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Following potential 2012 draftees

Bodhi said:
Is anyone saying different? I thought that was basketball 1010?
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Yes. I'm referring to those that keep yelling for Marshall. I'm fine with Marshall ONLY if I know EXACTLY how we intend to fix our perimeter shooting. My claim is getting Rivers and Miller fixes a lot of our problems on both exterior (shooting/slashing) and the interior (spacing).
 
PKM said:
I still like Rivers and QMIller. Either Rivers pans out as a PG or we play a point forward offense (Hayward?) ... and we'd have two wings in the draft that are 40+% from behind the arc.

I wish people understood (or maybe I'm just wrong?) that the best thing for our young bigs is to get the floor spread ..
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I completely understand this, hence my gag reflex when people mention Marshall as the lone missing "Key" to the Jazz offense.

In case anyone is confused, I don't think that Marshall will be able to dramatically improve his shot enough to be a serious threat and therefore help spread the floor for the Jazz.
 
PKM said:
Yes. I'm referring to those that keep yelling for Marshall. I'm fine with Marshall ONLY if I know EXACTLY how we intend to fix our perimeter shooting. My claim is getting Rivers and Miller fixes a lot of our problems on both exterior (shooting/slashing) and the interior (spacing).
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It looks like I am a little slow on my last post.
 
orangello said:
It looks like I am a little slow on my last post.
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Haha, I did the same thing a few posts above. Also, what the Marshall swallowers keep failing to address is his lack of explosiveness, poor shooting, and defensive inferiority ... all in one person. I get sick of hearing things like, "Rondo can't shoot either." ... "Wall can't shoot." ... "Kidd" .. are you serious??

All of these guys (above) are fast as hell and can get into the lane ..
 
PKM said:
Yes. I'm referring to those that keep yelling for Marshall. I'm fine with Marshall ONLY if I know EXACTLY how we intend to fix our perimeter shooting. My claim is getting Rivers and Miller fixes a lot of our problems on both exterior (shooting/slashing) and the interior (spacing).
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I'll admit that after I posted I went back the front page and saw that the Marshall thread had grown to 17 pages. "Shocked" is the best way to describe my feelings.

I guess I'm ignorant to the fact that he's garnered that much interest here since I've read 1 page of that thread and never went back.

In conclusion, I agree about Marshall and the floor spacing issue in general, I assume most did too...
 
I hate that most think I'm down on Marshall. It's just that I'm seeing the same things it seems scouts are seeing. It's like, yes, he can pass, no question .. what else ya' got? Oh, nothing? Okay, that's worth about a 16-20 pick in the draft. They're seeing more potential in a lot more guys to do more than just one thing for their team.
 
Bodhi said:
I'll admit that after I posted I went back the front page and saw that the Marshall thread had grown to 17 pages. "Shocked" is the best way to describe my feelings.

I guess I'm ignorant to the fact that he's garnered that much interest here since I've read 1 page of that thread and never went back.

In conclusion, I agree about Marshall and the floor spacing issue in general, I assume most did too...
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The thread that you really want to read is entitled: Please take a side! Next PG for the Jazz out of the 2012 draft. It is on page 2.

(Yes, I just pimped my own thread. I feel good about it too!)
 
Oh, I've weighed in on that thread. I tossed in Lillard.....as a PG. I'll take Rivers as well but don't see him as a PG at all.
 
orangello said:
This is for all those Quincy Miller lovers out there (and those that just want know more about him):

https://www.draftexpress.com/article/NBA-Draft-Prospect-of-the-Week-Quincy-Miller-3857
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Thanks. I've always only had one problem with Quincy. Work ethic/desire. I have never had the slightest issue with his shooting, handles, passing, rebounding, defense, etc. He can be a VERY elite player (all-star), we'll have to wait and see how much he wants it.

PJones is similar to the above, but I'd put my money on Quincy.
 
PKM said:
Thanks. I've always only had one problem with Quincy. Work ethic/desire. I have never had the slightest issue with his shooting, handles, passing, rebounding, defense, etc. He can be a VERY elite player (all-star), we'll have to wait and see how much he wants it.

PJones is similar to the above, but I'd put my money on Quincy.
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I fully agree on QMiller as far as having uber talent and lacking desire but I also question his bball IQ. Not that he's dumb or anything but the kid doesn't seem to hardly ever utilize any of his advantages physically or even recognize he has them. Maybe thats back to the desire issue but it does worry me about his bball IQ.
 
Here are some of the parts that I enjoyed.

This versatility is something that can surely be harnessed in the NBA, which is heavily oriented around exploiting mismatches at different positions. With Miller's ability to create his own shot on the perimeter, make 3-pointers or utilize his superior size in the paint, he could be a very difficult player to game-plan against on a nightly basis, especially considering his solid passing skills.

As a shooter, Miller has been very good for the most part, knocking down a solid 43% of his jumpers so far this season, including an impressive 41% from 3-point range, despite a low, unorthodox release, dipping the ball below his waist and shooting it from above his chest. He's much more effective shooting the ball with his feet set at this stage, as his percentages take a dip when he forced to take a shot under duress, particularly off the dribble.

Quickening the speed of his release would allow him to fully utilize his excellent size and make him much more dangerous from the perimeter considering his terrific touch and instincts as a shot-maker.

Inside the paint, Miller has excellent potential, as he is able to get his shot off almost whenever he wants against collegiate-sized (or even most NBA-sized) small forwards. Despite not always having the strength to establish great position, he can simply rise up off either shoulder and throw the ball in the basket in a variety of ways, be it with jump-hooks, floaters and turnaround jumpers, using the glass, and even when off-balance. As he continues to get stronger and learns to become more physical with opponents, this is a part of his game that could really blossom.

Miller's most impressive attribute might be his ability to create shots off the dribble. He doesn't have the most explosive first step, but he has outstanding scoring instincts, doing a nice job utilizing shot fakes and showing terrific ball-handling skills for a player at 6-9. He's able to put the ball on the floor with either hand and utilize crossovers, hesitations, spin moves, jukes, and step-back dribbles to create separation to get his shot off, with superb body control and very polished footwork.

Watching him grab a rebound and take the ball coast to coast, weaving his way fluidly in and out of traffic, really hammers home how unique his skill-level is at his size.
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It will be interesting to see how much more explosive he will get over time considering he's only about 15 months removed from tearing his ACL in December of 2010. This is an injury which at times can take up to 18 months to fully recover from, especially for players lacking in lower body strength, which Miller clearly is.
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PKM said:
Yes. I'm referring to those that keep yelling for Marshall. I'm fine with Marshall ONLY if I know EXACTLY how we intend to fix our perimeter shooting. My claim is getting Rivers and Miller fixes a lot of our problems on both exterior (shooting/slashing) and the interior (spacing).
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As someone who wants Marshall, I understand this as much as you do. With that said floor spacers are easier to find pure pg's aren't easy to find. We can easily find shooters in free agency over the next two years, as our future core is still trying to develop we can be patient trying to get shooters. A true pg would in my opinion help Favors, Hayward, Kanter, and Burks develop quicker.

I will say this part of the reason I want Marshall is I have a bad case of John Stockton syndrome. I'm fed up with the offense. I miss the back door cuts moving without the ball, and last but not least pick and roll offense.

I'm a reasonable person on a good day, if you can show me a pg in the draft, that actually is a pg that has 65-70% of the pg skills Marshall has, that can also shoot and has at least NBA passing athletic ability, then I could possibly be persuaded to change my stance on Marshall. Maybe it's Lillard or the kid from Texas I don't know as I haven't seen them play yet. What I do know is I don't want Rivers as our pg, sg yes pg no.
 
Actually the jazz can get a pure pg via trade too. Augustin and Calderon are good passing pgs. I say you take BPA. Marshall is not worthy of a lottery pick. Q miller IMHO is best player for the jazz to draft hands down.

The second pick if we have one will depend what happens come the trade deadline. I would love to see Marvin Williams as a jazz man. Add on Calderon and the draft the best big like one of the zellers.

Future of the jazz would look like this

Calderon, Watson, machado
Hayward, burks
Williams, miller
Millsap, Evans
Favors, kanter, zeller

That is a team I can live with.
 
Xthren said:
Actually the jazz can get a pure pg via trade too. Augustin and Calderon are good passing pgs. I say you take BPA. Marshall is not worthy of a lottery pick. Q miller IMHO is best player for the jazz to draft hands down.

The second pick if we have one will depend what happens come the trade deadline. I would love to see Marvin Williams as a jazz man. Add on Calderon and the draft the best big like one of the zellers.

Future of the jazz would look like this

Calderon, Watson, machado
Hayward, burks
Williams, miller
Millsap, Evans
Favors, kanter, zeller

That is a team I can live with.
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Isn't Calderon the matador from Toronto? Also I do not want a team I can "live with". I want a team that will have a chance at winning the title.
 
Xthren said:
Actually the jazz can get a pure pg via trade too. Augustin and Calderon are good passing pgs. I say you take BPA. Marshall is not worthy of a lottery pick. Q miller IMHO is best player for the jazz to draft hands down.

The second pick if we have one will depend what happens come the trade deadline. I would love to see Marvin Williams as a jazz man. Add on Calderon and the draft the best big like one of the zellers.

Future of the jazz would look like this

Calderon, Watson, machado
Hayward, burks
Williams, miller
Millsap, Evans
Favors, kanter, zeller

That is a team I can live with.
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I was with you up until you got into the Zellers. No thanks.
 
Zeller?? Really? If Marshall isn't best player available how is Zeller best player available? Also I value Marshall more then you. I view him a worthy pick up in the 10 to 15 range.
 
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