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6/16 Ford Mock Draft 5.0- WHITESIDE 22!!!!

Anyone else worried that none of the big men are going to pan out? All seem to have glaring defects.

Whiteside could easily turn out to be a bust, like that big french big man on Denver... I can't remember his name... Talented but horrible. Or that really crappy Dallas center that they traded a year or so ago... His name was like Udoh or something, wasn't it?
Udoh is talented, but could easily turn out to be a "meh" kind of player like Emeka Okafor.
Monroe just doesn't impress me at all. To me, I think he's like a less athletic Charlie Villanova. At best, he's Channing Frye. Hardly anything to get excited over.
Aldrich will most likely end up being a better version of Joel Phzilla. At his peak he might be Chris Kaman. Now, I understand he had a great year last year. But take away last year's stats and he's a career 11 point, 8.6 rebound, 1.5 block guy. That's ok. But, to me, that's not all that wonderful...

Perhaps the best thing for the Jazz is to do is to draft the best wing available and then hope that they can work on getting the PF/Cs that they want in the draft next year, FA, via trades, or with Tomic.
I've never seen Luke Babbitt play (other than youtube clips) but from what I've heard he could be a talented scorer in the NBA. As could a few other wings that we've talked about, Amiu, Henry, etc.
 
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The Thriller said:
Anyone else worried that none of the big men are going to pan out? All seem to have glaring defects.

Whiteside could easily turn out to be a bust, like that big french big man on Denver... I can't remember his name... Talented but horrible. Or that really crappy Dallas center that they traded a year or so ago... His name was like Udoh or something, wasn't it?
Udoh is talented, but could easily turn out to be a "meh" kind of player like Emeka Okafor.
Monroe just doesn't impress me at all. To me, I think he's like a less athletic Charlie Villanova. At best, he's Channing Frye. Hardly anything to get excited over.
Aldrich will most likely end up being a better version of Joel Phzilla. At his peak he might be Chris Kaman. Now, I understand he had a great year last year. But take away last year's stats and he's a career 11 point, 8.6 rebound, 1.5 block guy. That's ok. But, to me, that's not all that wonderful...

Perhaps the best thing for the Jazz is to do is to draft the best wing available and then hope that they can work on getting the PF/Cs that they want in the draft next year, FA, via trades, or with Tomic.
I've never seen Luke Babbitt play (other than youtube clips) but from what I've heard he could be a talented scorer in the NBA. As could a few other wings that we've talked about, Amiu, Henry, etc.
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I don't care who the Jazz Darft, I don't want them to Darft anyone that can't play PF/C
 
I'm guessing most teams have figured out he won't get meaningful minutes until year 3. Somebody will be willing to (pay and) wait. But it's not going to be anyone who needs contributors sooner at his position.
 
If we can draft someone that we can project as a potential "closer" or clutch player then we should consider that than getting a big stiff. D-will, for all his contributions to the Jazz and his "clutch" exploits in Illinois, is not really a clutch player. I even think that, given enough chances, Sundiata could be a better clutch player than Deron. Of course I based this assessment on the number of chances D-will gets to score on last second shots, be it on end of quarters (usually 4 to 5 seconds still on the clock when he shoots) or end of games. His percentage is really bad on last second attempts on the basket. Gaines, on limited stints on end of quarters (and game! :D ), converts them better. So be it Babbitt or Hayward, we really need someone who can create his offense when the clock is ticking....and CONVERT it.
 
corrsty said:
If we can draft someone that we can project as a potential "closer" or clutch player then we should consider that than getting a big stiff. D-will, for all his contributions to the Jazz and his "clutch" exploits in Illinois, is not really a clutch player. I even think that, given enough chances, Sundiata could be a better clutch player than Deron. Of course I based this assessment on the number of chances D-will gets to score on last second shots, be it on end of quarters (usually 4 to 5 seconds still on the clock when he shoots) or end of games. His percentage is really bad on last second attempts on the basket. Gaines, on limited stints on end of quarters (and game! :D ), converts them better. So be it Babbitt or Hayward, we really need someone who can create his offense when the clock is ticking....and CONVERT it.
Click to expand...

Solid first post.
 
corrsty said:
If we can draft someone that we can project as a potential "closer" or clutch player then we should consider that than getting a big stiff. D-will, for all his contributions to the Jazz and his "clutch" exploits in Illinois, is not really a clutch player. I even think that, given enough chances, Sundiata could be a better clutch player than Deron. Of course I based this assessment on the number of chances D-will gets to score on last second shots, be it on end of quarters (usually 4 to 5 seconds still on the clock when he shoots) or end of games. His percentage is really bad on last second attempts on the basket. Gaines, on limited stints on end of quarters (and game! :D ), converts them better. So be it Babbitt or Hayward, we really need someone who can create his offense when the clock is ticking....and CONVERT it.
Click to expand...
You're ****-ing kidding me.
 
The Thriller said:
Anyone else worried that none of the big men are going to pan out? All seem to have glaring defects.

Whiteside could easily turn out to be a bust, like that big french big man on Denver... I can't remember his name... Talented but horrible. Or that really crappy Dallas center that they traded a year or so ago... His name was like Udoh or something, wasn't it?
Udoh is talented, but could easily turn out to be a "meh" kind of player like Emeka Okafor.
Monroe just doesn't impress me at all. To me, I think he's like a less athletic Charlie Villanova. At best, he's Channing Frye. Hardly anything to get excited over.
Aldrich will most likely end up being a better version of Joel Phzilla. At his peak he might be Chris Kaman. Now, I understand he had a great year last year. But take away last year's stats and he's a career 11 point, 8.6 rebound, 1.5 block guy. That's ok. But, to me, that's not all that wonderful...

Perhaps the best thing for the Jazz is to do is to draft the best wing available and then hope that they can work on getting the PF/Cs that they want in the draft next year, FA, via trades, or with Tomic.
I've never seen Luke Babbitt play (other than youtube clips) but from what I've heard he could be a talented scorer in the NBA. As could a few other wings that we've talked about, Amiu, Henry, etc.
Click to expand...

I understand your feelings on the bigs. I'm not expecting a star at #9 so maybe my expectations are different than yours, and others.
I think Udoh or Aldrich make us better in our weakest position. Not by a lot, but enough
to make me think they are worth the pick.

Udoh isn't going to be a star in this league, but I think he'll be a good player.
I think a lot of people here would be happy if he turned into a Okafor.
Hell, a lot of people want to trade for him even with his bad contract, and up and down play.
 
corrsty said:
If we can draft someone that we can project as a potential "closer" or clutch player then we should consider that than getting a big stiff. D-will, for all his contributions to the Jazz and his "clutch" exploits in Illinois, is not really a clutch player. I even think that, given enough chances, Sundiata could be a better clutch player than Deron. Of course I based this assessment on the number of chances D-will gets to score on last second shots, be it on end of quarters (usually 4 to 5 seconds still on the clock when he shoots) or end of games. His percentage is really bad on last second attempts on the basket. Gaines, on limited stints on end of quarters (and game! :D ), converts them better. So be it Babbitt or Hayward, we really need someone who can create his offense when the clock is ticking....and CONVERT it.
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NUMBERICA said:
You're ****-ing kidding me.
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Well, I agree with him to a point. I don't think Williams has been terribly great as a clutch scorer. He's outstanding as a clutch playmaker. Most of Okur's late game heroics have come via the pass from Williams. As a sort of comparison, I think Stockton was a better clutch scorer than Williams currently is. That could change as Williams is still pretty young.

Not a reason to draft Babbitt or Hayward, though.
 
NUMBERICA said:
You're ****-ing kidding me.
Click to expand...

Well it's true the Jazz need a wing who can handle the ball and create his own shot. Right now, D. Will is the only person who can create. None of our guys really have the handle to drive or shake a defender and pull up. I think the player more likely to create and finish would be Paul George.
 
Catchall said:
Well it's true the Jazz need a wing who can handle the ball and create his own shot. Right now, D. Will is the only person who can create. None of our guys really have the handle to drive or shake a defender and pull up. I think the player more likely to create and finish would be Paul George.
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I absolutely agree the Jazz need another reliable ballhandler that can create something (whether for himself, others, or both). No question about it.

The things I took issue with were the notion that Deron is even on the floor for a lot of game-clock situations (in a standard game, he's on the floor for one [at the end of the half], subs typically end the 1st and 3rd quarters, and it's not very common for a team to need to score on the absolute final possession in a game [what, maybe one in four games, maybe?]). Keeping that in mind, I can think of a lot more shots that he made than ones he missed in game-clock situations. More insulting than that by a mile is this idea that Gaines is somehow more clutch because of one shot. It reads like a joke, so that's why I asked.

The Jazz need help, but it's not because Deron isn't good enough. He's an absolute elite player and it drives me nuts how people feel the need to nit-pick about him. The Jazz are insanely lucky just to have him on the team considering that the Jazz had to trade up to get him (with a team renowned for always making the sweeter deal for itself, pulled off by a team that rarely does anything of such magnitude) and that it actually turned out as well as it did (Deron is pretty clearly the best PG in the NBA).

Anyway, yeah, Gaines is a more clutch player than Deron and we need another ballhandler because Deron's a slouch when it matters most. Just like that complete and utter failure Malone.
 
I think the thing that needs to be understood is that we are not going to get an impact big at #9. At least a big that is going to make an impact right away. All of the guys that well be there at 9 are young and raw. And all of them well take time to develop into a player. It well be just like having Fez and KoKo all over again. With all of us yelling an screaming to give them playing time to develop and watching them sit on the end of the bench.

Now if we draft one of the wing players (Babbitt, Henry, Ect....) then we have a player that might make an impact right away. Not that I think its a great idea to go into this season with Fez and KoKo manning the C spot until Okur gets back but who we going to draft that is going to play over them?

I keep looking back at the Blazers and thinking we are in the same boat in a way. Remember a couple of years ago when they had the chance to take ether Oden or Durrant? They took Oden because the need a big guy worse than a wing guy and he had Raw potential to be a great shot blocker. Now thats not saying he won't come back and be a great player. But well he be what Durrant has developed into? No chance. And the Blazers made that same choice 20+ years before drafting Sam Bowe over............. Michael Jordan. Or how about Detroit taking Darko Millitch (sp) over............... Carmelo Anthony, Chris Bosh, and Dewayne Wade. Kwame Brown over Pau Gasol, Joe Johnson, Richard Jefferson. What did every one of those guys I mentioned have. Size and athletic shot blocking ability. And were drafted over the others mentioned because they fit a team need.

Most of the time taking a guy to fill a team need over taking a guy that is the better player comes back to bite you right in the *ss.
 
Great Post and Completely agree. However, I do think that Aldrich just might be the Best Player Available at the 9 pick. We will see. I trust our front office.
 
Deron isn't clutch?

I guess we have forgotten his game winner against the Cavs, all those game winners and clutch shots against the Lakers (anyone else remember that shot he hit over Gasol in 08?), all those clutch plays against Portland (this season), awesome defense on Roy, Kmart (when he was with Sacramento), and the way he dominated Denver?

You cannot name another player not named Kobe that is more clutch than Deron. Especially when you consider his position. How many other PGs in this league are considered more clutch than Deron? Kidd? LOL. Billups who looked like a D-league player against Deron? Sitting on the sideline CP3? How many times has Nash and his team choked? I guess one could make a case that Fisher is more clutch than Deron... But... Anyone else want to trade Deron for Fish straight up?

How many game winners has Lebron hit? Other than the one against the Magic last year in the playoffs...

What about Kevin Durant? Derick Rose? Rondo?

Guys, Deron is clutch. Deron is easily a top 10 player. the problem isn't with Deron. It's with this team. The team is filled of 2nd rounders and undrafted players. Lets upgrade the roster, get guys who can help Deron out (especially with creating their own shots), and then we'll improve.
 
Golfman said:
Whiteside is down to 22 in Ford's mock draft.

https://insider.espn.go.com/nba/dra...ory?columnist=ford_chad&page=MockDraft-100616

I can't sleep until I convince some on this board that our #9 pick is not worth a guy not even projected to be in the top 20. I know these mock drafts aren't always accurate, but selecting a guy that MOST mock drafts have WAYYYYY below 9 is just silly.

Not much has changed since the last one. They still have us taking Babbitt at 9.

1. Wall
2. Turner
3. Favors
4. Johnson
5. Cousins
6. Monroe
7. Aminu
8. Hayward
9. Babbitt
10. Davis
11. Aldrich
12. Patterson
13. Bradley
14. Udoh
15. Henry
16. George
17. Anderson
18. Bledsoe
19. Alabi
20. James
21. Orton
22. Whiteside
Click to expand...

I just don't agree that the C's are going to drop like this mock.
I think Udoh, Aldrich, and Whiteside will all go higher than they are listed here.
 
Marcus said:
Wasn't that Gaines?
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Before Gaines was even in the D-league, there was Deron. He hit the game winner against the Cavs in this game. But in order to know this we'll need to actually watch Deron and the Utah Jazz play.

Marcus, you have proven my point. So quickly we forget....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXTOVopeVaM

In this clip, we see Lebron making a possible game winner followed by Deron flat out winning the game. He's clutch. The poster that questioned his clutchability doesn't know what the hell he's talking about. And I'm really trying to be respectful when I say that. But seriously, saying that Deron was only clutch @ ILL says a lot. It brings into question whether that poster has ever seen a Jazz game in his life.

Apparently the announcers think he's a clutch player:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHm23Gq98Z8&feature=related

Another one, apparently we forgot what happened no more than 2 months ago:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pua...953B04E8&playnext_from=PL&playnext=1&index=49

No Memo? No AK? Playoffs? Road? Everyone against you, including your own fans predicting a sweep? Playing with an injury while the announcers say that you've been knocked down at least 25 times? No problem, 33 points 14 assists. He accounted for more than half our total points.

Here are the highlights. Look at those plays made by Deron. Amazing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcshWocEioE

again, you won't find another player not named Kobe that is more clutch than Deron. The real key is our team. Other than Deron, who would start on any of the teams playing in the finals? Boozer? over KG or Gasol? No. CJ? Over Artest or Pierce? No. Fess? Over Bynum or Perkins/Sheed? No. Wesley? Over Kobe or Ray Allen? No.

This team needs upgrading, Deron is just fine.

How quickly fans forget... Or just remember facts to prove their outrageous points. What a horrible fail of a post calling Deron only clutch @ ILL. Horrible.

I too echo Numb's words, "YOU'RE ******* KIDDING ME."
 
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