range we love.

If the idea is to tank there are better ways to do it. The tank would be a side benefit to the deal not working out... a silver lining type of thing... but not the motivation behind the deal imo.
Click to expand...
The easiest way to tank would be to move one of Walker or Sexton (assuming Lauri is THE long term piece that we don't want to sacrifice to the tank gods). Would net a lotto pick imo. Walker provides us with competence on defense without which we will be a 20-something win team. Sexton with the on ball advantages with efficiency that Key doesn't. Easily end up in the mid 20 win range moving one or both of those guys.

I wouldn't pursue the deal outlined for Lavine as I feel pretty strongly about the tank, but at that value it absolutely makes sense and I'm flexible if something with that good of value drops in your lap. I would probably move Caruso if the value is really that high for a high pick, but if he wants to extend at a decent price that also might be a better long term asset we can use. The lotto protection on the Cavs pick is a big selling point in that trade for me... so I would need that in there to feel good about it.

Lavine is a boom or bust type of move. I would guess the FO thinks it would be a boom and that's why they'd do it. They are okay with a bust as well so that's another reason they'd do it. But I doubt the go in rubbing their hands thinking about all those L's Zach will bring.
 
I'm simply disappointed in the Jazz for not tanking properly last year for Wemby. A generational talent like Wemby was a franchise changer big time. Generational talent is something you have to serious tank for, without a doubt, but the Jazz are to too proud to even realize that, and stay mediocre. The Fraudzz simply don't know how to tank properly, or contend properly in the playoffs since the malone and stockton days.
 
The problem I have with LaVine is that, like the Bulls who want to get rid of him, I don’t think he is good enough a player to justify his large salary for 3 years. It all comes down how you value him as a player. Also, I have concerns about his lack of defense and playmaking and the fit with Lauri if we keep him (when Lauri played with LaVine with the Bulls, the fit was bad, and I suspect this was one of the reasons Lauri asked to be traded).
 
KqWIN said:
John Collins would have to be moved for an OG signing. Lauri R+E is happening 100%. Dumping Clarkson doesn’t give us enough to give OG the max.

I actually wonder if a FVV style deal would be enough to persuade him. Give OG the max for 3 years? It could work. I think he’d likely choose PHI over us.

If he chooses us, we could send John Collins back to New York. Otherwise OKC would be the top salary dump location IMO.

Is OG worth the big bucks over someone like Lavine?
Click to expand...
Jazz should’ve learned their lesson with Favors. Stop dumping guys for assets. Suck it up and figure something else out. John Collins off the bench is better than dumping Collins and having to attach picks to the deal.
 
framer said:
I mean we didn't have the two extra picks we are using this year before the trade deadline and we used last year's picks pretty well. They have more value now than they did as picks. Not sure what you mean by less options. . .
Click to expand...
Trading Olynyk was fine, but I’d still rather have Fontecchio for what came back. Think that was a missed opportunity.
 
My2Cents said:
How is that a smart trade? Caruso for Giddey straight up? All those firsts and seconds OKC has and Chicago came away with not a single pick. This was a great trade for OKC.
Click to expand...
I think it was a win win for both. Giddey has the potential to be a solid longterm piece for them and Caruso was a perfect pending free agent.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page
Back
Top