jazzfan1971
Well-Known Member
Better to just man up and admit you were wrong about Bazz than go through all this rationalization. It's just too much work.
Come to the dark side.
Come to the dark side.
A last minute reassessment of the draft
- Thread starter Dr. Jones
- Start date
Haha.. I know Bazz is legit... but this pack it in the paint "2.9" defense is a thinker.
PKM,
Watching the finals I was stunned how quick, crisp and on target the passing was. Yes, they have a lot of skilled shooters, etc. But getting the ball on-time and on target really helps your secondary players out.
They way I look at is, you need enough athletic ability/length to compete. You need passing skills, BBIQ and work ethic to be a part of a great team. It is also very valuable to have the BBIQ and athletic ability to invert defender responsibilities. (See Dwayne Wade crashing down to block Splitter's shots. Or Noah on the Bulls switching out on Lebron. See AK the young years.)
Players like Nogueira and Gobert are intriguing for their defensive potential. McCollum is intriguing for his offensive potential. IMO Jamal Franklin would be useful player as a energy guy/defender/rebounder who can slash and get to the rim.
I am rambling a bit. If you can't shoot you need to be able to pass, cut and punish on the offensive board if you are ignored on the offensive end. You also need to compensate your below-average offense with D.
If you are a terrible defender you better be a knock down shooter/scorer.
As that applies to the draft- Muhammed is out IMO. I like Nogueira, Franklin, Oladipo and Porter. I think Len will bust. I have mixed feelings on Zeller and McCollum. I don't know what to think about Schroeder and Gobert.
I am curious about Ray McCallum in the 2nd round. Personally I would vote to take the two BPA in the 1st round (which IMO isn't one of the PG's) and take a chance on Kabango or McCallum in the 2nd.
Watching the finals I was stunned how quick, crisp and on target the passing was. Yes, they have a lot of skilled shooters, etc. But getting the ball on-time and on target really helps your secondary players out.
They way I look at is, you need enough athletic ability/length to compete. You need passing skills, BBIQ and work ethic to be a part of a great team. It is also very valuable to have the BBIQ and athletic ability to invert defender responsibilities. (See Dwayne Wade crashing down to block Splitter's shots. Or Noah on the Bulls switching out on Lebron. See AK the young years.)
Players like Nogueira and Gobert are intriguing for their defensive potential. McCollum is intriguing for his offensive potential. IMO Jamal Franklin would be useful player as a energy guy/defender/rebounder who can slash and get to the rim.
I am rambling a bit. If you can't shoot you need to be able to pass, cut and punish on the offensive board if you are ignored on the offensive end. You also need to compensate your below-average offense with D.
If you are a terrible defender you better be a knock down shooter/scorer.
As that applies to the draft- Muhammed is out IMO. I like Nogueira, Franklin, Oladipo and Porter. I think Len will bust. I have mixed feelings on Zeller and McCollum. I don't know what to think about Schroeder and Gobert.
I am curious about Ray McCallum in the 2nd round. Personally I would vote to take the two BPA in the 1st round (which IMO isn't one of the PG's) and take a chance on Kabango or McCallum in the 2nd.
Yes.. all that.
The crisp passing is crucial as it is required to break down the "2.9" defense. You need multiple guys on the floor that can hit an outside shot.. and get past their defender. The offense is designed to be pretty similar to the dribble-drive.. but, yes... the passing.. the passing.
jazzfan1971
Well-Known Member
OK I'll man up first. in a league where city miles can carve out a lengthy career there is plenty of room for bazz. I was too hard on him when I said he'd wash out of the league on his rookie contract.
The Jazz are attempting to become elite, not just good. They need to follow the blueprint they've started and build around their dominant bigs and excellent facilitator in Hayward.
They need to add one player on the wing who can a) hit threes at over 35%, b) play smothering defense, c) rebound at both ends, and d) slash and run out. This is a dynamic athlete and multi-dimensional player. There are players of this ilk in the draft, and tbh it seems to be one of the strengths of the draft.
Oladipo is at the top of this list. However there are others -- Giannis (needs more time to develop), Glen Rice Jr. (needs to work hard on his defense), Kentavious Caldwell-Pope (still has upside), Ricky Ledo (???), Tony Snell (if he'll get stronger and invest on both ends), James Southerland (2nd round), etc. I'd say Tony Mitchell has some potential, but the mental game looks a bit lacking.
I still put Archie Goodwin in this category and think that he's one of the best creators and penetrators in the draft at SG. Surround him with players who can actually shoot, and I think he shines. Kentucky broke down offensively at almost every position.
The Jazz obviously need a PG who can initiate offense, shoot from range, and get into the lane. It's actually very difficult to find a PG who has all of these abilities. Burke may struggle to penetrate, but has everything else. Carter-Williams struggles to shoot and has a loose handle. McCollum is shifty, but normally needs a pick to get in the paint. Schroeder is someone who shows potential on all fronts, but is still a bit early in his development. I think Wolters is a bit underrated in this draft, but I can't really say he's elite either.
Thirdly, the Jazz need another rotation big. There are plenty in this draft, especially where the Jazz are picking. Pick your poison: Olynyk, Noguiera, Gobert, Dieng, ...or trade up for Zeller. I still think Adams will be the best big to come out of this draft. A rare 7' athlete who likes to run and grew up playing rugby. His development in the past year has been pretty dramatic, and he's still young.
.........
So if I were to stack rank the Jazz's options here (a bit liberally), I would say they are:
1) trade up to the top of the draft for Oladipo or Porter
2) trade up into the 7 - 10 range for Adams, Zeller, Burke or Caldwell-Pope
3) stay at 14 and plan to take Schroeder (who cares if he should go at 18), Giannis, or Bebe
4) stay at 21 and take Rice, Goodwin, Snell, Ledo, Olynyk or Dieng
5) stay at 46 and take Southerland or Adonis Thomas along with a defibrillator
There's upside talent in both rounds of the draft.
They need to add one player on the wing who can a) hit threes at over 35%, b) play smothering defense, c) rebound at both ends, and d) slash and run out. This is a dynamic athlete and multi-dimensional player. There are players of this ilk in the draft, and tbh it seems to be one of the strengths of the draft.
Oladipo is at the top of this list. However there are others -- Giannis (needs more time to develop), Glen Rice Jr. (needs to work hard on his defense), Kentavious Caldwell-Pope (still has upside), Ricky Ledo (???), Tony Snell (if he'll get stronger and invest on both ends), James Southerland (2nd round), etc. I'd say Tony Mitchell has some potential, but the mental game looks a bit lacking.
I still put Archie Goodwin in this category and think that he's one of the best creators and penetrators in the draft at SG. Surround him with players who can actually shoot, and I think he shines. Kentucky broke down offensively at almost every position.
The Jazz obviously need a PG who can initiate offense, shoot from range, and get into the lane. It's actually very difficult to find a PG who has all of these abilities. Burke may struggle to penetrate, but has everything else. Carter-Williams struggles to shoot and has a loose handle. McCollum is shifty, but normally needs a pick to get in the paint. Schroeder is someone who shows potential on all fronts, but is still a bit early in his development. I think Wolters is a bit underrated in this draft, but I can't really say he's elite either.
Thirdly, the Jazz need another rotation big. There are plenty in this draft, especially where the Jazz are picking. Pick your poison: Olynyk, Noguiera, Gobert, Dieng, ...or trade up for Zeller. I still think Adams will be the best big to come out of this draft. A rare 7' athlete who likes to run and grew up playing rugby. His development in the past year has been pretty dramatic, and he's still young.
.........
So if I were to stack rank the Jazz's options here (a bit liberally), I would say they are:
1) trade up to the top of the draft for Oladipo or Porter
2) trade up into the 7 - 10 range for Adams, Zeller, Burke or Caldwell-Pope
3) stay at 14 and plan to take Schroeder (who cares if he should go at 18), Giannis, or Bebe
4) stay at 21 and take Rice, Goodwin, Snell, Ledo, Olynyk or Dieng
5) stay at 46 and take Southerland or Adonis Thomas along with a defibrillator
There's upside talent in both rounds of the draft.
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I think Shabazz will be okay in the league. I'm just not sure he helps the Jazz become elite. If things go well for him, he might be the swing-man version of Jamal Crawford, which is a go-to scorer off the bench, but not a guy who blends well with the other starters.
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
I'm thinking a real sleeper in this draft could be Giannis. Only 19 years old and apparently grew 3" in the past year. Not saying their games are similar, but could Giannis keep growing like Paul George did? At some point, would he be a 7' SF? Imagine the match-up problems that could cause. I know he's a project, but since the Jazz are tanking (right?), I wouldn't be upset if he were the pick. And I'm still wondering who the Jazz international scout was referring to when he talked about an international "sleeper" in the draft. Giannis? Gobert? Nogueira?
To me, Giannis looks like Otto Porter did his senior year in high school. Not quite as smooth, but slightly longer. Pretty good IQ.
I don't think there's that much risk with him.
mellow
Well-Known Member
So a few random thoughts:
- I like C-Pope and Olidipo to meet your criteria. McCollum too but I am less excited about him than i once was.
- The league is a copy cat league so I see why more teams would go this direction. But with every trend there is a counter trend to beat it. So what is the counter trend Twin towers? High post big men? Memphis? Indiana?
- every time the league goes a direction the league steps in and changes the rules. How long until the rules change again and 2.9 is replaced with the next thing?
- How do the core 4 stack up in a 2.9 offense? Defense? A very simple explanation would be I think Burks has the first step but not the jump shot, but it doesn't matter cause he hardly played. Hayward sometimes has the shot but not a first step and once he decides to go to the hoop he is not giving it up (Burks too). Kanter jumps out but can't recover if the defender puts it on the floor or passes, on offense he can hit the high post jumper. Favors is terrific for 2.9 defense, but is he a liability on offense?
- Jeremy Evans is a terrific 2.9 defender, but like Favors he is a liability on offense.
- Jazz are going to to try to run next year. Is that possible in a 2.9 league or will all of the athletes make running practically impossible?
UGLI baby
Well-Known Member
Fan analysis. Have you ever Played the game in your life or do you just fly around on the team plane and think you're an expert because of it?
posted from my htc one using tapaBONGO
HipHopAnonymous
Active Member
Just glad the Jazz are in a position where they going to biff it with Noel. Dude has bust written all over him.
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
I laughed a'loud (said in a THICK Cockney accent). I genuinely did.
Also, who else wishes that fellas screen name was "CountachBuckets"? I certainly do.
MCW if he can shoot would fit well with your criteria:
MCW has the following:
- Quick first step
- Can definitely make good passes
- Can slash & get into the paint
- Has IQ court vision
- Long enough to defend the paint
- Long enough to be a help defender
MCW has the following:
- Quick first step
- Can definitely make good passes
- Can slash & get into the paint
- Has IQ court vision
- Long enough to defend the paint
- Long enough to be a help defender
The Thriller
Well-Known Member
Sounds like a lot of people here want Wolters... Can shoot, makes everyone else better, passes, etc...