Is Flip the next Jokic?
Is Isiah Collier finally our new Stockton?
- Thread starter The Midnight
- Start date
Also Keyonte is Devin Booker, TH is JJJ and Cody is his brother.
Who is Brice though?
Tanktastic
Well-Known Member
True Ainge master class assembling that Infinity War roster and being under the cap.
The way people talk about it, I hear he's the next Doug Christie.
Wow.Let's compare apples to apples: rookie season stats--
Most Assists Rookie Season | StatMuse
Mark Jackson has the most assists by a rookie, with 868 assists in 1987-88.www.statmuse.com
If Isaiah maintains similar production to his last 10 games- for the rest of the season-- he will jump up to about 20th on the list- about even with Magic Johnson. John Stockton is not on this list- because he only played 18 min a game as a rookie. If you adjust his numbers to per/36 min, Stockton had 10.09 in his rookie year. I project Isaiah will end at about 10.01.
Btw... Isaiah's shooting percentages would be better than Stockton's and his points per 36 min would be about the same- if he weren't taking 3 point shots. Stockton only took one 3 pointer every 3 games in his rookie year. Otherwise their stats would be about equal on shooting and points. (That doesn't mean I want him to stop. Stockton only hit 18% of his threes in his rookie year- but finished his career at 38%).
Isaiah is a better rebounder- but Stockton had twice as many steals. Turnovers per 36 min are in Stockton's favor- but not by that much.
As I mentioned in another post-- we should also factor in that Isaiah is getting his numbers on a hard-tanking team- with many of his passes going to G leaguers and cast offs from other teams...
51 games is a small sample size- but if you compare rookie season stats only-- adjusted to per 36 min--- Isaiah is very comparable to John Stockton.
One player on that list was Ennis Whatley who had better adjusted assist numbers than Stockton in his rookie year (11.07). Whatley played in the league 10 years as a back up. So of course that could happen with Isaiah.
But look at the other names on that list. Isaiah's adjusted per min assists in his rookie year will surpass Oscar Robertson, Magic Johnson, Chris Paul, Trae Young and pretty much every other great passer you can name...
If you thought this thread was a ridiculous premise-- the stats say otherwise. Of course no one can predict which players have the drive and determination to keep getting better year after year like Stockton and Malone-- but I sure like Isaiah's demeanor and confidence. He has consistently improved throughout his first season... so I for one am very excited to see how high his ceiling will eventually be!
Amazing find, thanks bro.
Put me in team Collier as the next great pass first player.
David Hume
Well-Known Member
Western Conference Rookie of the Month.
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underdog
Well-Known Member
I want Collier to break that Stockton’s rookie record. Tony Jones wrote about this today:
Isaiah Collier has Hall of Famer John Stockton's Jazz ...
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framer
Well-Known Member
I mean if you are going to get hyper technical like this Collier is most certainly a better passer than a 50 something year old D-Will. Collier is pretty damn elite in recent memory as a rookie assist man, probably better than rookie Williams. He is not a better rookie than D-Will though. Deron was a year older as well and had just driven his team to the NCAA championship game.
That’s amazing.
I still love watching this guy play. It's fun to watch and I miss the pass first point guard.
Looking at the game from a 50,000 foot view I do wonder if we slowly revert back to a more traditional style of play, a la pass-first PG's and the big-man being more "en vogue."
The small-ball era was fun and novel with the advent of the Warriors in the mid 2010's and clearly the league followed suit to fight fire with fire. Since the apex of the Splash Brothers (2015-2019) I will argue the on-floor product has meaningfully devolved and is frankly generally awful to watch (this is a personal option that is somewhat supported broadly based on ratings #'s).
Generally, I think major "style of play" changes are driven by transcendent talents. Shaq was the driver of the "big man" era; the Steph - Klay (+ Durant later) was the driver of the "3-pt barrage" era; et cetera. But the league can, and historically has, implemented some changes in terms of rules / the adjudication of the game to alter the product on the floor.
IMO - the NBA is learning it has over-indexed on the popularity of points, 3pt shooting, offense, etc. and the NBA game has lost its soul in a sense, relative to peak popularity in the 80's - 00's. Not sure what it will look like but I do think things "swing back" in some way, at some point.
Isaiah 1:13
Well-Known Member
Absolutely love to see it! Stockton has enough major records including All Time steals and assists that will most likely never be broken. Stock can afford to give this one up.