Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
Also. Stockton=best passer and steals artist. Best pure pg ever
All-Time NBA Draft Round 2: White Chocolate vs. Hack
- Thread starter Elizah Huge
- Start date
Hotdog
Well-Known Member
That's cute.
So John never cared to be a champion?
You apparently do not pay attention to how athletes think. Every athlete would rather play a major part in championship than put up regular season records.
And also, it's very apparent you can't judge talent and only care about numbers.
If that's the case then Karl Malone is the second best player ever by that logic. He is 2nd all time in scoring.
I bet no one would agree with your logic. At least no one outside of Utah fans.
Why don't you try actually saying something smart, instead of just spouting off homer speak.
Allen is a great shooter, there have been lots of great shooters. The rest of his game was okay. Is he a top 50 player of all time? I dont think so. I do think he cracks the top 100 though. I wouldnt make him a starter if I could choose from the top 50 players of all time. I am okay with him as a starter though based on your strategy. I also dont think he cracks my top 5 best shooters, maybe my top 10 though.
Klay isnt a top player in his time. He isnt the top player on his team, he might be the 4th best player on his team although I think an argument could be made for him at 2,3 or 4th. He is a good shooter that benefits from the system he is in and the players around him. Klay is not a top 100 player. Maybe he becomes one but until then there are much better players to pick from. Do you think Klay is a top 12 player of all time at his position? Do you think he is a top 100 player of all time?
You have 12 teams so the starters should be pretty elite players. Your bench should be greats. Sorry, I like your team building and I think you have some talent but not enough.
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
A huge part of having championships is the team that is placed around a star. How long did it take for Jordan to win a championship? He had a lot of failures prior to his great run because the surrounding talent simply wasn't enough.
Unfortunately, that was the case with John and Karl. While it's true neither really elevated their games for a championship run, there were always holes on their teams and very weak benches. Part of that is Larry H.'s fault for pinching pennies. He said many times his primary goal was to operate in the black (not racist, for you non-accountants it means turning a profit). And the other, bigger factor, was the attitude of players towards Utah. It still exists, but not as strongly IMO as back in the 80's. A couple of players outright refused trades (Harper and Seikaly).
Curry had an amazing season and a fantastic playoff run. If he continues to put up high numbers, he might be seen - eventually - as a better PG than Stockton. But John's excellence over the course of nearly TWO decades can't be pushed aside lightly. For one season, yes, it's hard to argue against this year's Curry. For 19 years, let's wait to make that assessment, especially in light of the injury problems Curry had earlier in his career vs. the games Stockton missed in his entire career.
Unfortunately, that was the case with John and Karl. While it's true neither really elevated their games for a championship run, there were always holes on their teams and very weak benches. Part of that is Larry H.'s fault for pinching pennies. He said many times his primary goal was to operate in the black (not racist, for you non-accountants it means turning a profit). And the other, bigger factor, was the attitude of players towards Utah. It still exists, but not as strongly IMO as back in the 80's. A couple of players outright refused trades (Harper and Seikaly).
Curry had an amazing season and a fantastic playoff run. If he continues to put up high numbers, he might be seen - eventually - as a better PG than Stockton. But John's excellence over the course of nearly TWO decades can't be pushed aside lightly. For one season, yes, it's hard to argue against this year's Curry. For 19 years, let's wait to make that assessment, especially in light of the injury problems Curry had earlier in his career vs. the games Stockton missed in his entire career.
Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
U apparently don't understand how John thinks. He even said during his announcement that a chip wouldn't make him any more or less for field
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Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
How comes iPhones never type what we speak?
I'm glad Tomic never came over because that damn auto correct was always changing his name to "atomic."
Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
I'll ask him the next time I pray.
I was doing the speaking option on that post. Always forget to proof read my speak typing
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Hotdog
Well-Known Member
I just don't see longevity as being better than peak. It's impressive that Malone and Stockton played so long without injuries. But I'll take the peak guy.
Karl Malone has scored more points than Jordan. Doesn't mean he's a better scorer.
That's nice that John stockton has the benefit of showing off his whole career for this.
Maybe we should just exclude every modern player because they aren't finished yet.
Hotdog
Well-Known Member
1. Who are better shooters than Ray Allen?
2. Who is better than Klay Thompson on the Warriors other than Steph?
addictionary
Well-Known Member
Hack's team is better.
addictionary
Well-Known Member
Sorry for missing all the ballots hons. I'll try to vote for the next round. Good luck to all. Toodles.
The reigning finals MVP could be argued to be better than Klay. Their best defender and player who made them a good defensive team, as well as their most versatile player Green could be argued as well.
1. Who are better shooters than Ray Allen?
Id have to think about that a bit but probably wont. off the top of my head Larry Bird, Reggie Miller, Michael Jordan, Nash, Stockton, Price, Nowitzki, Steph Curry, Maybe Korver, Dale Ellis, Peja, Kobe.
You didnt answer my questions.
Is Klay a top 12 player at his position of all time? Is Klay a top 100 player of all time right now?
Hotdog
Well-Known Member
Team White Chocolate:
PG - John Stockton / Bob Cousy
SG - Pete Maravich / Ron Artest
SF - Julius Erving / Elgin Baylor / Antoine Walker
PF - Willis Reed / Wes Unseld / Rashard Lewis
C - Bill Walton / Amar'e Stoudemire
Team Hack:
PG - Stephen Curry / Derrick Rose
SG - Ray Allen / Penny Hardaway
SF - Klay Thompson / Latrell Sprewell / Andrew Wiggins
PF - Anthony Davis / Derrick Favors / Robert Horry
C - Shaquille O'Neal / Dikembe Mutombo
WC's Case:
Team White Chocolate
The best statistical season for each of my starting-five:
John Stockton - 17.2 PPG, 14.5 APG, 2.7 SPG, 2.6 RPG, 41.6% from three.
Pete Maravich - 31.1 PPG, 5.4 APG, 5.1 RPG, 1.2 SPG, 84% from the line.
Julius Erving - 31.9 PPG, 12.2 RPG, 4.2 APG, 2.5 SPG, 1.8 BPG, 49.7% from field.
Willis Reed - 21.1 PPG, 14.5 RPG, 2.3 APG, 75% from the line, 52.1% from field.
Bill Walton - 18.6 PPG, 14.4 RPG, 3.8 APG, 3.2 BPG, 52.8% from field.
From Dr. J's autobiography:
Bob Ryan from the Boston Globe:
Andrew Wiggins, Derrick Favors and Robert Horry are not guys that should have been drafted when we are talking about the greatest players of all-time. Klay Thompson definitely should not be starting in this thing either. Shaq could not keep up with this running team and would be tired after a couple of minutes of it.
I think my starters are better than his as well as my bench. If someone on his team gets hot, my team has Defensive Player of the Year - Ron Artest who can come in off the bench. Elgin Baylor and Amar'e Stoudemire are two great scorers off the bench as well.
My team is a better defensive team than his is as well:
John Stockton - 5× NBA All-Defensive Second Team (1989, 1991–1992, 1995, 1997)
Julius Erving - ABA All-Defensive First Team (1976)
Bill Walton - 2× NBA All-Defensive First Team (1977–1978)
Ron Artest - NBA Defensive Player of the Year (2004), 2× All-Defensive First Team (2004, 2006), 2× All-Defensive Second Team (2003, 2009)
Willis Reed - NBA All-Defensive First Team (1970)
As we saw in the playoffs this year, you can take a big man out of the game by using the "Hack a Shaq" method if he can't shoot free throws. Shaq is a career 52.7% free throw shooter. The formidable duo of Bill Walton and Willis Reed would be able to slow down Shaq anyways. Sans Maravich, everybody on my starting line-up is a great defender. On the flip side though, nobody can guard Maravich on Hack's team. Thank you for taking the time to read my write-up and vote for who you think is the better team.
Wait!...
I lost this thing?
Steph Curry
Klay Thompson
Ray Allen
On the perimeter
Shaq downlow
And Anthony Davis just doing whatever. Just there to help out a little.
This team lost?
One word. Gravity. How in the world would any team attempt to play any kind of team defense against that team. Thats team would have the most ridiculous spacing of all time. Its the best of both eras combined together to make the perfect team. Im sorry, but this team would not lose to White Chocolates team.
Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
One thing u overlooked. He has Stockton, the ultimate playmaker and basketball IQ mixed with the greatest pure passing skills running the point. It's like having a great coach on the court directing traffic. He proved time and time again he could turn scrubs into passable NBA talent. Imagine what he would do with a team of all time greats. Watching the Stockton run Jazz team was pure poetry on a basketball court. Nuff said!!
Hotdog
Well-Known Member
You sound like CarolinaJazz's grandma
Recency bias
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But yeah Hacks team probably better. Maravich starting is lol.
Should have started Amare with Walton.
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Should have started Amare with Walton.
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Miggs
Well-Known Member
I said it a year ago. This is likely why you lost...and went into hiding more recently.