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Hayward has agreed to an offer with Hornets

One question I have is can the Jazz make their own contract with a guaranteed fourth year, or do they only have the option of the exact offer charlotte gives him once the offer is signed?
 
b_line said:
I get that you like Burks, and you are my bro. But there is no way in hell Burks is better than Hayward.

I like me some Burks too, but Hayward is so much better all around than Burks. Hayward has playmaking abilities that Burks will never have, Hayward's defense is better, and Hayward has better size.
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Sorry bro but at the end of last year there were quite a few posters who believed burks to be better than hayward...... despite being younger, less experienced and more screwed over by corbin.

I know naos, and billy shelby think burks is better and they were never burks homers.

I think bawse dawg does too.
Gvc is a maybe.

Doublea does
Ellis might

Then there are about 5 burks homers that believe he is better.

Spycam and revolution might think burks is better.

Thats just off the top of my head.


Point is, burks is my favorite player in the nba and i would say hell no to the jazz offering him a contract like this
 
fishonjazz said:
Said washington (gilbert arenas) toronto (bargnani) indiana (hibbert) and many other teams who made the mistake of giving foolish contracts to undeserving players.

Atlanta was all like "we cant let our best player go" when they paid joe johnson.
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All of those guys were tradeable too... in most case they got assets back for those guys. If Indiana wanted to trade Hibbert they could absolutely get more than just expirings.
 
b_line said:
Who? Favors is the only one who is as good or better than Hayward at this point.
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Well you just answered your own ? Didnt ya
 
Core4 said:
Is Hayward a marquee player? That should be the #1 consideration.
Does having Gordon at 25% of the cap and then likely 30% (if he even AGREES to re-sign in 3 years) make it impossible to build a contender?
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1. Gordo is not a marquee player.

2. If Gordo's offer sheet is matched, and he proves difficult to move for anything of value down the line, he'd be the only hard to move contract on the team.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
If he has played his way into 20 M at that point aren't you doing cartwheels about the current deal... worrying about that 4th year option is a little silly if he is overpaid right.
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Nope. I'm saying Hayward will be who he is: a 3rd option who wants to be paid like a superstar. Just like DW was jealous of CP; Hayward will always be in the shadow of Paul George. He'll be overpaid now and he'll want to be overpaid 4 years from now. Again, he's going to be an UNRESTRICTED free agent. So you pay him $20M+ or he walks. Meanwhile, you could have been using the $15M in cap space to acquire other assets or trade for a starting SF.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
All of those guys were tradeable too... in most case they got assets back for those guys. If Indiana wanted to trade Hibbert they could absolutely get more than just expirings.
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I think you are wrong. I remember toronto and washington being very desperate to trade arenas and bargnani
 
Core4 said:
Is Hayward a marquee player? That should be the #1 consideration.
Does having Gordon at 25% of the cap and then likely 30% (if he even AGREES to re-sign in 3 years) make it impossible to build a contender?
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It is not once a max player always a max player... If he get a max offer in 3 years it is because he played like a boss. Why is it even a problem?
 
fishonjazz said:
Sorry bro but at the end of last year there were quite a few posters who believed burks to be better than hayward...... despite being younger, less experienced and more screwed over by corbin.

I know naos, and billy shelby think burks is better and they were never burks homers.

I think bawse dawg does too.
Gvc is a maybe.

Doublea does
Ellis might

Then there are about 5 burks homers that believe he is better.

Spycam and revolution might think burks is better.

Thats just off the top of my head.


Point is, burks is my favorite player in the nba and i would say hell no to the jazz offering him a contract like this
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I get that people like Burks. I like Burks too. I just don't think he will ever be the all around player that Hayward is.

I am pretty sure most of the league views Hayward as a much better player than Burks, regardless of what some of the posters on Jazzfanz think.
 
GVC said:
Without Hayward, they'll likely have $25-30mm in cap space next summer. Who are these 3 marquee players that can be had for <$30mm combined?
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well 2 marquee guys, then a 3rd around mid-level.under the cap, the jazz could then match Burks and Kanter to go over the cap, and then use an Exception for another player.

DeAndre Jordan, Marc Gasol, Brook Lopez, Kevin Loveand LaMarcus Aldridge are unrestricted, im sure they would need near the max though.

Rajon Rondo is a player id target if forming a trio of free agent vets, Goran Dragic will certainly be a FA next summer. Rondo might be able to be had around 9-10 mil if you give him years and an option.

Gerald Green could end up a bigger $ contract next year, His #'s were great this past season, id take him for 4 years and 36 mil if he has a similar season, 40% from 3 on 6.2 attempts last year.

Danny Green is unrestricted, hes not marquee but worthy of note.

If Rudy Gay were to have a monster year i wouldnt rule him out either, hed have to be great though.

Theres some less expensive options too.. Wesley Mathews is unrestricted,Marco Bellinelli, Thaddeus Young, Jeff Green, Demarre Carroll... Millsap is a UFA again.

Outbidding OKC on Reggie Jackson if he has a monster season might be an option too.

The Jazz could offer max contracts to Kahwi Leonard and Klay Thompson to start off free agency with 30 mil.
 
fishonjazz said:
I think you are wrong. I remember toronto and washington being very desperate to trade arenas and bargnani
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NY gave up picks and contracts for Bargnani (Massai is a magician)... Wizards got Rashard Lewis on a shorter contract. Also, those contracts were longer than Hayward's.
 
Core4 said:
Nope. I'm saying Hayward will be who he is: a 3rd option who wants to be paid like a superstar. Just like DW was jealous of CP; Hayward will always be in the shadow of Paul George. He'll be overpaid now and he'll want to be overpaid 4 years from now. Again, he's going to be an UNRESTRICTED free agent. So you pay him $20M+ or he walks. Meanwhile, you could have been using the $15M in cap space to acquire other assets or trade for a starting SF.
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No one will pay him $20 M if he is not worth it. He'll be older then and won't be able to bank on any further growth. So if he plays his way to a $20 M dollar deal then the fact that we got him for 15 per for 3 will be a steal.
 
b_line said:
I get that people like Burks. I like Burks too. I just don't think he will ever be the all around player that Hayward is.
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So what? When you have elite scorers/creators and defenders, you're better off filling out your roster with specialists. I don't see Gordo being much of a difference maker on a good team. Burks can at least competently fill a 6th man role.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
NY gave up picks and contracts for Bargnani (Massai is a magician)... Wizards got Rashard Lewis on a shorter contract. Also, those contracts were longer than Hayward's.
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Joe Johnson proves that nobody is untradeable. The shorter contracts is a big reason to consider matching the deal. He either outplays the contract and you're ecstatic that you have the freedom to offer him another max contract with his Bird Rights, or you move on and build around Exum, Kanter, Burks or whoever might have stepped up in the meantime.
 
b_line said:
I am pretty sure most of the league views Hayward as a much better player than Burks, regardless of what some of the posters on Jazzfanz think.
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Definately.

Apples to oranges in playing time and exposure doe.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
NY gave up picks and contracts for Bargnani (Massai is a magician)... Wizards got Rashard Lewis on a shorter contract. Also, those contracts were longer than Hayward's.
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Tell me the good stuff that toronto and washington got.

(Rashard lewis is not good stuff)

What were the draft picks and contracts that new york gave to toronto
 
Ellis269 said:
Joe Johnson proves that nobody is untradeable. The shorter contracts is a big reason to consider matching the deal. He either outplays the contract and you're ecstatic that you have the freedom to offer him another max contract with his Bird Rights, or you move on and build around Exum, Kanter, Burks or whoever might have stepped up in the meantime.
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The other thing is Hayward fits in with almost any team because of his versatility. If we wanted to move him next year we could get back our cap space and likely some first rounders for him.

Also, I think Burks is closer to Hayward in terms of talent than some posters. I think it is very close, but I don't think he has as much of a market as Hayward does so he'll likely get paid less. After this deal I don't think we will be able to extend either Burks or Kanter unless we overpaid, but that really has nothing to do with whether or not we match.... the market is already set the high price.
 
I think some of us think that Burks can be better than Hayward.

What if Burks averages 18/4/3 next season on 45% fg and 35% 3pt? I could see him easily doing that, especially in Snyder's offense. Should we have to match a max contract for him too? Those numbers are better than hayward's this year...

This just seems like a bad idea.
 
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