Jazz V Spurs II Why a back to back with the same team only Stern knows

[sgjazzfan]

You don't understand what I'm saying! A win is a win. By your logic since we beat OKC they don't deserve to be in the playoffs. We've both beaten good teams, and lost to bad teams. You can say this about every team in the NBA. Your logic is flawed.

We have fantastic players on this team most are very young and still learning how to play in the NBA. Don't you think they will get better we will be a better team next year because of experience. The playoffs will only exceleratetheir development of these guys as a team and as individual players.

We have plenty of good players on this team, the only problem is most of them are young and unexperienced. It's not like there's a lack of talent on this team.

Yeah, so why should we want more talent?

 

[JazzFanNBama]

Because the Jazz aren't very good right now, and they won't do anything in the playoffs, I don't really want them to make the playoffs. I don't understand how you can want them to make the playoffs and get killed, rather than get young talent. How is that a bad thing?

I never said it was a bad thing! Don't try to make your point by putting words in my mouth. My point was we can use the playoff experience to our advantage. We have an infinite amount of "young talent" on our team. I don't understand how you think the playoffs wouldn't be good for us. Are the Rockets or the Grizzlies going to win in the playoffs? What about Phoenix? By your logic they should just pack it in as well and just start losing to get some "young talent". What a joke the NBA would become if everybody used your logic.

 

[The Thriller]

You don't understand what I'm saying! A win is a win. By your logic since we beat OKC they don't deserve to be in the playoffs. We've both beaten good teams, and lost to bad teams. You can say this about every team in the NBA. Your logic is flawed.

We have fantastic players on this team most are very young and still learning how to play in the NBA. Don't you think they will get better we will be a better team next year because of experience. The playoffs will only exceleratetheir development of these guys as a team and as individual players.

We have plenty of good players on this team, the only problem is most of them are young and unexperienced. It's not like there's a lack of talent on this team.

It's funny to see you insult other people's logic when you absolutely have none.

We barely beat a Spurs team at home without their 3 best players. That would be like barely beating LA without Kobe, Bynum, and Gasol... Or OKC without Durant, Westbrook, or Harden... Or Miami without the Queen, Flash, or Bosh.

What makes you think that a series with a fully healthy and determined Spurs team will be competitive? Or (any) of the top playoff teams?

I guess it comes down to this...

Is getting swept out of the playoffs in games that probably aren't even going to be very close to watch Jefferson, Millsap, and harris play 40+ worth sacrificing 2 lotto picks?

I think most fans realize that this team, especially now that they're suffering injuries, needs more talent than anything. Even the "experience" that they will gain by quickly exiting the playoffs, how truly valuable is it? Especially if they're blowouts?

Now how valuable are two lotto picks? Especially for a team that doesn't attract (any) free agents?

So continue to blast other people's logic, but at least they're USING some logic. Unlike you.

 

[Brown Notes]

I never said it was a bad thing! Don't try to make your point by putting words in my mouth. My point was we can use the playoff experience to our advantage. We have an infinite amount of "young talent" on our team. I don't understand how you think the playoffs wouldn't be good for us. Are the Rockets or the Grizzlies going to win in the playoffs? What about Phoenix? By your logic they should just pack it in as well and just start losing to get some "young talent". What a joke the NBA would become if everybody used your logic.

Actually a lot of teams do. Look around the league in any year there is a strong draft and you will see teams putting on a tanking clinic like GS is. Trade for a guy that is out for the season, then IR your best remaining player. Hire Mark Jackson who will start Jeremy Tyler. Those guys are incredible yet don't hold a candle to MJ who isn't even trying to lose. It's amazing how Mike can be the best his whole life. Greatest basketball player and now the greatest tanker the world has ever seen since Isaiah Thomas. Man that guy was good at getting his team to suck.

 

[zbone]

I would be all pro-playoffs if we had Favors and Burks playing 20+ minutes and Kanter playing 15+ minutes there. Even if it turns out to be a brutal sweep. Otherwise, there is zero real playoff experience for them to gain.

 

[Ellipse]

Let's make sure everyone understands what Popovich did tonight: He did everything he could to assure his team at least a 2nd round series. He WANTS the Jazz in the playoffs as his first round opponent, so he put this game on a silver platter and begged the Jazz to take it.

 

[JazzFanNBama]

Actually a lot of teams do. Look around the league in any year there is a strong draft and you will see teams putting on a tanking clinic like GS is. Trade for a guy that is out for the season, then IR your best remaining player. Hire Mark Jackson who will start Jeremy Tyler. Those guys are incredible yet don't hold a candle to MJ who isn't even trying to lose. It's amazing how Mike can be the best his whole life. Greatest basketball player and now the greatest tanker the world has ever seen since Isaiah Thomas. Man that guy was good at getting his team to suck.

I'll just say this......... Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I'm not even saying that I'm right. I'll guarantee you one thing, I'll still be that guy jumping up and down yelling at the TV in my living room 2k miles away from SLC when we're down 3 games to none and losing by 25 in the 4th game glad that my UTAH JAZZ left everything on the court in the 2011-12 season. That's all I'll ever ask of those guys. Heck that's all anyone can ask.

 

[Brown Notes]

Let's make sure everyone understands what Popovich did tonight: He did everything he could to assure his team at least a 2nd round series. He WANTS the Jazz in the playoffs as his first round opponent, so he put this game on a silver platter and begged the Jazz to take it.

Pops is good but even he can't guarantee Utah will win beyond tonight. Also he had those guys playing like they owed him money tonight. I seriously doubt Pops was trying to lose, rather was the victim of some hubris.

 

[The Thriller]

I'll just say this......... Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I'm not even saying that I'm right. I'll guarantee you one thing, I'll still be that guy jumping up and down yelling at the TV in my living room 2k miles away from SLC when we're down 3 games to none and losing by 25 in the 4th game glad that my UTAH JAZZ left everything on the court in the 2011-12 season. That's all I'll ever ask of those guys. Heck that's all anyone can ask.

cool story bro.

Fortunately, most of us are tired of that. We want a championship. We want good basketball. We aren't loser teams "happy" to merely make the playoffs and be spanked. Jazz fans have seen the playoffs. Been there done that. We'd rather miss the playoffs this year so that we can have another 3+ years of good solid playoff contention. No need to keep hovering around the 10-7th place in the west. Lets get a few lotto picks, get us some shooters, make a good solid FA signing, cut the fat via trades or amnesty or FA (like Big Al, Raja, Josh Howard, Earl, CJ) and build a team that can actually compete.

 

[sgjazzfan]

I never said it was a bad thing! Don't try to make your point by putting words in my mouth. My point was we can use the playoff experience to our advantage. We have an infinite amount of "young talent" on our team. I don't understand how you think the playoffs wouldn't be good for us. Are the Rockets or the Grizzlies going to win in the playoffs? What about Phoenix? By your logic they should just pack it in as well and just start losing to get some "young talent". What a joke the NBA would become if everybody used your logic.

Now you're putting words into my mouth to prove your point. I never said there would be no benefit, I only think it would be minimal, and not as great as adding another young talented player. I also never said that any teams should pack it in and lose. I as a fan would prefer they don't make it to the playoffs as they will not get a pick if they do. Houston is in the same position, so I think there is nothing wrong with their fans hoping for a pick as well.

My biggest concern is that our young talent is playing a minimal role in getting to the playoffs and will have a limited role in the playoffs (with the exception of Hayward). I want them to want to make the playoffs and to try to make the playoffs as athletes, but as a fan, I like the idea of getting a player (since we lose our draft pick, Phoenix and Denver won't so they aren't fair comparisons) better than making the playoffs and losing in 4 games watching AJ play 40+ minutes and shoot 20+ shots when he possibly (hopefully) won't be on the team when they have a real chance in the playoffs.

 

[sgjazzfan]

cool story bro.

Fortunately, most of us are tired of that. We want a championship. We want good basketball. We aren't loser teams "happy" to merely make the playoffs and be spanked. Jazz fans have seen the playoffs. Been there done that. We'd rather miss the playoffs this year so that we can have another 3+ years of good solid playoff contention. No need to keep hovering around the 10-7th place in the west. Lets get a few lotto picks, get us some shooters, make a good solid FA signing, cut the fat via trades or amnesty or FA (like Big Al, Raja, Josh Howard, Earl, CJ) and build a team that can actually compete.

Totally agree. I would love to see Milsap and Hayward in the playoffs (and hope to in the future for the Jazz). But AJ is dead weight that can score point because he shoots a lot, and Harris hasn't proved anything to me yet (he's been good for the last little while but he's been here over a year). CJ better not even be on the team next year (thats a better possibility with an extra draft pick). Favors needs AJ or Milsap to be somewhere else, as does Kanter. Burks really needs another season a lot more than he does 4 games of a limited role.

I really like our core, but our core is not all playing significant minutes right now.

 

[The Thriller]

My wife just asked me a series of questions and I thought that I would share it with this board.

She just asked me if the Spurs best players were playing. I told her that they were not.

She then asked me if the Spurs were the top seed in the west. I told her that they were.

She then asked what seed that the Jazz were fighting for. I told her the 8th seed.

Then she came to a brilliant conclusion. She asked why everyone wanted the playoffs so much when there is a good chance that the Spurs would win big in a sweep and the Jazz would lose their pick.

She also asked me if she was missing something. I told her that she wasn't.

She then said, "Wouldn't it be better to get some more talent and develop that talent?" I told her yes.

She just shook her head and walked away.

Women are getting this before some (admittedly, a minority, but still!) Jazz fans. Women guys, women. Women are understanding sports better than you are.

Unbelievable.

You know you're a dumbass when other fans' wives are understanding this concept better than you do.



WE NEED MORE TALENT! GOING TO THE PLAYOFFS TO BE SWEPT BY THE SPURS/THUNDER ISN'T BENEFICIAL!

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

Let's make sure everyone understands what Popovich did tonight: He did everything he could to assure his team at least a 2nd round series. He WANTS the Jazz in the playoffs as his first round opponent, so he put this game on a silver platter and begged the Jazz to take it.

That's crap! Pop's didn't sit his best players to make sure we get in the playoffs. If that were the case, he would've sat his big 3 the the time before a few weeks ago. The next night he sat the big 3. All he did was rest his main guys on the second game of a back to back. That's all this is.

 

[freakazoid]

We don't need anymore rookies......We need to find good vet roll players.

I know this is a crazy idea, but I wonder if the draft pick could be used in a trade to bring in other vets? I know this has never been done before, and it's probably even against the rules, but it's so damn crazy, it just might work. You should look into this and let us know what you find.

So we should forever just develop young talent, halt long term success. We have the future now! By making the playoffs we are essentially talking the young 4 into signing long term. Why do you think the spurs are so good. As long as we make the playoffs we have a chance to make noise. If we miss we don't.

First off, you constantly ignore the fact that Utah doesn't have to use their pick on a rookie. I'd say there's 50/50 odds, or better, that they'd use their pick in a trade for a vet or to trade up. We've got the 4th worst road record in the west. Teams like GS and New Jersey have better road records than us. Jazz fans overrate this team due to the fact that our building and home crowd give us a big advantage at home. Road record is a better indicator of how good a team actually is, and the reality is that we aren't a good team. Sorry, but we aren't making any noise as an 8 seed. Extending the season by 4-5 games isn't going to magically turn a bad team into a good one.

Playoff experience is quite valuable, but that value gets greatly exaggerated when you're talking about not being competetive, and mostly just getting embarrassed by a MUCH better team. The game in SA was a nice taste of what we've got to look forward to if we made the playoffs.

Our long term success will be much better served by upgrading the roster, than it will be to extend our losses by 4 games.

 

[freakazoid]

These games over the last stretch are almost as good as playoff games against certain teams.

Agree. Pretty telling that we barely beat the Spurs on our home court, with them missing their 3 best players. Nice dose of reality as to where this team actually is on the food chain.

 

[jazz_fanatic]

I brought my cousin and it was her very first game. She's been wanting to go. I've never sat by anyone so nervous and excited before. It was awesome.

 

[freakazoid]

I'm not even saying that I'm right.

Good point.

 

[royzzz]

I would be all pro-playoffs IF we had Favors and Burks playing 20+ minutes and Kanter playing 15+ minutes there. Even if it turns out to be a brutal sweep. Otherwise, there is zero real playoff experience for them to gain.

This

 

[Craig K. Manscill]

Women are getting this before some (admittedly, a minority, but still!) Jazz fans. Women guys, women. Women are understanding sports better than you are.

Unbelievable.

You know you're a dumbass when other fans' wives are understanding this concept better than you do.



WE NEED MORE TALENT! GOING TO THE PLAYOFFS TO BE SWEPT BY THE SPURS/THUNDER ISN'T BENEFICIAL!

This isn't a black and white issue. On paper, sure, you're getting an additional player in one scenario and not in the other. That's the only change in assets. However, there is no "stat" for playoff experience. And we all know that it DOES matter. If your team made the playoffs one year, the next they'll have a legit winning mentality. The obvious downfall to your argument is teams like the Warriors, who get awesome picks year after year, but still suck. Basketball is more complex than picking up good players, those players have to have confidence, and being in the playoffs will give all 12 of the players that, including our coach. You want to miss that for an average 14th pick? I'm not saying that I wouldn't love the pick, but it's a win/win situation as far as I see it, and you're naive to not see that.

- Craig

 

[Nate505]

I don't know what was more pathetic. The Jazz barely edging out a lame Spurs team or the bush league move by Pop for leaving his three best players way before this game was meaningless.