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Grantland Article about Utah Trades and Approach to Free Agency

obviously last year's MO was to remain competitive and go as far as we could with that cast while still blooding the youngs. i just keep thinking that if any one of hayward, favors or kanter goes backwards next season the so-called 'short-term pain' could drag out for any number of seasons.

the all-out youth movement is a risky move for the jazz anyway as i wonder who'll still be turning up at games when we're 2-25.

still, i'm looking forward to it!
 
Yeah, Lowe is one of like, 3 nba journalists that usually get the Jazz.

But hey, not every one will be a winner. Hopefully he'll get it later in the season.
 
Xsy said:
Yeah, Lowe is one of like, 3 nba journalists that usually get the Jazz.

But hey, not every one will be a winner. Hopefully he'll get it later in the season.
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I figure he is just mad that one of the 'anti-tanking' teams has given into the dark side.
 
Lowe's not the only one not thrilled about Lindsey's FA moves...


This lot also seems to be pretty pissed off about the move (especially the lady, she really really wanted Millsap to stay). They start discussing FA moves from 19.30 min. onwards:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pN7GJsZkME
 
NUMBERICA said:
Exactly. If there's anything the org should've learned in the l ast year is that sitting around with your thumbs up your asses waiting for the knight in shining armor to show up miraculously at the last second is really just a dumb strategy.

Despite the Jazz owning this offseason, I am still a little bit miffed that the Jazz did nothing to capitilize on Millsap and especially Jefferson. I love this idea that Millsap and Jefferson were the only expiring contracts in the NBA because that's apparently what many fans and most in the media believe. I still feel like they could've been traded for lesser players on expiring contracts, especially if there was an extend-and-trade as part of the deal. But I'm just crying over spilled milk there.
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If the Jazz would have traded Sap and or Jeff at the deadline the GS trade is not possible. They got cap space for Sap and Jeff which is huge and often a lot better than getting players. Who were they offered that did not tie up cap space? I think they would have moved them for young players they wanted to develop but didn't hear of that either. They have proved they are not ones who sit around. The fact that a move did not happen doesn't mean they were waiting for the Knight.
 
r_u_s_t_b_u_c_k_e_t said:
Can you give us some examples of similar type deals that have been made the last few years? Thanks.
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On July 5, 2012, Houston acquired Gary Forbes and a 2013 first-round draft pick (the 12th pick) from the Toronto Raptors in exchange for Kyle Lowry.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_NBA_Draft#cite_note-JamesHardenTrade-22

On February 24, 2011, the Rockets acquired Hasheem Thabeet, DeMarre Carroll and a 2013 first-round draft pick from the Memphis in exchange for Shane Battier and Ish Smith.
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ibid

On June 26, 2012, the Houston Rockets acquired the 18th pick from the Minnesota Timberwolves in exchange for Chase Budinger and the draft rights to Lior Eliyahu.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_NBA_Draft

Previously, on July 14, 2010, the Timberwolves acquired Kosta Koufos, 2011 and 2012 conditional first-round draft picks from the Utah Jazz in exchange for Al Jefferson.
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ibid

On February 24, 2011, the Boston Celtics acquired Jeff Green, Nenad Krstić and Los Angeles Clippers' first-round draft pick (the 22nd pick) from the Oklahoma City Thunder in exchange for Kendrick Perkins and Nate Robinson
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ibid

The New Jersey Nets have obtained guard Sasha Vujacic and a 2011 first round draft pick from the Los Angeles Lakers (protected 1-18), along with the Houston Rockets’ first round selection in 2012 (lottery protected), Nets General Manager Billy King announced today. As part of the three-team trade, the Lakers acquired forward Joe Smith and two second-round draft picks from the Nets (Golden St.-2011 & Chicago-2012) along with the draft rights to Sergei Lishchuk from the Rockets, while the Rockets acquired guard Terrence Williams from New Jersey.
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https://www.nba.com/nets/news/Vujacic_Trade_Release_101215.html


The list goes on and on and on. The Jazz got royally screwed out of $24mm in valuable cap space, and lost two top 30 players for nothing in return. The only reason to be excited about the GWT deal is the satisfaction us fans get whenever the FO makes a move.
 
franklin said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_NBA_Draft#cite_note-JamesHardenTrade-22



ibid



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_NBA_Draft



ibid



ibid



https://www.nba.com/nets/news/Vujacic_Trade_Release_101215.html


The list goes on and on and on. The Jazz got royally screwed out of $24mm in valuable cap space, and lost two top 30 players for nothing in return. The only reason to be excited about the GWT deal is the satisfaction us fans get whenever the FO makes a move.
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Or get the satisfaction that our young players will receive good rotation minutes, allowing the organization to decide their futures with the Jazz.


Or capitalize on the deepest draft since 2003

Or understand that our cap space is renewed in a years time

Or understand that we have a 2017 unprotected pick-- which is in stark contrast to all of the trades you mentioned (most of if not all of them involved protected picks)
 
But no ur right lull lets compeit for 7 seed in deepest darfft 4 wining cultur n give no minut to KwameKanter+ Favers thy r yung still
 
dalamon said:
Or get the satisfaction that our young players will receive good rotation minutes, allowing the organization to decide their futures with the Jazz.


Or capitalize on the deepest draft since 2003

Or understand that our cap space is renewed in a years time

Or understand that we have a 2017 unprotected pick-- which is in stark contrast to all of the trades you mentioned (most of if not all of them involved protected picks)
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That doesn't negate the fact that the Jazz FO way overpaid relative to what these things typically go for. I like the trade, not in love with it, but hate the value.

WTS, doing it early is much easier than the season in full swing where teams become less optimistic and start revaluing their draft picks.

dalamon said:
But no ur right lull lets compeit for 7 seed in deepest darfft 4 wining cultur n give no minut to KwameKanter+ Favers thy r yung still
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That definitely makes your case stronger.

joker.gif
 
franklin said:
That doesn't negate the fact that the Jazz FO way overpaid relative to what these things typically go for. I like the trade, not in love with it, but hate the value.

WTS, doing it early is much easier than the season in full swing where teams become less optimistic and start revaluing their draft picks.
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How many of the trades that you mentioned involved unprotected picks? Can you think of any others that do?



That definitely makes your case stronger.

joker.gif
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That was mostly in response to the likes of Zach Lowe, Peter,and the rest of SLC dunk.
 
franklin said:
The list goes on and on and on. The Jazz got royally screwed out of $24mm in valuable cap space, and lost two top 30 players for nothing in return. The only reason to be excited about the GWT deal is the satisfaction us fans get whenever the FO makes a move.
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A nice list, thank you. Now how about a list of teams that couldn't make a deal at the deadline, for one reason or another... like the Jazz just a few months ago?

And how do you figure the Jazz got "nothing in return"? Seems to me like they did get something.
 
franklin said:
Do you think I'm undervaluing the protection? Or are you way overvaluing it? There's no guarantee either pick will be inside the top 20.
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You're definitely undervaluing the picks. A 21st pick (which would have gotten us Dieng....shudder) moved us from 14 to getting Trey Burke. So we get two, multiple second rounders, and one of the best specialty "Three and D" players-- that GMs are growingly valuing-- in the NBA altogether. Name a career >41% 3 point shooter that plays better D than Brandon Rush.
 
Remember how we used our 'worthless late 1st rounders' to draft DWill instead of Martell Webster?


Remember how Houston had a collection of "worthless late first rounders" that it turned into a 7th seed last season?
 
dalamon said:
You're definitely undervaluing the picks. A 21st pick (which would have gotten us Dieng....shudder) moved us from 14 to getting Trey Burke. So we get two, multiple second rounders, and one of the best specialty "Three and D" players-- that GMs are growingly valuing-- in the NBA altogether. Name a career >41% 3 point shooter that plays better D than Brandon Rush.
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A) The draft is loaded so nobody will trade a #14 and #21 for a #9.

B) I was pounding the Young Roger Braille 2.0 line when this trade was proposed here before it was proposed nationally. I suppose his contract shouldn't be counted against the total dollar amount. Rush will be a bad *** if he can recover from that surgery (at the expense of Alec Burks sorry Zulu).
 
franklin said:
A) The draft is loaded so nobody will trade a #14 and #21 for a #9.
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The loaded thing doesn't matter as much as the player that a team wants, I think. Even last year, if KCP was on the board at 9, Minnesota takes him and doesn't trade us the #9 pick.

Only issue with the fact the draft is loaded is that there's likely more players at any given spot that a team would want. I could see the Jazz using a high 20's pick to move up 1-3 spots, depending on if the trading team believes that the player they wanted is off the board and their second choice is going to fall.
 
r_u_s_t_b_u_c_k_e_t said:
Well done. Now, what is the likelihood that an offer like that was forthcoming? Let's be generous and say 50-50. Wasn't Lindsay smart to play the odds and just take the concrete offer he already had done, instead of waiting for the 50-50 chance of a better deal later? Seems like the smart move to me. I guess you disagree.
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That is what I have said from the beginning. It was a "safe" move, just got annoyed how people raved about. You would have thought we just got Paul George.
 
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