Ayton

[fishonjazz]

They'd probably win enough to make the tank a half-assed one, while at the same time reducing the amount of draft capital we bring back for Donovan.

I mean i guess you could say that about anything we get in a trade.
RJ is too good and we would probably win enough with him to make the tank half assed. We should really only get the worst players in the league to ensure we are the worst team in the league year after year and get those guaranteed #1 picks that always turn into franchise players.


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[fishonjazz]

Ayton + Bridges + a treasure trove of picks would obviously be fantastic, but I don't think that's a realistic return.

A young promising player + a treasure trove of picks is my preference over Ayton/Bridges is my point, for a myriad of reasons.

You miss read. I said one of those players.

Ayton OR bridges (most likely ayton) plus treasure trove of picks is what i have been hearing would happen.


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[MT Steve]

You miss read. I said one of those players.

Ayton OR bridges (most likely ayton)plus treasure trove of licks is what i have been hearing would happen.


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The entire conversation has been with jom who directly said both.

I mean i guess you could say that about anything we get in a trade.
RJ is too good and we would probably win enough with him to make the tank half assed. We should really only get the worst players in the league to ensure we are the worst team in the league year after year and get those guaranteed #1 picks that always turn into franchise players.


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Wow.

You (and Elizah Huge) are making zero effort to understand my point and twisting it disingenuously to something I am not arguing.

It's very frustrating.

 

[fishonjazz]

Sorry, I'm out of patience with you.

If you're too stupid to follow the argument, then don't respond to me.

You are out patience because i asked why the player has to be on a rookie deal? I dont think you have explained that yet? Would we be over the cap or tax if we dont only have rookie deals? Im curious of your reasoning is all. I apologize for wanting to understand your position better.


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[Elizah Huge]

You miss read. I said one of those players.

Ayton OR bridges (most likely ayton)plus treasure trove of licks is what i have been hearing would happen.


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Fish you’re too dumb to understand.

 

[fishonjazz]

The entire conversation has been with jom who directly said both.


Wow.

You (and Elizah Huge) are making zero effort to understand my point and twisting it disingenuously to something I am not arguing.

It's very frustrating.

When i ask you a direct question to try to understand your point you get mad and refuse to answer though.

I was having a conversation with you about my perspective not with jom and his perspective btw.

Im fine speaking directly with you about a totally different scenario than the one you are discussing with jom. Jom and his points or ideas dont have to be a part of the discussion between the two of us.


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[MT Steve]

When i ask you a direct question to try to understand your point you get mad and refuse to answer though.

I was having a conversation with you about my perspective not with jom and his perspective btw.

Im fine speaking directly with you about a totally different scenario than the one you are discussing with jom. Jom and his points or ideas dont have to be a part of the discussion between the two of us.


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Because you getting hung up on the "rookie deal" aspect of it led me to believe that you're arguing disingenuously in the same manner as Elizah Huge, who is ignoring my other points to pretend that the rookie deal is the end all be all of the argument.

I've already said this:

He's still on his rookie deal and two years younger than Ayton, plus I believe the draft capital we'd get accompanying him would be greater than what we'd get for Ayton.

As for "Why does it have to be a player on a rookie deal", it doesn't, I just see it as an additional benefit.

 

[fishonjazz]

Because you getting hung up on the "rookie deal" aspect of it led me to believe that you're arguing disingenuously in the same manner as Elizah Huge, who is ignoring my other points to pretend that the rookie deal is the end all be all of the argument.

I've already said this:



As for "Why does it have to be a player on a rookie deal", it doesn't, I just see it as an additional benefit.

Thank you for the response.
I really felt like it had to be a rookie deal to you for some reason and was curious to the reason why.

Im with you. I would prefer to get ayton or a player like him on a rookie deal too.
That is really really hard to do cause teams rarely trade players like like ayton (recent #1 pick who has played fantastically) while they are on rookie deals. But that would also be my preference.
I just dont know of any we can get right now. Ayton seems gettable




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[Elizah Huge]

We need at least one or two young talented players to kick off this rebuild if we go that route.

OKC ****ed up their rebuild from the start as they won 44 games the first year and they didn’t own their own pick. By winning that amount the pick conveyed to Philadelphia.

Next year they get a top-6 pick and this year a top-2 pick. How many years out are they from competing still? We’re going into the 4th year of their rebuild already. Rebuilding is not fun and it ****ing sucks.

 

[fishonjazz]

Someone else made a post a while back saying that if you can get ayton for cheap now then force feed him into big stats (25 points and 12 rebounds per game or something) that you could flip him for much more next year. A good young skilled 2 way big on a long term deal could be very valuable after next year. (Especially if the salary cap goes up) Its like printing money.

Wouldnt hurt the tank much either to force feed him as force feeding a big man isnt really the way to win in todays nba.


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[Elizah Huge]

Someone else made a post a while back saying that if you can get ayton for cheap now then force feed him into big stats (25 points and 12 rebounds per game or something) that you could flip him for much more next year. A good young skilled 2 way big on a long term deal could be very valuable after next year. Its like printing money.

Wouldnt hurt the tank much either to force feed him as force feeding a big man isnt really the way to win in todays nba.


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All true.

 

[Hekate]

Pretty much all big get their points off someone else in todays nba. The post game isnt used much. Rudy got all his points off ingles, conley, don, etc. nice thing is that ayton can get his own points if you want to go that way. His jumper is silky, his baby hook is butter, and he has good footwork, size, athleticism, and youth.



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Ayton had a higher percentage of assisted FGM. %81 of his 2 pointers were assisted, Rudy was at %72.

 

[fishonjazz]

Ayton had a higher percentage of assisted FGM. %81 of his 2 pointers were assisted, Rudy was at %72.

That's really cool.
There is one issue with that stat. If Booker passes the ball down to ayton in the post and he makes a move and scores then that score was assisted even if the pass had little to do with it.
Bigs almost always receive a pass before scoring.

 

[YoungJefe]

Someone else made a post a while back saying that if you can get ayton for cheap now then force feed him into big stats (25 points and 12 rebounds per game or something) that you could flip him for much more next year. A good young skilled 2 way big on a long term deal could be very valuable after next year. (Especially if the salary cap goes up) Its like printing money.

Wouldnt hurt the tank much either to force feed him as force feeding a big man isnt really the way to win in todays nba.


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Gonna have to give up multiple 1sts to get him and give him close to a max

 

[Hekate]

That's really cool.
There is one issue with that stat. If Booker passes the ball down to ayton in the post and he makes a move and scores then that score was assisted even if the pass had little to do with it.
Bigs almost always receive a pass before scoring.

Depends on the move tbh, most moves that require extricate footwork would remove the assist.

I don't argue that their touch around the rim are similar but Ayton's EFG jumped %7-8 after CP3. Since he hasn't shown he can pass out of the pass with any consistency, giving him keys to an offense doesn't sound ideal and may lower his value because GM don't just look at points scored.