What's new
By:

Will Millsap or Big Al come off the Bench at the Start of the Season?

Will Big Al or Millsap Come off the Bench to Start the Season?

  • Total voters
    40
Logically, if Al starts, then you need to surround him with shooters. I think the best "Al" lineup would be:

C - Jefferson
PF - Millsap
SF - Williams
SG - Burks
PG - Mo

With that lineup, you have an inside game with Al, 3-pt shooters in Mo and Marvin, a mid-range guy in Paul, and Burks to drive and dish.

Alternately, when you go with Favors and Kanter, you play a bit more traditional Jazz ball. Favors is the option on the P&R with Kanter crashing the boards. Hayward assumes the Harpring role of cutting to the basket or coming off curls.

What I want to see happen is the Jazz get away from a complete second "unit." There's simply no need to have 5 subs in the game at the same time. Cut down the rotation and you can have at least 2 or 3 starters on the floor at all times. Right now, unless/until a trade is made, the only players that should see PT (outside of garbage minutes) are Favors, Kanter, Millsap, Jefferson, Ma. Williams, Hayward, Burks, Mo Williams and if Burks doesn't get any time at PG, then Watson or Tinsley for 10-15 mins combined. Carroll, Evans and Murphy are injury insurance, play them only in blowouts or if someone gets into foul trouble. I guess you can also extend the bench when you have a lot of games (like 3 in 5 nights).

Eventually, the tax threshold will become an issue as the youngsters come up for post-rookie contracts. I think you can afford to pay 5 quality starters, a 6th-man and then a couple of good mid-priced subs, filling the rest of the roster with draft picks on rookie contracts and vet-minimum guys.
 
I tell you what. If Favors isn't a starter and not getting enough minutes, than in 2 years he will say: "Ok, you treated me like ****, so I get out of here.."

You can't lose a guy like Favors. Especially with this talent. You want to be good long term? Make smart decisions in time.
 
MoTown16 said:
Logically, if Al starts, then you need to surround him with shooters. I think the best "Al" lineup would be:

C - Jefferson
PF - Millsap
SF - Williams
SG - Burks
PG - Mo

With that lineup, you have an inside game with Al, 3-pt shooters in Mo and Marvin, a mid-range guy in Paul, and Burks to drive and dish.

Alternately, when you go with Favors and Kanter, you play a bit more traditional Jazz ball. Favors is the option on the P&R with Kanter crashing the boards. Hayward assumes the Harpring role of cutting to the basket or coming off curls.

What I want to see happen is the Jazz get away from a complete second "unit." There's simply no need to have 5 subs in the game at the same time. Cut down the rotation and you can have at least 2 or 3 starters on the floor at all times. Right now, unless/until a trade is made, the only players that should see PT (outside of garbage minutes) are Favors, Kanter, Millsap, Jefferson, Ma. Williams, Hayward, Burks, Mo Williams and if Burks doesn't get any time at PG, then Watson or Tinsley for 10-15 mins combined. Carroll, Evans and Murphy are injury insurance, play them only in blowouts or if someone gets into foul trouble. I guess you can also extend the bench when you have a lot of games (like 3 in 5 nights).

Eventually, the tax threshold will become an issue as the youngsters come up for post-rookie contracts. I think you can afford to pay 5 quality starters, a 6th-man and then a couple of good mid-priced subs, filling the rest of the roster with draft picks on rookie contracts and vet-minimum guys.
Click to expand...
Offensively this makes sense. What about defensively? On the defensive end Paul and Jefferson have shown to be a bad tandem. They are too short and slow to be real defensive threats and with Al being a pathetic PNR defender and Millsap not being much better we get killed with that lineup.
 
All I know is that if Favors doesn't start this year, he will get the **** out of Utah once his contract is up. There is plenty of other teams that would give him starter minutes.
 
Its also funny how we only gave Favors two games at the beginning of the season to start him and we benched him because he "wasnt ready", while Jeffersuck went 2-16 in the first game of the season and then the second game Favors had 10 rebounds in 17 minutes while Fat ****ing lazy **** bag had 5 rebounds in 30 minutes.
 
It really depends on if they want to showcase a player. If the Jazz are looking to trade either Milsap or Jefferson then they start. However, if they want what's best for the team than Sap comes off the bench. Simple.
 
InGameStrategy said:
The max or near-max players typically come in and start right away.

And just like Harris came in and started right away because he was perceived as the best PG by far (I'm not sure that that was always the case vs. a healthy Watson and Tinsley) and was getting paid far more FWIW.

What we're talking about here is competition for starting slots on the front line.

KOC is the general manager; not the coach. I highly doubt that KOC said "OK, Ty, I'm gonna trade for Marvin, but only if you start him right away." GMs wouldn't do that, and KOC especially wouldn't do that; neither would Greg Miller.

I agree that Marvin could easily evolve into the clear starter at the 3, and I agree that KOC and the Jazz took a chance on him because--as a 2nd overall draft pick with great length and physique--he has more potential then he was showing (or being used for). The bigger question is still who the other two frontcourt starters are by mid-season. Oh, how I hope that it's based on performance and matchups, not tenure. If Al were still doing his lazy / incapable PnR defense and help defense, I would bring him off the bench until he started putting forth more effort--even if it wasn't the best combination to start. But I would be pleasantly surprised if Corbin does that.
Click to expand...

I think KOC took a "chance" on Marvin because he is a talented player at a position of need. We don't need anything more than solid defense and a semi-consistent 3 point shooter. He will be about the 4th option on offense whether he starts or not. He, right now, is the best SF on the team, even if he's not an all star. We don't need an allstar at every position. Its OK to have role players, every good team has them, sometimes they even start.

You pointed out that some players get preferential treatment because they are in the Jazz system longer. I disagree. I think that they tend to work young players in much slower than other teams. Whether this is right or wrong is a completely separate debate that we don't need to get into right now (although it is somewhat relevant with Favors).

You also mentioned that players don't show up and start right away, which just isn't the case.

As far as this being about who starts on the front line. You brought up that Favors would be ahead of Marvin because he has been on the Jazz longer. I disagree with that and think that the two have nothing to do with each other, because I don't think they will start Milsap as SF, especially now that they have Marvin.

KOC's job is to put together the best team possible. I'm sure what happened is that he saw a hole at SF position and got Marvin because he fit that hole (and imo probably viewed him as a starting option). Now its up to Corbin to decide how to play them in the end, but KOC has to put the team together with what roles they will fill in mind. I never said that he told Corbin he had to start, nor did I imply that.
 
sgjazzfan said:
I think KOC took a "chance" on Marvin because he is a talented player at a position of need. We don't need anything more than solid defense and a semi-consistent 3 point shooter. He will be about the 4th option on offense whether he starts or not. He, right now, is the best SF on the team, even if he's not an all star. We don't need an allstar at every position. Its OK to have role players, every good team has them, sometimes they even start.

KOC's job is to put together the best team possible. I'm sure what happened is that he saw a hole at SF position and got Marvin because he fit that hole (and imo probably viewed him as a starting option). Now its up to Corbin to decide how to play them in the end, but KOC has to put the team together with what roles they will fill in mind. I never said that he told Corbin he had to start, nor did I imply that.
Click to expand...
Good points.
KOC's vision of a successful NBA team is one that has length, athleticism and versatility. He's constantly talked about the Jazz needing longer bigs - and why not, we got our butts kicked by SA and LA on a consistent basis because we could never match up. Favors has that size to match up against the elite PF's around the league. And while Kanter isn't a 7-ft'er, he's certainly not going to get pushed around.

In terms of the wings, he gets rid of CJ and adds Marvin. Now you Willaims at 6'9" and Hayward (and Carroll) both at 6'8. Pretty good size at SF. The SG rotation is now Burks at 6'6", Hayward and perhaps Murphy (also 6'6"). That leaves only Mo a bit undersized at PG.

Jazz will be one of the bigger teams in the league. They just need to get Millsap to agree to a 6th-man role, and have Jefferson leave via trade, replacing his roster spot with a tough, defensive-minded 4/5.
 
MoTown16 said:
Good points.
KOC's vision of a successful NBA team is one that has length, athleticism and versatility. He's constantly talked about the Jazz needing longer bigs - and why not, we got our butts kicked by SA and LA on a consistent basis because we could never match up. Favors has that size to match up against the elite PF's around the league. And while Kanter isn't a 7-ft'er, he's certainly not going to get pushed around.

In terms of the wings, he gets rid of CJ and adds Marvin. Now you Willaims at 6'9" and Hayward (and Carroll) both at 6'8. Pretty good size at SF. The SG rotation is now Burks at 6'6", Hayward and perhaps Murphy (also 6'6"). That leaves only Mo a bit undersized at PG.

Jazz will be one of the bigger teams in the league. They just need to get Millsap to agree to a 6th-man role, and have Jefferson leave via trade, replacing his roster spot with a tough, defensive-minded 4/5.
Click to expand...

Al Jefferson and the GS first for Joakim Noah and Brewer? Brewer to make the money work.
 
Favors wants to start. Favors needs to start. In Millsap's case, I think there is nothing wrong with going for "6th man of the year" because every point is crucial. He can also inflate his stats bc/ Milsap would absolutely wreck anyone's bench and he can also survive minutes with the starters. I just absolutely love the guy's attitude and work ethic and hopefully he won't go sour about being benched. I would still offer Millsap a lot of money to play off the bench.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page
Back
Top