Big Al...if true, Center or PF?
- Thread starter Jazz Punk Rocker
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InGameStrategy
Well-Known Member
LOL. 1280 the Zone just hung up on a caller who suggested that Millsap play the 3. Millsap cannot keep with most SFs.
TheStormofWar
Well-Known Member
Will see more time as a 5 until Okur get's back, then he'll platoon with Millsap on the 4 and Okur at the 5. This does address some issues with our Center position and is an upgrade in that respect. Assuming we're final on this, kudos go to KOC.
Boozer + Milsap < Jefferson + Milsap is the hope. CB and PM had identical games.
The one place that PM could replace boozer completely is the pick and roll. He was getting it last season and he is a great finisher around the hoop. What we didn't have was a legit low post player who could ever score on any Laker bigs. It appears from the game to game stats that Jefferson can (never saw him play, just using stats) but boozer was mostly a 10ppg player against the Lakers last year.
So the hope is a a slightly modifed combination that will work out better than what we had before. I think it will be equal at the worst. (Barring injury)
The question mark is how Jefferson will play D against the long, tall players.
Are you making a statement or asking a question? Please advise.
Classic.
How about you comment on the Jazz rather than on those who post about the Jazz. Please adhere.
I fully understood what Borat was trying to communicate. I agree with his position on this Jazz-related point.
Good thing passing isn't the most important thing for a big, because Jefferson is one of the worst blackholes in the entire NBA.
How anyone is excited about a guy that does nothing more or nothing better than Boozer while also having had two serious injuries is overpowering my ability to understand.
How anyone is excited about a guy that does nothing more or nothing better than Boozer while also having had two serious injuries is overpowering my ability to understand.
It was a pretty short post. Did you read the part where I did say that a lot of 3s would "outquick" him, but that in certain circumstances he could play the 3. Two or 3 years ago he did in fact play the position. Not an ideal position for him, but he is only 6'7" afterall.
memo is money
Active Member
- We did need a post presence. Not only did we get a BETTER, MORE RELIABLE, post player than Carlos, a real post player, considering the complaints from many fans about the inactivity of Jazz in this FA Frenzy, we also got maybe the most talented remaining player in 2010 FA.
- I'm not that excited but am looking forward to seeing how a Okur-Jeff-Millsap frontcourt do in 1-2 years' time.
- Considering the talent we got via this trade + age factor, 3 years 42M vs 5 years 80M ? I think, talent-wise, there is not much gap between the two. (No way, I tell like: Booz >>>>> Jeff, or Jeff >>> Carlos, that's stupid).
- Al Jefferson is not a decent defensive player (no way worse than Carlos "The Matador" Boozer, right? + like you said is a blackhole). However, let's not forget the team, scrubs he has had to play with.
- Al Jefferson has better, more polished and stronger post moves than Carlos, for sure. Even when playing for T-Wolves, he did command more double teams than CArlos. Carlos has a more versatile offensive game and is a better finisher, though. Neither of the two, apparently, would satisfy each of Jazz fans. Isn't it real hard to make everybody happy?
I've seen no evidence that Al Jefferson's moves are more polished in any way, shape, or form. And just because he commands more double-teams because he's played on a ****** teams doesn't mean he's any better or worse than someone that got them less.
And Jefferson was considered a liability on D even on one of the worst defensive teams in the NBA. He's terrible.
And Jefferson was considered a liability on D even on one of the worst defensive teams in the NBA. He's terrible.
sirslimjim
Member
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
The answer is Jefferson swings both ways. And that's a good thing.
Most teams play a PF at the 5 nowadays. There aren't more than a handful of good, legit C's in the league. So on most nights, I'd expect Jefferson and Millsap to start, especially as Mmeo tries to work his way back from injury. What's more, Okur is really a PF, too. The only true center we have on the roster is Fesenko.
But I could see Jefferson/Okur paired together. I could also see Fes come in at the 5, with Jefferson at PF if the Jazz want to go big. And how does AK figure into the mix?
Sloan has a lot of ways now to tinker with this.
IMO, you can;t go wrong playing Jefferson/Millsap or Jefferson/Okur together. Big Al loves to work down low; Millsap has the sweet mid-range game and Okur, of course, can bomb away from outside. Both those combos are complementary. Fes/Jefferson is too much of the same, unless some one else hits us with two big guys (like pitting Fes vs. Bynum and Jefferson vs. Gasol?).
Most teams play a PF at the 5 nowadays. There aren't more than a handful of good, legit C's in the league. So on most nights, I'd expect Jefferson and Millsap to start, especially as Mmeo tries to work his way back from injury. What's more, Okur is really a PF, too. The only true center we have on the roster is Fesenko.
But I could see Jefferson/Okur paired together. I could also see Fes come in at the 5, with Jefferson at PF if the Jazz want to go big. And how does AK figure into the mix?
Sloan has a lot of ways now to tinker with this.
IMO, you can;t go wrong playing Jefferson/Millsap or Jefferson/Okur together. Big Al loves to work down low; Millsap has the sweet mid-range game and Okur, of course, can bomb away from outside. Both those combos are complementary. Fes/Jefferson is too much of the same, unless some one else hits us with two big guys (like pitting Fes vs. Bynum and Jefferson vs. Gasol?).
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
BTW, NumNuts, have you reviewed the list of PG's AL Jefferson has had to work with? It reads like the list between Stockton and Williams for the Jazz. The PF-centric offense of the Jazz turned Carlos into a 20-10 player (he's actually achieved that mark just 2x, if you want to be technical). Big Al has also been a 20-10 player 2x...without a decent PG feeding him the ball.
Let's see how Jefferson does with the best PG in basketball.
And I agree with memo is money...you can't get much worse on defense than Carlos. Anything Jefferson can give will be an improvement.
Let's see how Jefferson does with the best PG in basketball.
And I agree with memo is money...you can't get much worse on defense than Carlos. Anything Jefferson can give will be an improvement.
memo is money
Active Member
I did not come the conclusion of "Al Jefferson is a better post threat than Boozer" from "Big Al commands more double teams". I believe that way because what I watched during some regular season games gave me an idea and chance to compare both players who are considered among top offensive big men of today's game.
- One would have hard time to prove that playing in a terrible team helps players get more lucrative stats or the exact opposite. By this logic, we can also attribute his some weaknesses such as passing to him playing with scrubs. That does not lead us to anything concrete.
- We know that Carlos' inside points do not generally come from his one-on-one post plays, in which he uses his footwork on his way to near basket, or he makes quick back to basket moves. His high arching J's, fadeaways around 15-20 Foot, and most importantly designed, practised and perfectly utilized Pick'n roll plays, which constitute the Jazz offense in which PG and PF are main actors. We also know Carlos does escape from physical contact time to time. AS long as his J's are falling, there's no problem. However, against bigger and longer frontcourts, we saw from first hand that Carlos not only did not dominate (even be a factor) in the painted area, he struggled with his Js. If he really had such polished post moves (why could not I see them?), how could someone explain me this:
"56% of Jefferson's possessions came on post ups last year, compare that to Boozer who had 21% of his possessions on postups." (https://twitter.com/lockedonsports). Carlos is our first option, our basically unique post presence but somehow only 21% of his POSSESSIONS (attention, not points) came from post ups. While Jefferson is not as good as Boozer from the perimeter, he does have a more reliable inside game than him. I really like his back-to-the-basket game
- Al Jefferson is terrible in your opinion. However, let me remind you that when you bashed the front office for giving Memo a new contract and I insisted that at that time there were 20+ centers that got paid more than him, and insisted that he was (an is) a top8-10 center, one of players you and some other objectors would put in top5-6 list was Al Jefferson. What has changed so far?
- I ,personally, would rather do nothing, add some young, promising players at much cheaper price than do a major trade like this. I though, in long term, we could get an all-around bigman who can play both sides of floor pretty well, during the process which I would call "mini-rebuilding". Because I do not think Al-Jeff will solve most of our major problems ( Even if he is a better defender than THE MATADOR). However, I'm not against thşs trade because my prediction is all about speculation. A lot of fans wanted a big move and we got one of the better bigmen in the NBA, who gives us a great flexibilty and variations upfront. I'm not pumped up but I would rather have Jefferson with this contract than Boozer with his own contract.
- In my opinion, he is a better inside scoring big man than CArlos. He, I hope, will even be more productive while playing with the best PG in the game + in a better coached team which actually has a system.
- nobody can argue about the positive effect of JAZZ SYSTEM and D-Will on efficiency and stats of Boozer. A PF oriented system that is run by an elite PG does not hurt, right? Let's hope it will also help Al Jeff.
You are blowing his injury out of proportion. A torn ACL generally takes 18 months to recover fully from and that time will have passed without incident while he still managed to play pretty well. The injury will be a non factor. I don't know if you are right about him being a poor fit for the Jazz, but I have to think that many of his deficiencies will be fixed to some degree with the coaching of Sloan and crew and a winning team he can trust. He has never been put in position to be so successful.
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
Great post, memo is money. I won't quote due to the length. It's funny how many people who deride KOC like to point to him taking Snyder and Humphries instead of Jefferson. Now Jefferson is a stiff just like those other two. So I guess no harm done in that draft, huh?
Jefferson has NEVER played with a top-tier PG. NEVER. And last season, the Minn offense went completely away from his strengths. With DWill, there is no doubt in my mind Al gets 20-10 again.
And I especially like Al paired with Millsap (or Okur). Jefferson plays best around the hoop. He's going to do just fine in the P&R and cutting to the basket. Millsap has a sweet mid-range game and Okur is money on the 3's. Perfect complement to Jefferson, IMO.
Jefferson has NEVER played with a top-tier PG. NEVER. And last season, the Minn offense went completely away from his strengths. With DWill, there is no doubt in my mind Al gets 20-10 again.
And I especially like Al paired with Millsap (or Okur). Jefferson plays best around the hoop. He's going to do just fine in the P&R and cutting to the basket. Millsap has a sweet mid-range game and Okur is money on the 3's. Perfect complement to Jefferson, IMO.