OFFICIAL: Please list your favorite cap-space-rental trades

[Stifle Tower]

My guess is Carmelo is headed to Houston and LBJ will stay in Miami. LBJ said he wanted Napier and the Heat delivered.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

It's hard to find a good trade partner now. There are teams that would like to move salary like:

Houston
Chicago
Clippers
Memphis
Sacramento
Lakers - Maybe
Denver

I don't see a really good partner because many of those teams have already traded 1st round picks and don't have prospects I would want. I could see Denver moving Gallinari or Chandler. Chicago would like to move Boozer, but could just amnesty him so you'd just be getting late first rounders... Don't think they'd send Mirotic. Landry would be a good fit, but Sacramento has nothing else I'd want and traded their pick already.

Houston to me is unlikely. Paying Lin $15 M to ride the pine is too much for most small markets. I think he ends up with the Lakers when they strike out on the other free agents.... Maybe GSW. If we could get the Pelicans pick from Houston they might do the deal, but thats a lot of dough and we have a log jam at his position.

 

[[size/HUGE] fixed [/size]]

Denver did pretty well last night. I'd help them out salary wise and take back Harris.

 

[BTP]

About a week ago they said they had trades in place for both Asik and Lin if necessary, but would wait until they were sure. I would LOVE to see them dinged for "tampering." Even though the players have opted out, they still can't negotiate until July 1st.

If there isn't an official on tape or quoted in a newspaper saying that they prepare to pursuit LeBron and Melo there's no tampering.
Every info was backchanneled to media guys and the officials didn't say more than: "We're exploring the free agent market this summer"

It's hard to find a good trade partner now. There are teams that would like to move salary like:

Houston
Chicago
Clippers
Memphis
Sacramento
Lakers - Maybe
Denver

I don't see a really good partner because many of those teams have already traded 1st round picks and don't have prospects I would want. I could see Denver moving Gallinari or Chandler. Chicago would like to move Boozer, but could just amnesty him so you'd just be getting late first rounders... Don't think they'd send Mirotic. Landry would be a good fit, but Sacramento has nothing else I'd want and traded their pick already.

Houston to me is unlikely. Paying Lin $15 M to ride the pine is too much for most small markets. I think he ends up with the Lakers when they strike out on the other free agents.... Maybe GSW. If we could get the Pelicans pick from Houston they might do the deal, but thats a lot of dough and we have a log jam at his position.

A lot of teams are way below the league minimum salary of 90% of the salary cap. If you Give them Boozer, so they S&T Melo and add two future first rounders then you might find a partner. Like the Jazz did.

Boston is $22M($15.7M below minimum salary) under the cap before taking care of Avery Bradley
Charlotte is $20M below the cap. For minimum salary substract $6.3M from the number below the cap always.
Cleveland $22M below
Dallas is $33M under, must renegotiate with Dirk
Detroit is $30M under, have to take care of Monroe
LA is $29M under
Orlando is $24M under and that includes the partial guarantee for Jameer that can be moved
Philly is $29M under
Phoenix is $35M under and have to take care of Bledsoe
Utah is $20M below before addressing Hayward

So if you think that none of these teams might be willing to coop with Chicago and get a couple assets back then you're delusional. The West teams would be super happy to do it for 2 bad 1 st rounders, an Eastern team might want Mirotic or someone like this additionally because they're helping create a behemoth that might hinder them when they want to be competitive.
But the team that helps get Melo his 4 year $96M and ship him to Chicago will get something in return, and everybody else will not. And there's interest for West teams to keep him East and for East teams to send him West.

 

[franklin]

I'm not a huge fan of the players mentioned so far as they're too much money and will eat up too much playing time for our youth.

I'd rather take on some combo of Thompson, Terry and Landry from the Kings for their 2015 1st rounder. If they want protection, I'd accept top three protected, maybe top five or six, but this is a deal that makes sense in that those three guys can ride the pine or play 10-20 minutes without really affecting the playing time our youth needs and we'd get a potentially huge asset out of it with the pick. I see this as possible. If they were exploring trading the 8th pick in this draft to help unload such dead weight, they may still be open to the idea but for next year's 1st instead.

That's the first best option, obviously, but Sactown would still have to find a third partner willing to give them their guy since you're not getting them far enough under the cap to matter. Right now, that guy is Josh Smith, and they don't have to give up any draft picks in a straight swap with Detroit.

Greg Monroe might be a SNT option if they're willing to give him the max and Detroit isn't willing to match. I don't see any other FA's except our own to make this a match.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

If there isn't an official on tape or quoted in a newspaper saying that they prepare to pursuit LeBron and Melo there's no tampering.
Every info was backchanneled to media guys and the officials didn't say more than: "We're exploring the free agent market this summer"



A lot of teams are way below the league minimum salary of 90% of the salary cap. If you Give them Boozer, so they S&T Melo and add two future first rounders then you might find a partner. Like the Jazz did.

Boston is $22M($15.7M below minimum salary) under the cap before taking care of Avery Bradley
Charlotte is $20M below the cap. For minimum salary substract $6.3M from the number below the cap always.
Cleveland $22M below
Dallas is $33M under, must renegotiate with Dirk
Detroit is $30M under, have to take care of Monroe
LA is $29M under
Orlando is $24M under and that includes the partial guarantee for Jameer that can be moved
Philly is $29M under
Phoenix is $35M under and have to take care of Bledsoe
Utah is $20M below before addressing Hayward

So if you think that none of these teams might be willing to coop with Chicago and get a couple assets back then you're delusional. The West teams would be super happy to do it for 2 bad 1 st rounders, an Eastern team might want Mirotic or someone like this additionally because they're helping create a behemoth that might hinder them when they want to be competitive.
But the team that helps get Melo his 4 year $96M and ship him to Chicago will get something in return, and everybody else will not. And there's interest for West teams to keep him East and for East teams to send him West.

I think you misunderstood... I think it will be hard for US to find a good partner. Someone willing to give up something good to rent our space for a year. I think we are on the exact same page. There are way more sellers of capspace and only really a few more buyers so the offers aren't going to be really good. We won't find anything nearly as good as we did last year.

If I was the Bulls I'd amnestize Boozer before I would trade him with Mirotic... so all we would get is the crappy 1st rounders... not sure its worth it for us. Someone else, looking at you Philly, probably will take it.

 

[franklin]

I think you misunderstood... I think it will be hard for US to find a good partner. Someone willing to give up something good to rent our space for a year. I think we are on the exact same page. There are way more sellers of capspace and only really a few more buyers so the offers aren't going to be really good. We won't find anything nearly as good as we did last year.

If I was the Bulls I'd amnestize Boozer before I would trade him with Mirotic... so all we would get is the crappy 1st rounders... not sure its worth it for us. Someone else, looking at you Philly, probably will take it.

Agreed.

I think the best we can hope for is facilitating a 125%-150% exception at the trade deadline, after teams fill out in FA this summer. It's going to be tough to find deals for several months.

 

[BTP]

I think you misunderstood... I think it will be hard for US to find a good partner. Someone willing to give up something good to rent our space for a year. I think we are on the exact same page. There are way more sellers of capspace and only really a few more buyers so the offers aren't going to be really good. We won't find anything nearly as good as we did last year.

If I was the Bulls I'd amnestize Boozer before I would trade him with Mirotic... so all we would get is the crappy 1st rounders... not sure its worth it for us. Someone else, looking at you Philly, probably will take it.

Yeah that was a misunderstanding then

No matter how little you get back, I think it's better to be the one who nets return at all. I hope the Jazz are aggressive in free agency.

For the Bulls, they can't amnesty Boozer if they wanna land Melo via S&T, because you can't stack a trade exception with another player(You can't be like: I give you a $15M trade exception with all our capspace and add another 5 million in non guaranteed contracts that you can fire in exchange for a contract that pays Melo $22M in his first year)

I'm 95% sure about the trade exception rule as I read something about it last summer and my memory is pretty good usually.

And since Boozer's contract is expiring, amnesty rule would only make sense if they wanted to use the caproom to sign a free agent with it.

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

Not no but hell no!!!!!!

I want to start building a winner no more of this ****ing tank crap or talk!!

Hey! Maybe we can do this again next year! Let's just help one team a year get better

Good hell!!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[UGLI baby]

Not no but hell no!!!!!!

I want to start building a winner no more of this ****ing tank crap or talk!!

Hey! Maybe we can do this again next year! Let's just help one team a year get better

Good hell!!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

This guy toooootally gets it^

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Yeah that was a misunderstanding then

No matter how little you get back, I think it's better to be the one who nets return at all. I hope the Jazz are aggressive in free agency.

For the Bulls, they can't amnesty Boozer if they wanna land Melo via S&T, because you can't stack a trade exception with another player(You can't be like: I give you a $15M trade exception with all our capspace and add another 5 million in non guaranteed contracts that you can fire in exchange for a contract that pays Melo $22M in his first year)

I'm 95% sure about the trade exception rule as I read something about it last summer and my memory is pretty good usually.

And since Boozer's contract is expiring, amnesty rule would only make sense if they wanted to use the caproom to sign a free agent with it.

I trust you on that rule. I think they have more options than GSW had last year.

It may be better to use our space to sign above mid-level guys... One or two youngish guys... Hawes, Patterson, Ed Davis? Or attempt to go after Parsons, although he has a wink and a nod Boozer agreement with the Rockets I'm sure.

 

[BTP]

I trust you on that rule. I think they have more options than GSW had last year.

It may be better to use our space to sign above mid-level guys... One or two youngish guys... Hawes, Patterson, Ed Davis? Or attempt to go after Parsons, although he has a wink and a nod Boozer agreement with the Rockets I'm sure.

I don't like going after free agents unless it's to add leadership. And I don't see a lot of leadership available that would fit. I think you be patient, and let everybody develop another year and by time of the trade deadline you've figured it out and shop your guys.
Won't be a top5 pick like this year, but it will be 7-11 range depending on peripherals. And from that range Cleveland is money in the lottery
And if you aren't there will be very good prospects available, who can fit in nicely.

I just don't like giving up financial flexibility unless it's someone who makes everyone better and helps culture a team first mentality.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I don't like going after free agents unless it's to add leadership. And I don't see a lot of leadership available that would fit. I think you be patient, and let everybody develop another year and by time of the trade deadline you've figured it out and shop your guys.
Won't be a top5 pick like this year, but it will be 7-11 range depending on peripherals. And from that range Cleveland is money in the lottery
And if you aren't there will be very good prospects available, who can fit in nicely.

I just don't like giving up financial flexibility unless it's someone who makes everyone better and helps culture a team first mentality.

I'm on board with either strategy. It just didn't seem like DL really valued the late first rounder from some of the things Locke said, and also moving that seemingly good second rounder for not much. I am fine with picking up a few assets with our space if there is not a good fit..

As far as our record... I think we may be worse than you think. I'm assuming no Marvin, RJ, and that there is a learning curve for Dante. We will have the worst record in the west. I think we finish no better than 5th worst.

 

[BTP]

I'm on board with either strategy. It just didn't seem like DL really valued the late first rounder from some of the things Locke said, and also moving that seemingly good second rounder for not much. I am fine with picking up a few assets with our space if there is not a good fit..

As far as our record... I think we may be worse than you think. I'm assuming no Marvin, RJ, and that there is a learning curve for Dante. We will have the worst record in the west. I think we finish no better than 5th worst.

I wouldn't rule out some 'unexpected' improvement by Burke, Burks, Favors, Gordon, Kanter. This order indicates who I think will improve the most.

Tank squads in the East will be:
Philly
Boston
Milwaukee
Orlando
(New York) - 80% chance that Melo is gone
(Detroit) - 50% Chance that a good coach can't bring them much further due to their roster flaws that couldn't be addressed via draft

Tanksquads in the West:
(Utah) - 80% Chance that it's around 30 wins, which is borderline tanking to me
(Sacto) - 75% accidental tank potential
(T-Wolves) - 70% Chance Love is gone
(Lakers) - 20% Chance for thorough rebuild while avoiding to give Phoenix a top5 protected pick and attack free agency next summer

So I count 4 sure-fire tank teams and 6 more that have incentives to tank or semi tank.
At least 2 more will be sucked into the tanking regions because they start the season real slow and at some point trying doesn't make sense from a basketball standpoint and maximizing odds is best.
The East will be improved if teams can stay healthy. (Atl, Washington, Brooklyn are good teams when healthy)
Charlotte is nasty and plays good D to make up for their 1-dimensional O.
Toronto will retain Lowry and has a surprisingly good team that really fits well together #MasaiUjiri #F***Brooklyn
Chicago is good with or without Rose.
Pacers are too talented to not make the playoffs even if their chemistry is completely gone.
Cavs have a real coach and added a lot of talent. They'll be the 9 seed.

One Team in the West will decide to tank because they're falling behind. So I can make a point for the 7-12 range. If Utah sucked harder like real hard or is simply overwhelmed by the competition in the West, they may tumble with all their youth. But I think they can grab a lot of wins vs East teams and their home advantage high altitude should give them an edge at home to overcome their inexperience in meaningless regular season games.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I wouldn't rule out some 'unexpected' improvement by Burke, Burks, Favors, Gordon, Kanter. This order indicates who I think will improve the most.

Tank squads in the East will be:
Philly
Boston
Milwaukee
Orlando
(New York) - 80% chance that Melo is gone
(Detroit) - 50% Chance that a good coach can't bring them much further due to their roster flaws that couldn't be addressed via draft

Tanksquads in the West:
(Utah) - 80% Chance that it's around 30 wins, which is borderline tanking to me
(Sacto) - 75% accidental tank potential
(T-Wolves) - 70% Chance Love is gone
(Lakers) - 20% Chance for thorough rebuild while avoiding to give Phoenix a top5 protected pick and attack free agency next summer

So I count 4 sure-fire tank teams and 6 more that have incentives to tank or semi tank.
At least 2 more will be sucked into the tanking regions because they start the season real slow and at some point trying doesn't make sense from a basketball standpoint and maximizing odds is best.
The East will be improved if teams can stay healthy. (Atl, Washington, Brooklyn are good teams when healthy)
Charlotte is nasty and plays good D to make up for their 1-dimensional O.
Toronto will retain Lowry and has a surprisingly good team that really fits well together #MasaiUjiri #F***Brooklyn
Chicago is good with or without Rose.
Pacers are too talented to not make the playoffs even if their chemistry is completely gone.
Cavs have a real coach and added a lot of talent. They'll be the 9 seed.

One Team in the West will decide to tank because they're falling behind. So I can make a point for the 7-12 range. If Utah sucked harder like real hard or is simply overwhelmed by the competition in the West, they may tumble with all their youth. But I think they can grab a lot of wins vs East teams and their home advantage high altitude should give them an edge at home to overcome their inexperience in meaningless regular season games.

Good analysis. I think its close. The determining factor will be injuries. We stayed relatively healthy last year... a little too healthy. If we don't add depth and lose Hayward, Favors, Burks, or Maybe Burke for a while we could go into JLIII - Tank Mode. I think we are clearly better than the 3 East tankers (I think Boston may be better if they can't find a Rondo taker), but since we play in the West we drop a little in the standings. My guess is our range is 4 - 9 if we don't add anything significant. We are probably awfully close on our projection.

 

[[size/HUGE] fixed [/size]]

I agree that we'll be pretty bad, but...

Exum > Garrett
Burke year 2 > Burke year 1
Hood is probably > Jefferson
Snyder is probably > Corbin

And I don't think we're done.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I agree that we'll be pretty bad, but...

Exum > Garrett
Burke year 2 > Burke year 1
Hood is probably > Jefferson
Snyder is probably > Corbin

And I don't think we're done.

I think RJ and Marvin were pretty good for us last year and we stayed really healthy. We went 0-14 I believe when Trey was out. I agree we aren't done. I have hope for Snyder, but young teams don't win much.

Also, not 100% sure Hayward is back. I think we are likely plus or minus 3 wins from our record last year, but that we see more progress in the young guys.

The one reservation is Burke and Burks could make a leap that really helps us. The thing I liked with Burke is I felt like he really helped us win games... if he makes a leap we could win 5-7 more games this year.

 

[silesian]

Just worry about the Jazz

That's my biggest concern with anything in the west, but particularly Houston and GSW.

As you know, I am Bodhi's alt, which is why I am shocked to find myself disagreeing with him (I mean myself). I say you do the deal that most benefits the Jazz and not worry how much it helps someone else. Couple reasons: (1) we won't be challenging for championship anytime soon; (2) If we don't facilitate someone else might and Jazz improve less (3) no way to know how this helps or does not help other teams (let's see, how many championships has Melo accumulated so far?)

 

[silesian]

Not no but hell no!!!!!!

I want to start building a winner no more of this ****ing tank crap or talk!!

Hey! Maybe we can do this again next year! Let's just help one team a year get better

Good hell!!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I don't think it is a matter of trying to lose games, but rather of how to best build the future. If we take on $15M in expiring contracts and land two future firsts and a top prospect, you take the deal. Put the bum on the bench, play the kids, develop and (incidentally) wind up late lottery. Play to win. Book it.

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

I don't think it is a matter of trying to lose games, but rather of how to best build the future. If we take on $15M in expiring contracts and land two future firsts and a top prospect, you take the deal. Put the bum on the bench, play the kids, develop and (incidentally) wind up late lottery. Play to win. Book it.

So your brilliant idea is two more picks?!?!?! Are we destined to do this every year. Our core is in place let's build a god damn team. We need some vets. You don't build a contender on young players alone! Do you think we are going to keep all of these guys for the next ten + years? We need solid vets to take away the sting of the good talent we will lose to sustain the core talent that will be here for the long haul.