Hayward & Jazz - not close to agreement (Hayward leaving 4/40 on the table)

[Siro]

I like Hayward a lot.

With that said, I think 4/44 (if offered) is way more than fair and he should jump on it like a hot 18 year old (oh...he does that already )

Anything more is overpaid

I'm so confused. You're the OP, right? The one who started this thread to argue that 13m/y is a steal since there's a chance he'll be paid max money by another team if he goes RFA? You've defended your position for the past 10 pages, and now, all of a sudden, 4/44 is "way more than fair"?

 

[b_line]

I'm so confused. You're the OP, right? The one who started this thread to argue that 13m/y is a steal since there's a chance he'll be paid max money by another team if he goes RFA? You've defended your position for the past 10 pages, and now, all of a sudden, 4/44 is "way more than fair"?

This whole thread has honestly been like 15 posters arguing the same thing against each other. I think all of us want to get Hayward for way less than what he is asking for, and think the max we want to pay is 11.5 or so.

It is confusing about UD flyer though, posting that Hay should get all the money, and then conceding that he thinks 4/44 is fair. Glad he is not the GM...

 

[udflyer]

I am rooting for him to get 13 because I do think he will get that as rfa

I also like sticking it to the man



My practical side says he should take. 4/44 if offered

If either side walks in the next day I think he will not be with jazz next year

 

[Ben10]

If either side walks in the next day I think he will not be with jazz next year

I would say that the chances of Hayward not being on the Jazz next season is less that 2% He would have to get a Max offer with a large poison pill for the Jazz not to match. Cus if he gets anything around 13 in RFA its because he has a breakout season this year and well be worth that kind of money to Utah

 

[Fishsticks]

I am rooting for him to get 13 because I do think he will get that as rfa

I also like sticking it to the man



My practical side says he should take. 4/44 if offered

If either side walks in the next day I think he will not be with jazz next year

Wtf are you talking about? The players make more than the millers.

 

[cctrackstar]

It's almost as if playing him less is enticing other teams. They wonder 'what would happen if we gave him minutes'. If a player gets the time and underpreforms, the other teams know what he can do, but doesn't holding something back make others want it more?

 

[shadler]

I personally thought 8-9 million for him was too much but I guess It doesn't matter anyway. We are not going to get any big difference maker anytime in FA, and as long as we are able to keep kanter, it doesn't matter. If you can front load the contract, then it would be better for us in the long run. Trade him for Jabari Parker(draftpick) and then get Wiggins with ours . One thing is for sure... he better stop with his TO ratio if he resigns; He forces way too much.

 

[delpotro]

8-9 million?

George with incentives is going to make 16 million per

right now Hayward is the best player on the jazz team

 

[Ellipse]

8-9 million?

George with incentives is going to make 16 million per

right now Hayward is the best player on the jazz team

The best player on a very bad team.

Andrian Dantley won the scoring title when he was in a Jazz uni. No one could say he wasn't the best player on the team ... a very bad team. The Stockton/Malone era didn't arrive until after Utah traded him to Detroit. The Pistons couldn't quite reach the top until they traded him to Dallas. Dantley hated playing for Dallas (a loser) so he paid a $1,000,000 to buy out his own contract ... and as a FA, he couldn't get a team to make him an offer.

Best players on bad teams are soooo overrated.

 

[VINYLONE]

I like Hayward. He's a player the Jazz drafted and I'm a fan of the Jazz. from that perspective I want them to pay to keep him. But if I back away just a little I can remind myself that overpaying can kill a franchise for years and years. Not just until the contract is up, but for decades based on the possible opportunities that having bad contracts can cause the team to pass up.

This is a great outlook on the whole contract situation.

Also, how was the coffee?

 

[The Midnight]

If another team is gonna offer him wayyy more than we can afford when he becomes a RFA - would it be better to trade him?

 

[Gameface]

This is a great outlook on the whole contract situation.

Also, how was the coffee?

Haha, it was excellent. I'm a little inconsistent with the areopress but I've made some amazing cups with it. It's an amazing product in it's simplicity, ease of use, cleaning and end results. That coffee grinds up really fine really fast so I don't grind it as long as my other stuff and it helped reduce the bitterness. I've been going back and fourth as far as drinking the coffee without diluting it and diluting it. Both ways are really good. I like my coffee ritual so it's nice to have a big cup to drink, but for pure flavor I like it without adding additional water.

 

[VINYLONE]

Haha, it was excellent. I'm a little inconsistent with the areopress but I've made some amazing cups with it. It's an amazing product in it's simplicity, ease of use, cleaning and end results. That coffee grinds up really fine really fast so I don't grind it as long as my other stuff and it helped reduce the bitterness. I've been going back and fourth as far as drinking the coffee without diluting it and diluting it. Both ways are really good. I like my coffee ritual so it's nice to have a big cup to drink, but for pure flavor I like it without adding additional water.

Great to hear! Here is a good write up from SM:

https://www.sweetmarias.com/aeropress/aeropress_instructions.php

 

[NUMBERICA]

If another team is gonna offer him wayyy more than we can afford when he becomes a RFA - would it be better to trade him?

Yes.

As with everything, knowing the future is always the catch.

 

[b_line]

If another team is gonna offer him wayyy more than we can afford when he becomes a RFA - would it be better to trade him?

Or we could just get him locked up for a little more than we offered right now. That way we have a good player who is instantly tradable as well.

 

[The Midnight]

Yes.

As with everything, knowing the future is always the catch.

Yeah, OKC made the mistake of trading away Harden just as he was entering RFA. It would be interesting to see what Dennis does if Hayward had a good year statistically but didn't really enter that 2nd best player in a contender status.

If Burke doesn't develop the way we wanted him to, would Hayward for Rondo make sense?

 

[b_line]

Yeah, OKC made the mistake of trading away Harden just as he was entering RFA. It would be interesting to see what Dennis does if Hayward had a good year statistically but didn't really enter that 2nd best player in a contender status.

If Burke doesn't develop the way we wanted him to, would Hayward for Rondo make sense?

I thought Harden was an "extend and trade" situation, where he is just going into his max contract extension this year? It would be like us signing an extension with Hayward, and then trading him immediately, only to watch him become a top ten player in the league. Harden has been consistently about 15% better than Hayward throughout all his numbers in his career, up until last year, when he made a huge leap being a number 1 option on a mediocre team. His shooting percentage also went down to 40% last year, probably about where Hayward's will be this year.

 

[cowhide]

Yeah, OKC made the mistake of trading away Harden just as he was entering RFA. It would be interesting to see what Dennis does if Hayward had a good year statistically but didn't really enter that 2nd best player in a contender status.

If Burke doesn't develop the way we wanted him to, would Hayward for Rondo make sense?

OKC traded Harden because they overpaid for Ibaka and trade for Perkins. They couldn't afford a third MAX contract which is what Harden wanted.

The Jazz didn't get rid of Dantley because he was the best player on a bad team. Frank Layden got rid of Dantley because he went to the Union and complained about how the Jazz/Layden wasn't abiding by the CBA at the time. It was a dumb move and years later Frank admitted it was because Dantley was a stud player. Frank let it get personal and that is why he traded Dantley.

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

My stance is I'd kill to get Hayward extended for 9-10 million a year. Those who are rooting for him to get 12-13 million are just stupid and not jazz fans. Back on topic... I also feel that getting him at 9-10 million is not really possible. As of now I think he's worth 9-10 million, but believe he will at some point improve and out perform that price range. I think he'll be really good, and if we had to go 12 million to extend him then I'm fine with that as I have a funny feeling one one will go big next off season to get Hayward. I want the jazz to get the best bargain on Hayward, and that might mean over paying by a million or two.

Reading through this thread has been maddening because there are so many points of view as to how good he is or will be, that arguing money is pointless.

 

[Jazz4ever]

OKC traded Harden because they overpaid for Ibaka and trade for Perkins. They couldn't afford a third MAX contract which is what Harden wanted.

The Jazz didn't get rid of Dantley because he was the best player on a bad team. Frank Layden got rid of Dantley because he went to the Union and complained about how the Jazz/Layden wasn't abiding by the CBA at the time. It was a dumb move and years later Frank admitted it was because Dantley was a stud player. Frank let it get personal and that is why he traded Dantley.

OKC screwed up. Ibaka is on a great deal at 12 million a year, and Perkins could have been amnestied. They still would have been a little over the cap but well worth it. If Durant walks from the Thunder come next contract, they are going to look back on this decision and cry.