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Following potential 2012 draftees

PKM said:
I'm not sure, but for me it just helps keep hope alive.1 I'm really not interested in watching another 10 years of early exits from the playoffs.2 I know some are of the opinion that makes me a fairweather fan .. perhaps it does, not for me to say .. but I want to at least BELIEVE we could be making deep runs/contending, one day.
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1- I am the same way. I was listening to the radio yesterday and I got tired of trying to get through. 100% of the people that were getting through said that getting to the playoffs this year was more important. I agree that the playoffs are important, but not more important. Talent wins championships. We have some pretty pieces, enough to do some damage and scare a few teams, but we do not have enough as currently constituted to win a championship. Anyone that thinks otherwise doesn't understand the game of basketball.

2- PKM, you might be considered a fair-weather (mostly due to Kentucky) fan, but I am certainly not. My wife calls me obsessed with the Jazz and the NBA in that order. I am anything but a fair-weather fan. Just because I can see the writing on the wall instead of hoping that some miracle occurs for this team. The talent available in this draft can be the difference. It is not a sure fire thing by any means. It takes good drafting, patience and a plan. I feel like this fan base is not patient enough to see that it is better to accumulate talent and then make a run. Look past the now and look at the bigger picture. (Sounds familiar doesn't it?) It would be much more different for me if the Jazz were competing for home court advantage in the playoffs. We are nowhere near that. Be patient and get a couple more pieces and watch this team mesh and you will see that it is worth it in about 3 years or so, maybe even 2 years.

/getting off my soapbox
 
We see it largely the same, orangello. I don't know that it makes someone less of a fan to want to desire to see hope in the future. I have a few friends that are Jazz fans that take a great deal of pride that they've been a fan forever, knowing they're following a team that will likely never contend, but will follow anyway. Honestly, I don't understand that at all. I will follow my team through thick and thin, bad times and the good .. but I would take no special pride in being some kind of sports masochist.
 
orangello said:
1- I am the same way. I was listening to the radio yesterday and I got tired of trying to get through. 100% of the people that were getting through said that getting to the playoffs this year was more important. I agree that the playoffs are important, but not more important. Talent wins championships. We have some pretty pieces, enough to do some damage and scare a few teams, but we do not have enough as currently constituted to win a championship. Anyone that thinks otherwise doesn't understand the game of basketball.

2- PKM, you might be considered a fair-weather (mostly due to Kentucky) fan, but I am certainly not. My wife calls me obsessed with the Jazz and the NBA in that order. I am anything but a fair-weather fan. Just because I can see the writing on the wall instead of hoping that some miracle occurs for this team. The talent available in this draft can be the difference. It is not a sure fire thing by any means. It takes good drafting, patience and a plan. I feel like this fan base is not patient enough to see that it is better to accumulate talent and then make a run. Look past the now and look at the bigger picture. (Sounds familiar doesn't it?) It would be much more different for me if the Jazz were competing for home court advantage in the playoffs. We are nowhere near that. Be patient and get a couple more pieces and watch this team mesh and you will see that it is worth it in about 3 years or so, maybe even 2 years.

/getting off my soapbox
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Exactly. I posted something similar to this in a another thread recently. Even if our youngsters develop well, I still don't think they're going to bring home any rings--they'll be competitive, sure, but not actual contenders. However, if we have lottery picks in this draft to add to our young core, I think we would have enough talent, that once developed, we could get over the hump and reach that contender status. Half of this board doesn't see it, but this draft is our chance to finally have enough talent to win it all, not just make the playoffs, and an opportunity like this won't come again--we need to take a chance while the door is still open.
 
Slow right now. Decided to go back and look up my first prediction in this thread. This has nothing to do with where the player gets picked, but I want to state whether the player under-performed (red), over-performed (green), or performed to what my pre-season expectations were (black).

PKM's Mock 1.0;

1. Andre Drummond
2. Anthony Davis
3. Harrison Barnes
4. Kidd-Gilchrist
5. Quincy Miller
6. Brad Beal - (probably closer to slightly disappointed)
7. Jarred Sullinger
8. Perry Jones
9. James McAdoo
10. Terrence Jones
11. Marquis Teague
12. Thomas Robinson
13. Austin Rivers
14. Jeremy Lamb
15. John Henson
16. Patric Young
17. Tyler Zeller
18. Festus Ezeli
19. Myck Kabongo
20. Tony Wroten, jr
21. Kendall Marshall
22. John Jenkins
 
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If being a true Jazz fan means that you must always root for the playoffs without any sort of strategy involved then I would say that Jazz fans would be less intelligent than I thought. The reason that I joined this forum was because I was looking for a place to talk basketball with other intelligent people that have a mind for it. I have not been disappointed with some but there are many that I wonder if they actually think about what they are posting before they post.


For those of you who consider the future as much as I do, thank you for your input. You make this board incredibly addicting as well as intellectually stimulating.
 
For easier reading;

Those in my initial top 22 that under-performed my expectations (though they would be better than they showed)
- Andre Drummond
- Harrison Barnes
- Quincy Miller
- Terrence Jones
- Marquis Teague
- Myck Kabongo
- Tony Wroten
- Brad Beal is close to this list but only because my expectations were sky-high

Those that performed better than I anticipated
- Anthony Davis
- Thomas Robinson
- John Henson
- Kendall Marshall

Those that played as I expected them to
- MKG
- Sullinger
- PJ3
- McAdoo
- Rivers
- Jlamb
- Patric Young
- Tyler Zeller
- Ezeli
- John Jenkins
 
Hadn't paid attn, but DX's latest mock has Teague all the way to 18. If true, that was one hell of a jump. I no longer think he's terrible .. but far from sold. He did put up 5 asts per game and didn't turn the ball over as much as Knight and Wall .. can score in bunches, but his outside shot needs major work.
 
Just my 2 cents I have been a jazz fan since 1983. I want nothing more then to have the jazz win a championship. One of my favorite things is to watch how teams build contenders. One of the ways is through the draft. That is the best way for the jazz organization to build. They are not going to be a destination for major free agents so the will need to bring complimentary pieces to their draft picks.

I think moving up a couple spots and nab Barnes would be great.

Marshall I am liking more then lillard right now.

Miller is a home run swing could be a home run could be a strike out.

If we have a second pick one of the bigs t jones, p jones3, either zeller, Sullinger, even hensen make sense. Trade value.

Lamb scares me to death but at times he reminds me of a young Reggie miller. Rivers is right here also mainly because I think the 2 guard spot is good with burks and Hayward.
 
Xthren said:
Just my 2 cents I have been a jazz fan since 1983. I want nothing more then to have the jazz win a championship. One of my favorite things is to watch how teams build contenders. One of the ways is through the draft. That is the best way for the jazz organization to build. They are not going to be a destination for major free agents so the will need to bring complimentary pieces to their draft picks.

I think moving up a couple spots and nab Barnes would be great.

Marshall I am liking more then lillard right now.

Miller is a home run swing could be a home run could be a strike out.

If we have a second pick one of the bigs t jones, p jones3, either zeller, Sullinger, even hensen make sense. Trade value.

Lamb scares me to death but at times he reminds me of a young Reggie miller. Rivers is right here also mainly because I think the 2 guard spot is good with burks and Hayward.
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Only one I don't like is Lamb. He's not big, he's not fast, doesn't show incredible bb IQ, and is not a lethal shooter. I think he's okay in the 14 - 18 range .. anything else is a major reach, for me. Also, I would probably take either Zeller or Henson ahead of Sullinger. Sullie's tough, so he could be good, but he's not real big, not real long, and not real athletic.
 
orangello said:
If being a true Jazz fan means that you must always root for the playoffs without any sort of strategy involved then I would say that Jazz fans would be less intelligent than I thought. The reason that I joined this forum was because I was looking for a place to talk basketball with other intelligent people that have a mind for it. I have not been disappointed with some but there are many that I wonder if they actually think about what they are posting before they post.


For those of you who consider the future as much as I do, thank you for your input. You make this board incredibly addicting as well as intellectually stimulating.
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I'm sure I speak for everyone when I say we're glad to have your input, too. You're one of the sane ones on this board.
 
@PKM

It really says a lot that you had Davis at #2 before the season and he OVER PERFORMED what you were expecting. Can't wait to see what he does in the NBA.
 
... just want to insert here that our best chance of being great sooner rather than later is by not ****ing up our cap room after next season.

If we are able to pull Lillard/Marshall and Crowder/D.Miller out of this draft + trade Jefferson for more help on the wings WITHOUT taking on significant salary beyond next season, then celebrations are in order.

We don't need to miss the playoffs for this to happen.
 
NAOS said:
... just want to insert here that our best chance of being great sooner rather than later is by not ****ing up our cap room after next season.

If we are able to pull Lillard/Marshall and Crowder/D.Miller out of this draft + trade Jefferson for more help on the wings WITHOUT taking on salary beyond next season, then celebrations are in order.

We don't need to miss the playoffs for this to happen.
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This is a very good point, and one that isn't mentioned enough. I do think that KOC is very aware of this, though, and has put us in a good cap situation looking forward.
 
NAOS said:
... just want to insert here that our best chance of being great sooner rather than later is by not ****ing up our cap room after next season.

If we are able to pull Lillard/Marshall and Crowder/D.Miller out of this draft + trade Jefferson for more help on the wings WITHOUT taking on salary beyond next season, then celebrations are in order.

We don't need to miss the playoffs for this to happen.
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Not disagreeing with anything you said, just trying to understand if you're at all implying missing the playoffs messes with our cap space? I assume you simply meant we shouldn't think our future is entirely predicated on us missing the playoffs, but not sure.
 
PKM said:
I assume you simply meant we shouldn't think our future is entirely predicated on us missing the playoffs, but not sure.
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Yes.

In fact, if we make it to the playoffs and Jefferson and Harris play well, they could up their respective values in such a way that they become worth more than our own pick this year.

In other words, the fans hoping for the playoffs are not off their rockers.
 
I get that. The only fans that I don't get are the ones that take a holier than thou attitude because they are staunch followers of a team they never believe will win anything. That being a fan of a mediocre team is the apex of fandom. And, yes, there are MANY of them. I'm not in tank mode, nor am I praying to make the playoffs. I just want to be looking into the future, making the appropriate moves NOW to get there ... Whatever that may be. If we do that, and fall short, I can live with that.

Just make every effort to win a championship one day ... Rather than early exits for decades.
 
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