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Bill Simmons Article Discusses Jazz Tank Among Other Things

PKM said:
My guess is 16/17. No way both Curry and Bogut go w/o injury..
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Around 20 would be just fine because there's always some talent in that range. . . but that 15, 16, 17 range often has some franchise level guys from time to time. If the Warriors struggle, it would be amazing to end up with two very solid pieces to the roster puzzle moving forward (*I'm counting on the Jazz pick being in the top 5 picks or so.) There's almost always some talented players outside of the lottery. The key is to scout them properly and then pull the trigger to get them. From what I've seen from Dennis Lindsey, I think that he'll do a great job of accomplishing this. Just for a quick reference. . .

2006 - Rajon Rondo (#21)
2007 - Aaron Affalo (#27) and Tiago Splitter (#28)
2008 - Roy Hibbert (#17), Serge Ibaka (#24), Nicholas Batum (#25), George Hill (#26) and Mario Chalmers (#34)
2009 - Jrue Holliday (#17)
2011 - Kawhi Leonard (#15), Nikola Vucevic (#16) and Kenneth Faried (#22)
2013 - Dennis Schroeder (#17) and our own Rudy Gobert (#27)
 
If the Jazz are truly awful and end up in a position to draft a superstar player in this epic draft, there's almost no way that they are in a position to compete for a championship for at least a few more years. That rookie (no matter how good he is) will NOT be the final piece of the puzzle. He will still need to develop and find his role in the starting 5.

Wiggins or Parker (as the best possible examples) would still need to learn the offense/defense and overcome their inevitable rookie mistakes to really contribute at a very high level. There's a chance that the maturation of the other young players this year and next will help to get the rest of the team to the right place, or that there's an impact free agent that could come in and fill that role also. . . but my guess is that they're 3 years away from getting back to the playoffs. They'll be bad this year, better the next (but still miss the playoffs) and then look like a young and promising team the year after that with the right pieces in place and a much stronger bench. With a better coach, they might end up like the Pacers and really surprise as a young team that can compete at a high level once the playoffs arrive. Their size and defense should be good, but they're going to need some better scorers if they want to take it to that level.
 
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freakazoid said:
Splitting hairs at best, IMO.



Right, that's why they beat Denver down the stretch and let that pick come down to a coin toss. Makes total sense.



Thank you for bringing some sanity to this thread. Multiple pos reps coming. I could rant for hours about this, but I just don't have the time and energy for that kind of post nowadays, so I'll try to make a long story short.

Fans get WAY too tripped up over the word tank. Truth be told, all teams have to rebuild at some point, and the worst thing a team can do get stuck in denial about being at that point, and then shoot themselves in the foot by trying to hold on to a mediocre team that isn't going anywhere. Accept the situation for what it is, cut the the dead wood, and then play the odds in order to rebuild as fast as possible, which means finding elite talent. Utah is at a disadvantage when it comes to finding that talent through FA, so like it or not, that means getting your mitts on as many top ten drafts picks as possible, until you come up with a couple diamonds in the rough, God willing, three. The new CBA makes rebuilding even more challenging than before, but that's another topic. Let's just say the window will be shorter and finding quality players on rookie contracts will be absolutely critical.

This whole rebuilding while remaining relevant / rather be mediocre for years than compromise our nobility crap sounds nice and all, but for those who actually swallow that tripe, do yourself a favor and go back and watch the last 20 games or so at the end of the season the year before we drafted Deron, and then report back. Just supposing Utah made an honest effort that year to remain middle of the pack, and instead of putting together a decent team with D-Will, Booze, Memo, Korver, etc., Utah got stuck in mediocrity for the last ten years. I'm guessing Stoked and the like might have a completely different perspective on the situation.
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How would you know as I have not reallt addressed that era of Jazz that much?
 
Weezur said:
He doesn't think highly of Kanter, does he?
Also really doubt the Jazz pulling off an obvious tank like that.
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framer said:
I believe that is what makes it humorous to imagine. Jazz have come a long way since their New Orleans days.
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Lindsey knows that too. That's why he's created the "GM tank." It's really brilliant on his part. Coach and players don't have to buy into and implement the strategy like GS did. I was SO #$%@^ MAD when I watched their games after the trade deadline two years ago and saw the starters laughing and dancing around on the sidelines while subs threw balls away, put up bricks and played "defense" like it was an all-star, "no-touch" exhibition.
 
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Ellipse said:
You imply that they let their veterans walk so that they can get a better draft pick next year. If that is what you meant then I respectfully disagree. There was simply no way to bring Jefferson or Millsap back without hampering the development of what they hope to be superior players. The rotations Corbin used over the last two years made that abundantly clear. If letting Al and Millsap walk leads to a better draft pick, then so be it. But I do not believe their decision was made with next year's draft as the goal.
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I disagree. The problem last season is that there were FOUR players to rotate at the 4/5. Jazz made an early decision NOT to bring back Jefferson, as evidenced by his quick move from SL after the season. Jazz could have easily brought back Millsap and made the rotation work with three players each getting 32 mins. and Evans or Gobert playing in case of foul trouble or injuries.

Likewise, the Jazz were rumored early in free agency to be pursuing guys like Mayo, Copeland, etc. Re-sign Millsap, get Mayo and a PG like Jack or Calderon. Maybe also re-sign Foye for his outside shooting and DMC to back-up Hayward. Jazz are up to the salary floor and easily in the mix, if not the favorite, for the 8th seed.

Instead, Lindsey discontinues talks with all of the Jazz FA's and takes on terrible players from GS for future picks. Nothing can convince me he DOES NOT expect a franchise player out of the 2014 draft. Especially given his oft-repeated phrase that you can't "skip steps in a rebuild."
 
Core4 said:
I disagree. The problem last season is that there were FOUR players to rotate at the 4/5. Jazz made an early decision NOT to bring back Jefferson, as evidenced by his quick move from SL after the season. Jazz could have easily brought back Millsap and made the rotation work with three players each getting 32 mins. and Evans or Gobert playing in case of foul trouble or injuries.

Likewise, the Jazz were rumored early in free agency to be pursuing guys like Mayo, Copeland, etc. Re-sign Millsap, get Mayo and a PG like Jack or Calderon. Maybe also re-sign Foye for his outside shooting and DMC to back-up Hayward. Jazz are up to the salary floor and easily in the mix, if not the favorite, for the 8th seed.

Instead, Lindsey discontinues talks with all of the Jazz FA's and takes on terrible players from GS for future picks. Nothing can convince me he DOES NOT expect a franchise player out of the 2014 draft. Especially given his oft-repeated phrase that you can't "skip steps in a rebuild."
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In Utah Lindsey found the perfect opportunity to show what he has got. Very tight FO, already assempbled young core. Now he will make his stamp with the star of the team and bring the coach under his thumb.

Not many new GMs and coaches have the field lined up for them the way that Lindsey has. Time for him to shine (and so far he is).
 
freakazoid...I understand what you are saying about the Denver game. That was an outlier. All I can say is that I WATCHED many GS games, probably the last 20-25, tuning in off and on throughout the games, but watching almost all the 4th quarters in their entirety. And when you see Golden State's STARTERS being pulled with 4th quarter leads and then laughing and joking when ridiculous TO's and terrible shots are being put up, with Reverend Jackson smiling on the bench, it's OBVIOUS what the intention was. Don't know if there's an official stat, but I'm sure GS set a record for "come-from-ahead" losses.

If you recall, there were also reports of Riley (Warriors GM) trying to negotiate with KOC for GS to keep their pick. Poor Kevin...I think he underestimated GS' ability to creatively lose so many games and have so many "injuries." Golden State finished the season by going 3-17! Their wins came against Denver and New Orleans and twice against Minnesota and Sacramento. And the Denver game was played against a struggling Nuggets team missing Chandler and Gallinari and with one of the worst career performances by Faried. Still, Denver cut the lead from 17 down to 5 halfway through the 4th, but only had FOUR FG's in the last 7 1/2 minutes. Tough to lose a game like! And there were 11 games AFTER that one, so it wasn't like that was the game that determined a tie for 7th vs. getting it outright. And who can forget the last couple of games, especially the loss to San Antonio that featured GS' bench/D-Leaguer's against San Antonio's D-Leaguer's? Golden State was the FIRST team to start FIVE rookies in a game in the modern era. Sorry, but their injury list the last two weeks was VERY suspicious.

Golden State's record before the trade deadline was 17-21. After they jettisoned Ellis and decided to sit Curry, they went 6-22, winning against Denver, New Orleans, twice against Sacramento and twice against Minnesota. You're probably the only one who believes GS didn't intentionally lose games.
 
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