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According to Ford- Milsap/Harris could be traded on draft day

jazzman12 said:
I've mentioned this in another thread. To me AJ's game doesn't transilate all that well coming off the bench. The best analogy I could give is an NFL Running Back who's a grinder and might only be giving you 3.1 Yards Per Carry in the 1st Quarter, but by the 4th Quarter he's worn down a defense and is getting 5.8 YPC. Jefferson to me is a physical low post player who is going to punish you during the course of a game and get better as the game goes on. Milsap on the other hand is more of a high energy player who could check into a game and instantly give you a flurry of activity.
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Interesting perspective. I always thought he would be better off the bench because he can score at a decent rate without needing help from anyone.
 
Jefferson>Milsap

I think that every team needs a Milsap and the Jazz are no different. I hope they're unloading Kirilenko, so Milsap is perfect for the 6th Man role. Facts are:

1. Jefferson is bigger and plays both the 4 and 5.
2. Favors should start at the 4 next year.
3. Milsap wears out as the year goes on defending bigger players.
4. Jefferson is more durable.
5. Anyone similar to Milsap in the League is a role player, so why can't Milsap.
6. Milsap should work on his SF skills, i.e. lateral movement and 3-point shot skills.

If the Jazz draft Kanter, which appears to be the most likely senario, the I like the depth at the 4 and 5.

SF: CJ/Milsap
PF: Favors/Milsap
C: Jefferson/Memo????(finger crossed that he can play)/Kanter
 
jazzman12 said:
I've mentioned this in another thread. To me AJ's game doesn't transilate all that well coming off the bench. The best analogy I could give is an NFL Running Back who's a grinder and might only be giving you 3.1 Yards Per Carry in the 1st Quarter, but by the 4th Quarter he's worn down a defense and is getting 5.8 YPC. Jefferson to me is a physical low post player who is going to punish you during the course of a game and get better as the game goes on. Milsap on the other hand is more of a high energy player who could check into a game and instantly give you a flurry of activity.
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I disagree with this post. Entirely.
 
I agree that Millsap seems to wear out being the starter. He's a good fill-in when the starter is injured but give him a full season of that and he'd be out of gas about 1/2 to 2/3 into the season.

Jefferson, being bigger and stronger, can take more punishment. He also doesn't seem to use as much energy because he's in the middle most of the time. That means he has less responsibility on defense using his energy in the process. Although, it would seem that also means he's not being as active on defense = not as active relative to Millsap.

Long story long, I don't see why we can't keep both, but being as we have more need at SF, then it becomes necessary to trade one for a true SF. AK is old and doesn't fit what we're trying to do going forward. Millsap is a great guy and hard worker, but I think we should trade him for a true SF and use Favors as the 4 and Kanter as backup. Of course, if Kanter is as good as people say, then we could trade Jefferson as well and play Favors and Kanter together and then worry about getting backups later. In the meantime, Evans and Fes are fine as backups to their positions.
 
IBleedAggieBlue said:
I think that every team needs a Milsap and the Jazz are no different. I hope they're unloading Kirilenko, so Milsap is perfect for the 6th Man role. Facts are:

1. Jefferson is bigger and plays both the 4 and 5.
2. Favors should start at the 4 next year.
3. Milsap wears out as the year goes on defending bigger players.
4. Jefferson is more durable.
5. Anyone similar to Milsap in the League is a role player, so why can't Milsap.
6. Milsap should work on his SF skills, i.e. lateral movement and 3-point shot skills.

If the Jazz draft Kanter, which appears to be the most likely senario, the I like the depth at the 4 and 5.

SF: CJ/Milsap
PF: Favors/Milsap
C: Jefferson/Memo????(finger crossed that he can play)/Kanter
Click to expand...


Jefferson is more durable? Is this a joke? He missed a whole season for reconstructive ACL surgery. There is no one in the league that is similar to Millsap.

Jefferson isn't a power player by any means. He uses his length and footwork against defenders.

Millsap > Jefferson
1) More durable
2) Doesn't get his teammates in foul trouble like Big Al because he's horrid at pick and roll defense making Millsap come over on help defense
3) Way cheaper
4) Doesn't take horrible shots down the stretch
5) Hustle player, plays with 100% energy every night
 
Bottom line, I really loved that lineup the Jazz had that consisted of great passers at every position. The ball really moved and we got lots of easy baskets. If we can transition to a roster like that then I think we could play with anyone. We'll just need great passers along with several deadly outside shooters. Movement and passing. Passing and movement.
 
Milsap - does he 'break down' over the long season?
. . . . . . . . . .Min . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .REB. . . . . . . . . PTS
In October . .33.0 0.634 0.000 0.667 3.7 8.7 12.3 3.0 1.0 0.7 21.3
In November. .36.1 0.553 0.571 0.823 1.9 5.9 7.8 2.6 1.3 0.9 17.8
In December. .33.2 0.520 0.000 0.661 1.9 5.1 7.0 1.6 1.8 0.9 16.2
In January . . .32.1 0.487 0.000 0.790 2.1 5.4 7.5 2.2 1.3 0.7 15.5
In February .36.0 0.538 0.000 0.787 2.1 6.4 8.5 2.7 1.0 1.0 19.2
In March . . .33.2 0.561 0.333 0.727 2.4 4.2 6.7 3.0 0.7 1.6 17.1
In April . . .35.7 0.505 0.500 0.793 2.3 4.0 6.3 3.0 2.3 0.6 17.4

Season PTS 17.3 REB 7.6 AST 2.5 EFF 20.57 Games=76
Efficiency Rank: 23rd for ALL players, 13th for forwards

List of Players Ranked by Efficiency
PLAYER NAME, TEAM EFF
1 LeBron James , MIA 28.6
2 Kevin Love , MIN 28.4
3 Dwight Howard , ORL 28.3
4 * Blake Griffin , LAC 25.6
5 Pau Gasol , LAL 25.4
6 Kevin Durant , OKC 24.9
7 Dwyane Wade , MIA 24.8
8 Amar'e Stoudemire , 25.3
9 Zach Randolph , MEM 24.4
10 Dirk Nowitzki , DAL 23.5
11 Derrick Rose , CHI 23.1
12 Chris Paul , NOH 23.1 1
13 LaMarcus Aldridge , POR 23.1
14 Deron Williams , NJN-UTA 22.9
15 Carmelo Anthony , NYK-DEN 22.7
16 Al Horford , ATL 22.5
17 Russell Westbrook , 22.4
18 Al Jefferson , UTA 22.3 (Rank = 3rd for Centers. Games = 82)
19 Kobe Bryant , LAL 21.4
20 David Lee , GSW 21.2
21 Steve Nash , PHX 21.0
22 Kevin Garnett , BOS 20.8
23 Paul Millsap , UTA 20.6
24 Josh Smith , ATL 20.5
25 Chris Bosh , MIA 20.4
26 David West , NOH 20.4
27 Monta Ellis , GSW 20.3
28 Joakim Noah , CHI 19.9
29 Carlos Boozer , CHI 19.8 (Games=59 - Couldn't help but note this.)
 
Harcher said:
I think the Jazz are PUSHING the rumor mill. This way as many other teams as possible are presenting offers that can be evaluated for now and for later.
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Its actually a smart play by KOC. Not only does he get to evalutate offers as you suggest, it also lets everyone know he could draft Knight and trade Harris, or he could draft Kanter and trade Milsap. Cleveland is ssupposedly shopping the 4th pick, and the uncertainty of the jazz direction could force a team to trade with the Jazz rather than hope the jazz don't take thier guy at 3. Well played Kevin, well played indeed.
 
GVC said:
What if both Millsap and Favors outplay AJ leading up to the season? Favors has the length and athleticism to both guard 5s and provide good help D (to make up for Millsap's size). Had everyone ruled out AJ coming off the bench?
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Nope. If Millsap and Favors wipe the floor with AJ, then bring AJ off the bench. Let the best man win.
 
Dream Draft would be......

Trade the 3rd pick and 12th pick and Raja Bell for 2nd pick and 20th pick and Webster
2nd - Draft Derrick Williams
Trade Millsap for 6th or 5th pick. Draft Biyombo 6th
20th - Draft Reggie Jackson.

Harris - Reggie Jackson(20th) - Watson
Hayward - Miles
Williams(2nd) - Webster - Evans
Favors - Biyombo(6th)
Jefferson - Biyombo(6th) - Okur - Fesenko
 
IBleedAggieBlue said:
I think that every team needs a Milsap and the Jazz are no different. I hope they're unloading Kirilenko, so Milsap is perfect for the 6th Man role. Facts are:

1. Jefferson is bigger and plays both the 4 and 5.
2. Favors should start at the 4 next year.
3. Milsap wears out as the year goes on defending bigger players.
4. Jefferson is more durable.
5. Anyone similar to Milsap in the League is a role player, so why can't Milsap.
6. Milsap should work on his SF skills, i.e. lateral movement and 3-point shot skills.

If the Jazz draft Kanter, which appears to be the most likely senario, the I like the depth at the 4 and 5.

SF: CJ/Milsap
PF: Favors/Milsap
C: Jefferson/Memo????(finger crossed that he can play)/Kanter
Click to expand...

Jefferson = Black Hole

Yes, Jeffersons number for the last couple of months were amazing. Can you tell me how many games were won in that stretch? I remember reading an article after a late season game and during that game the writer was specifically looking for how many time Gordy got the ball and what happened with the possesion vs the time he did not touch it and what the result of the possesion was. I was taken back by the fact that when Gordy got the ball the team was much more effiecient and scored at a higher clip. When he did not see the ball (should be read when Jefferson was the WHOLE offense) the scoring was not very good and the team was not getting high quality shot.

So let me pose a couple of questions. Who is the better passer? Who has proven to put in the effort necessary to win? If you can answer those truthfully then you know who the Jazz should keep out of Jefferson or Milsap.
 
I'm going to give Jefferson another year before I pass any kind of judgment on his game. Hopefully he either puts up monster stats and makes himself a trade-able asset, or he meshes with the team really well and we actually win.
 
orangello said:
Jefferson = Black Hole

Yes, Jeffersons number for the last couple of months were amazing. Can you tell me how many games were won in that stretch? I remember reading an article after a late season game and during that game the writer was specifically looking for how many time Gordy got the ball and what happened with the possesion vs the time he did not touch it and what the result of the possesion was. I was taken back by the fact that when Gordy got the ball the team was much more effiecient and scored at a higher clip. When he did not see the ball (should be read when Jefferson was the WHOLE offense) the scoring was not very good and the team was not getting high quality shot.


So let me pose a couple of questions. Who is the better passer? Who has proven to put in the effort necessary to win? If you can answer those truthfully then you know who the Jazz should keep out of Jefferson or Milsap.
Click to expand...

I agree that Jefferson is a Black hole on offense. But the fact is Millsap is a midget and he is not going to help us win any more games. Unless we can get a legit defensive Center for Jefferson than we should keep him.

I personally don't think either player are the long term players for this team. Jefferson will probably improve his passing a little bit but not much. But for 2 years that is exactly what we need.

I am sorry but we should not be putting Favors at Center. He is a PF and he will dominate there. Putting him at Center will hurt is production on both ends of the court.

Millsap is a role player off the bench. He is not a starting player on a contending team.

Trade Millsap for draft pick this year. Keep Jefferson unless we can get a defensive center. No reason to shrink this team when all of the contending teams have size.

But get a future Center to replace Jefferson in 2 years. Someone who we can groom behind him.
 
Yeah, there is no reason to play Favors at Center. He is going to be able to dominate PF's with his size. Playing him out of position is only going to hurt his development.
 
Twin Towers said:
I agree that Jefferson is a Black hole on offense. But the fact is Millsap is a midget and he is not going to help us win any more games. Unless we can get a legit defensive Center for Jefferson than we should keep him.

I personally don't think either player are the long term players for this team. Jefferson will probably improve his passing a little bit but not much. But for 2 years that is exactly what we need.

I am sorry but we should not be putting Favors at Center. He is a PF and he will dominate there. Putting him at Center will hurt is production on both ends of the court.

Millsap is a role player off the bench. He is not a starting player on a contending team.

Trade Millsap for draft pick this year. Keep Jefferson unless we can get a defensive center. No reason to shrink this team when all of the contending teams have size.

But get a future Center to replace Jefferson in 2 years. Someone who we can groom behind him.
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I would not trade away Millsap for anyone in this years draft. If we are to trade him it would be for a high draft pick in next years draft.

I also agree that Favors needs to play at the PF spot. I was thinking about Favors as the starting PF and Millsap coming off the bench. My biggest concern is Millsap accepting that role. Is there anyone in the NBA that comes off the bench as a PF that is better than Millsap?

I agree that Jefferson was adjusting to a new system/city/teammates etc.... I also agree that he should have another shot at making things better but if he starts holding onto the ball for 15 seconds every offensive possesion then that is hurting all of the new young guys and he needs to go asap.
 
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