Diamond in the Rough: 2014 Draft

[8]

Da Burke hate is ridiculous. Y'all are eventually going to eat your words.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Da Burke hate is ridiculous. Y'all are eventually going to eat your words.

Most of the hate is a schtik continuation and a feeble attempt at trying to make a funny out of a very poor take on him pre/post-draft.

Not naming names.

 

[8]

Most of the hate is a schtik continuation and a feeble attempt at trying to make a funny out of a very poor take on him pre/post-draft.

Not naming names.

'Tis true. But many on here have him pegged as Mike Conley at best. I disagree with this. He's already much further along than a 20-year-old Conley iirc. I think he has much more potential than most think.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

'Tis true. But many on here have him pegged as Mike Conley at best. I disagree with this. He's already much further along than a 20-year-old Conley iirc. I think he has much more potential than most think.

Think most people compared him to Jameer. Will never been on Conley's defensive level.

 

[8]

Think most people compared him to Jameer. Will never been on Conley's defensive level.

Meant more in terms of just overall level of play. I'd say Conley is better than Jameer. Burke will definitely be better than Jameer.

 

[fishonjazz]

Think most people compared him to Jameer. Will never been on Conley's defensive level.

This

 

[fishonjazz]

Meant more in terms of just overall level of play. I'd say Conley is better than Jameer. Burke will definitely be better than Jameer.

He wont ever be as good as conley imo

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

LOL.. butt-hurt much bro??? Burke is a keeper, deal with it. Deron wished he has the same rookie season as Burke. He chucks and you blame him for not looking the pass. The guy is trying hard, has 15 assists and now you're saying it's not in his "makeup" and what you think he'll never be able to pass??? What a crock of ****!!! He's trying hard to play the kind of winning basketball this team needs him to - distribute the ball, but also score when he's called upon.

First kkk, not but hurt. I said before the draft, that I'd take Burke in the 15-20 range. So I didn't like the fact that we traded up for him. Talents like GF. Don't grow on trees, and felt we didn't need a shoot first pg on this team given that we have Burks and Hayward. What I see is a guy with bad shot selection. Many times it seems like he passes on opertunities going around picks and shooting a long two with 15 seconds on the clock when it looks like he has room to drive where only good things happen, either hitting a layup, or getting to the line, or dishing to a big for an easy score. I hope he fixes this, and hope he develops into a pass first that can score much like Deron is, was with us. To me he's to small, and not athletic enough to play the way he does. I hope it's just him being a rookie, and trying to figure things out.

Noah Vonleh is gonna jump 35", just like Blake Griffin..

the fact of the matter is once you hit the 240lb mark theres basically a 36" cap on all the verticals registered with very few exceptions, check any year. heres some similar sized players recently drafted(height w/shoes, weight, max vert)

Blake Griffin 6'10", 248lbs, 35½"
Tyler Hansbrough 6'9½", 234 lbs, 34"
Derrick Favors 6'10¼", 246lbs, 35½"
Ekpe Udoh 6'9¾", 237lbs, 35½"
Greg Monroe 6'11", 247lbs, 29"
Derrick Williams 6'8¾", 250lbs, 34½"
Markeiff Morris 6'9¼", 241lbs, 31½"
Thomas Robinson 6'8¾", 244lbs, 35½"
Terrence Jones 6'9½", 252lbs, 34½"
Jared Sullinger 6'9", 268lbs, 31"

now how does that compare to Noah...

well theres no concrete numbers, yet, but im sure IU's strength and conditioning coach isn't telling ducktales... Je’Ney Jackson said this summer, Vonleh touched 12' during testing a feat Cody Zeller could not accomplish (Zeller is 7', has the same standing reach and a 37½" vertical), according to Jackson only 1 player at last years combine could touch 12'

Jackson also has said he believes Noah has the potential to become an Elite Athlete “It’s ridiculous. It’s stupid,” he said, when asked how unusual the freshman forward’s blend of skill, strength and athleticism might be. “241 pounds and to be as big and athletic and agile as he is … He’s different.”

Noah could end up being a 20/10 guy with 3point range. whos to say he needs some huge adjustment period also, he adjusted to college way faster than anyone expected and Rebounding is the most translatable skill to the league right?

some use qualified statements to dismiss some of these prospects, like its a game of guess who... "is he a star?" whos to say or predict that. check out Jermaine O'Neal #17 in the 96' draft

10.2 mpg, 4.1ppg, 2.8rpg, .6blks .2asts -- 18 y/o rook #'s
13.5 mpg, 4.5ppg, 3.4rpg, 1.0blks, .3asts
8.6 mpg, 2.5ppg, 2.7rpg, .4blks, .4asts
12.3 mpg, 3.9ppg, 3.3rpg, .8blks, .3asts
32.6 mpg 12.9ppg, 9.8rpg, 2.8blks, 1.2asts
37.6 mpg 19.0ppg, 10.5rpg, 2.3blks, 1.6asts
37.2 mpg 20.8ppg, 10.3rpg, 2.3blks, 2.0asts
35.7 mpg 20.1ppg, 10.0rpg, 2.6blks, 2.1asts
34.8 mpg 24.3ppg, 8.8rpg, 2.0blks, 1.6asts

now take a look at 18 year old Jermaine...

... compared to a 18 y/o Noah, Jermaine looks considerably less developed. I think you can argue Vonleh is already bigger than Ian Mahinmi when he entered the league at 21, so i think he ends up about this size, if not bigger

inside out threats who also play D and rebound at 6'10 245lbs and 18years old do not come around every draft

I like Vonleh more then most here, and would be excited to get him with the 5th pick. I'm not sure we can be a great defensive team with Kanter as a starter. With the nba going more to the stretch4's Vonleh would be just what the jazz need, and he can still guard the bigger 4's, and not looked overmatched.

Da Burke hate is ridiculous. Y'all are eventually going to eat your words.

Most of the hate is a schtik continuation and a feeble attempt at trying to make a funny out of a very poor take on him pre/post-draft.

Not naming names.

First PKM, sorry about the game last night, was rooting hard for your wildcats.

Don't hate Burke, if you read any of my predraft stuff I thought he should've been drafted in the middle of the draft not the top of it. I never bought into the hype of that tourney game vs. Kansas. I think this is around the time his draft stock went up. I didn't fully buy into it. I want and root for him to be a great pg. if he can be a shoot first pg and succeed, great, but I see his 6ft frame and the fact that he's not the most gifted athlete, and seems to be a very inconsistent shooter. As of now I wish he'd use his quickness more to get into the lane get fouled or create more oppertunities for teamates, but I don't root, for or against the players on this team, just root for the team, and hope Burke proves me wrong. As of now I'm worried he may not have been the right pg for the jazz. Doesn't mean I'm a Burke hater for some stupid schtik. I'm not a Burke hater, and do see the potential in him, just don't like some of his habbits he's developed.

 

[Game6Conley]

I like Vonleh more then most here, and would be excited to get him with the 5th pick. I'm not sure we can be a great defensive team with Kanter as a starter. With the nba going more to the stretch4's Vonleh would be just what the jazz need, and he can still guard the bigger 4's, and not looked overmatched.

im glad to see a few have him near the top 5, i guess his rebounding is a tough sell in a draft where so many are searching for a quick fix on offense/defense

Noah should be able to guard some C's too his predraft #'s wont be far off from Dwight Howards

6'10¼" with shoes, 240lbs, 35½" max vertical (dwight's #'s)

 

[cowhide]

I would be fine drafting Vonleh at 8th and depending on who is there at 5 I would consider him. Again, I would need to talk to the kid to see how mature he is. He is only eighteen so there is a small chance he hasn't stopped growing. I love the fact he can shoot from outside which is needed because Favors is down low. I know the Jazz need another SG/SF but if he is the BPA then you draft him. I would then target a wing/shooter with the GS pick. Even though the Jazz would have a rotation of Favors/Kanter/Gobert/Vonleh, this isn't a bad thing because they could trade one of the guys to get another pick or a very good veteran wing. Having too much talent is never a bad thing. Right?

 

[Fabtrey]

Noah Vonleh is gonna jump 35", just like Blake Griffin..

the fact of the matter is once you hit the 240lb mark theres basically a 36" cap on all the verticals registered with very few exceptions, check any year. heres some similar sized players recently drafted(height w/shoes, weight, max vert)

Blake Griffin 6'10", 248lbs, 35½"
Tyler Hansbrough 6'9½", 234 lbs, 34"
Derrick Favors 6'10¼", 246lbs, 35½"
Ekpe Udoh 6'9¾", 237lbs, 35½"
Greg Monroe 6'11", 247lbs, 29"
Derrick Williams 6'8¾", 250lbs, 34½"
Markeiff Morris 6'9¼", 241lbs, 31½"
Thomas Robinson 6'8¾", 244lbs, 35½"
Terrence Jones 6'9½", 252lbs, 34½"
Jared Sullinger 6'9", 268lbs, 31"

now how does that compare to Noah...

well theres no concrete numbers, yet, but im sure IU's strength and conditioning coach isn't telling ducktales... Je’Ney Jackson said this summer, Vonleh touched 12' during testing a feat Cody Zeller could not accomplish (Zeller is 7', has the same standing reach and a 37½" vertical), according to Jackson only 1 player at last years combine could touch 12'

Jackson also has said he believes Noah has the potential to become an Elite Athlete “It’s ridiculous. It’s stupid,” he said, when asked how unusual the freshman forward’s blend of skill, strength and athleticism might be. “241 pounds and to be as big and athletic and agile as he is … He’s different.”

Noah could end up being a 20/10 guy with 3point range. whos to say he needs some huge adjustment period also, he adjusted to college way faster than anyone expected and Rebounding is the most translatable skill to the league right?

some use qualified statements to dismiss some of these prospects, like its a game of guess who... "is he a star?" whos to say or predict that. check out Jermaine O'Neal #17 in the 96' draft

10.2 mpg, 4.1ppg, 2.8rpg, .6blks .2asts -- 18 y/o rook #'s
13.5 mpg, 4.5ppg, 3.4rpg, 1.0blks, .3asts
8.6 mpg, 2.5ppg, 2.7rpg, .4blks, .4asts
12.3 mpg, 3.9ppg, 3.3rpg, .8blks, .3asts
32.6 mpg 12.9ppg, 9.8rpg, 2.8blks, 1.2asts
37.6 mpg 19.0ppg, 10.5rpg, 2.3blks, 1.6asts
37.2 mpg 20.8ppg, 10.3rpg, 2.3blks, 2.0asts
35.7 mpg 20.1ppg, 10.0rpg, 2.6blks, 2.1asts
34.8 mpg 24.3ppg, 8.8rpg, 2.0blks, 1.6asts

now take a look at 18 year old Jermaine...

... compared to a 18 y/o Noah, Jermaine looks considerably less developed. I think you can argue Vonleh is already bigger than Ian Mahinmi when he entered the league at 21, so i think he ends up about this size, if not bigger

inside out threats who also play D and rebound at 6'10 245lbs and 18years old do not come around every draft

obviously not every 35 inch vert is same. blake griffin is a quick jumper and he is fast, agile, & explosive. watch griffin and then watch favors. favors is slow as hell compared to blake. so vert alone isn't enough. i need to see court sprint, agility drills, and just how they look on tape.

also many do improve their verts after predraft. and some actually get worse because they get heavier. in blake's case, i believe he improved his vert by 2-3 inch just like dwight howard did. dwight improved his vert to 38 1/2 inch (evidence- his max standing reach getting measured at 12ft 6 inch with sports science).

 

[Jeffrey32]

Vonleh or Kyle Anderson

 

[The Midnight]

Vonleh or Kyle Anderson

I see you're straddling that fence well and truly.


I like it. LOL..

 

[fishonjazz]

i like vonleh more then most here, and would be excited to get him with the 5th pick. I'm not sure we can be a great defensive team with kanter as a starter. With the nba going more to the stretch4's vonleh would be just what the jazz need, and he can still guard the bigger 4's, and not looked overmatched.

iawtp

 

[The Midnight]

OK, my real question for Vonleh is how legit is his outside shooting? He's 48.5% for the season, but how many does he take each game? Like 1 shot?


Also Cody Zeller was setting the NBA on fire with his shooting during the draft last year, whatever happened to him? Anyone followed the Bobcats this year?

 

[Game6Conley]

obviously not every 35 inch vert is same. blake griffin is a quick jumper and he is fast, agile, & explosive. watch griffin and then watch favors. favors is slow as hell compared to blake. so vert alone isn't enough. i need to see court sprint, agility drills, and just how they look on tape.

also many do improve their verts after predraft. and some actually get worse because they get heavier. in blake's case, i believe he improved his vert by 2-3 inch just like dwight howard did. dwight improved his vert to 38 1/2 inch (evidence- his max standing reach getting measured at 12ft 6 inch with sports science).

these numbers fluctuate obviously, Noahs added a bunch of weight and still will jump in line with other lottery picks, his agility and sprint will be just fine he covers a massive amount of ground quick

he obviously wont be adding the same type of weight that Favors has either, different body types. Noah has those West African genetics.

OK, my real question for Vonleh is how legit is his outside shooting? He's 48.5% for the season, but how many does he take each game? Like 1 shot?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pn9gVdv4Sqo#t=50
check this out

as far as his shooting its 1 a game yeah but considering hes 6'10 240lbs and 18 years old with huge hands his range is pretty uncommon, also shows an feathery touch, his shot is kind of slow but it really does look like its going in most of the time

Guys like Adrian Payne didnt even attempt 3's until JR season

 

[Diamond77]

I say James Young!

 

[Getting Traded]

I didn't watch college ball until the tournament. Why is there no discussion of Napier. He's a much better defender than Trey and probably quicker as well, though the same size. I looked and found that he is moving up, however, on the draft boards. But he also is older, already 23, so that probably factors in.

 

[The Thriller]

Young, Napier, and Early are all Diamonds in the Rough IMO.

And I know I'll probably be flamed for this, but local product CJ Wilcox, who played @ Washington is an intriguing prospect I think. I would take him late 1st early 2nd. Very athletic kid with good skills, good (not great) size, and a really good motor/character.

Think of Brandon Rush before his injury and I think you're looking at CJ.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6nAHSWG5xas

 

[Duck Rodgers]

T.J. Warren. Easily the most underrated player in the first round. Though I would shift the picks around bit and take him a little lower.

Anderson and McBuckets would be good too. Not a fan of Vonleh.