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Welcome back to Salt Lake - Mo Williams

august through december is not a great time to find teams desperate to make trades. trade flurries happen at the draft, in july, and at the deadline. i guess we could have saved the TPE for a week, but there was no guarantee we would get mo if we did.
And KOC's presumably already been working the phones, and has some idea what opportunities to use the TPE will be available before the season starts. Since the TPE expires before the trade deadline, it's entirely possible that this was the best deal available (short of playing a game of chicken with the Mavs and Clips).
 
I've been very clear that I love KOC and I think he's always been shrewd. The Al and Deron deals were great deals as I've also already said. And my problem isn't with Mo who is definitely an add. But bottom line, we didn't get enough in Mo to make giving away our TPE worth it. This will get spun and spun as the Jazz got a player for free, but the Jazz could have gotten Mo in addition to a pick.

Most importantly, if they tried and absolutely couldn't get a pick out of the deal, they should have walked away. Holding on to the TPE, and whatever risk they incurred by doing so, is worth more than getting Mo and hoping to get something for him at a later time. We devalued our TPE in this situation.
Is there any circumstance where you would change your opinion and believe that this particular trade was a good one? What if Harris and Al are traded for Igoudala next week (a move that would have been too risky with no Moe) and next season Moe and Iggy fit our needs like a glove. Under those circumstances would you be willing to say that KOC was right not to walk away from this trade, or are you really as adamant as you sound?
 
I've been very clear that I love KOC and I think he's always been shrewd. The Al and Deron deals were great deals as I've also already said. And my problem isn't with Mo who is definitely an add. But bottom line, we didn't get enough in Mo to make giving away our TPE worth it. This will get spun and spun as the Jazz got a player for free, but the Jazz could have gotten Mo in addition to a pick.

Most importantly, if they tried and absolutely couldn't get a pick out of the deal, they should have walked away. Holding on to the TPE, and whatever risk they incurred by doing so, is worth more than getting Mo and hoping to get something for him at a later time. We devalued our TPE in this situation.

I think you're making some pretty big assumptions here. I'm going to give KOC the benefit of the doubt that he has explored all options, and has a pretty good idea of what might be available.

Now, if you want to freak out about the fact that we should have stacked the deck last night in a big way, but couldn't because of 4 dadgumb stinkin pukin games, then I will happily join the freak-fer-all.
 
I think you're making some pretty big assumptions here. I'm going to give KOC the benefit of the doubt that he has explored all options, and has a pretty good idea of what might be available.

Now, if you want to freak out about the fact that we should have stacked the deck last night in a big way, but couldn't because of 4 dadgumb stinkin pukin games, then I will happily join the freak-fer-all.

Harp you are only continuing this campaign on assumptions and bluster. It is time for you to let go. I did.
 
1. He will space the floor. He will get the post guys more room to work with and Hayward and Burks will get better looks
2. He is an excellent free throw shooter. How many games did Harris blow by missing key free throws at the end. We now have a go to guy for free throws
3. He has to be re-juvenated and excited to be back in Utah. Wouldn't surprise me to see a career year from him
4. He is a more vocal leader than Harris
5. No way he is worse than Harris on D
6. Trading Harris probably gets us another asset
 
I've been very clear that I love KOC and I think he's always been shrewd. The Al and Deron deals were great deals as I've also already said. And my problem isn't with Mo who is definitely an add. But bottom line, we didn't get enough in Mo to make giving away our TPE worth it. This will get spun and spun as the Jazz got a player for free, but the Jazz could have gotten Mo in addition to a pick.

Most importantly, if they tried and absolutely couldn't get a pick out of the deal, they should have walked away. Holding on to the TPE, and whatever risk they incurred by doing so, is worth more than getting Mo and hoping to get something for him at a later time. We devalued our TPE in this situation.

This is an assumption that you are stating as a fact.
 
Hey guys, I think he has the 'clutch gene'. Did you see DaBron defer to thin in all of those plays ?!?!?!
 
Are we really keeping all these pgs? I realise we are going to use mo williams at the 2 sometimes.

It still feels like Harris (or Watson) gets traded.
 
I think you're making some pretty big assumptions here. I'm going to give KOC the benefit of the doubt that he has explored all options, and has a pretty good idea of what might be available.

Now, if you want to freak out about the fact that we should have stacked the deck last night in a big way, but couldn't because of 4 dadgumb stinkin pukin games, then I will happily join the freak-fer-all.

You keep saying you'd rather be in Houston's position, but everywhere I'm reading is saying what the Rockets did, this "stacking the deck" as you've put it, has blown up in their faces.
 
Welcome back Mo Williams!

KOC did a great job.

I don't understand people that wanted more of that trade. Sometimes it's just not the case to push for to much, to not spoil the karma and to not disturb the basketball gods.
 
I've been very clear that I love KOC and I think he's always been shrewd. The Al and Deron deals were great deals as I've also already said. And my problem isn't with Mo who is definitely an add. But bottom line, we didn't get enough in Mo to make giving away our TPE worth it. This will get spun and spun as the Jazz got a player for free, but the Jazz could have gotten Mo in addition to a pick.

Most importantly, if they tried and absolutely couldn't get a pick out of the deal, they should have walked away. Holding on to the TPE, and whatever risk they incurred by doing so, is worth more than getting Mo and hoping to get something for him at a later time. We devalued our TPE in this situation.

That's some pretty damn good spin there. But we ain't getting better than Mo Williams for essentially nothing. An All-Star player for NOTHING. This deal was time sensitive, it needed get down now. There was no revisiting this trade later. There's very little risk involved on the Jazz's part...he's only signed for one season. Keeps all of the cap space intact for next off-season. If it doesn't work out the Jazz can easily cut bait. I'm failing to see the importance of receiving a pick in this deal. The Jazz are already developing plenty of young players. The risky move would have been not making the trade and expecting a better offer that isn't coming down the line. It doesn't always pay to be greedy.
 
Billy, thanks for being a voice of reason. I don't understand why everyone is so excited about bringing Mo back. We already have an overpaid PG who is younger and better to start (plus good back-ups). Why overpay another? I feel KOC wanted to make up for his mistake for not retaining 20 year old Mo for 1 mil a year almost 10 years back. Well, guess what, getting declining 30 year old Mo for 9 mil a year doesn't make up for it, especially when we already have another overpaid younger and arguably better starter under contract.

With that said, while the move was pointless and will cost Greg some money, it did not really cost us any assets. Yes, we lost TPE, but if you look at a bigger picture, we cannot absorb any contract that's more than 1 year, because we need to save CAP space for next summer, when we can be a FA player. And in order to get first round picks for your TPE, you have to take on longer than just expiring deals, which we cannot do given the fact we can be deep under cap next year. Given this constraint, our TPE can only be used for expiring contract. Getting a first round pick is nearly impossible in this situation - especially with TPE expiring in Dec. So, KOC tried to get the best expiring asset he could, and Mo is probably it.

His plan is to come into next summer with a play-off caliber team and ton of CAP space, which would make it more attractive to FAs as opposed to bottom of the League team with Cap space. Mo does make the team better. So, he did it. Is it a great move - absolutely not. Could we realistically get a first rounder for TPE or a better player until Dec, given the fact we can only take expiring assets? Extremely unlikely. So, KOC did fine, not great, not horrible. This trade is basically a non event.
 
I can't wait for Mo to get some time at the 2, thus slowing Burks' development even more. Although Burks will be our point in the summer league which means come the season he could plays some point too but then, well, we already have four point guards. So yeah, Harris and/or Burks are pretty much ****ed in this equation if the former isn't traded.
 
I'm not happy with this move. This means absolutely no Nash and no Rondo. The best passer on the team will be Tinsley. Would have preferred trading for Calderon over Williams.

Who knows though, looking at it strictly as an asset acquirement it's a good thing. All those expiring contracts could be absurdly advantageous in December even if the team fits as badly as a pair of wooden shoes.
 
I'm not happy with this move. This means absolutely no Nash and no Rondo. The best passer on the team will be Tinsley. Would have preferred trading for Calderon over Williams.

Who knows though, looking at it strictly as an asset acquirement it's a good thing. All those expiring contracts could be absurdly advantageous in December even if the team fits as badly as a pair of wooden shoes.

At worst, this is simply ammunition for future deals. At best, this helps the team get past the first found.

I highly doubt we would have gotten better for the TPE before it expired. Williams isn't exactly a bad player either, so I don't see the merit in complaining about this from any perspective. Mo doesn't tie up future cap space and can help immediately.
 
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