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Boston vs Utah for Hayward

Saw these comments from Ainge:

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/246066/Significant-Change-Could-Occur-For-Celtics-In-Offseason

The Boston Celtics reached the Eastern Conference Finals this season while not sacrificing any future assets, but Danny Ainge acknowledged the team needs improvement.

“I don’t know what ‘level’ that means,” he said. “I feel like wins are deceiving sometimes. I think that the fact that we were one of three teams still left playing was something to be proud of, but it’s not necessarily where we really are.

“I think sometimes teams make false assumptions of their team based on things like that. I think that our team is not that much different than a lot of our competition in the East. I think we had a good year in spite of some injuries, you know, with [Al] Horford going down early and Isaiah [Thomas] missing a short time and Avery [Bradley] missing 22 games there in a stretch. We had to overcome some injuries, and it was good because our depth got a chance to play. Everybody on our roster got a chance to prove their worth.

“But I feel like it doesn’t really matter what we’ve accomplished. If we’d lost Game 7 against the Wizards, I don’t feel any different than if we’re where we are today. I know that we’re good. I know that we’re not great. I know that we still have more to do, and, you know, that next step is by far the hardest.”

The Celtics were eliminated by the Cleveland Cavaliers in five games.

“This is what’s difficult about our business that I think sometimes... you know, I don’t think I knew this even when I was a player and maybe even when I coached as much as I do now,” Ainge said. “As I look around the league, I think sometimes the mistakes that are made are when you’re just that little bit, just that one piece away and you can’t get that piece.

“Just because you’re one piece away doesn’t mean you can get it. And if you force yourself to get it, and if you force a deal or force yourself to get the second best available or the third or fourth best available player at that position that you need, then it might not make you that much better or make you still not good enough, and you’re stuck. So, yeah, we’re not that far away, but we’re still a ways away. We still know we need to get better. Everybody in our organization knows we need to get better. We need to add.”

While the Celtics own the top overall pick and have a good core, they could make major changes this offseason.

“Time will tell on that, but, yeah, there is a potential for there to be some significant change,” said Ainge. “But maybe less change. Maybe more change; maybe not. A lot will be dependent on what we’re able to pull off in the draft and in deals leading up to free agency and then what happens in free agency. There’s just so much unknown right now. Right now it’s all talk and pipe dreams and planning. But there’s no certainty. It’s an exciting time for us, and it’s a very busy time for us.”
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If I'm Hayward hitting my prime and I'm considering leaving Utah for another team, the above sounds fairly underwhelming.
 
Mission Accomplished said:
You guys are so dumb. Hayward needs to leave. I have never seen such an obsession with any player we have ever had. If we resign him do any if you think that we are all of the sudden equal to GS. Is our future brighter than the Timberwolves? Seriously, no one wants to develop talant anymore because Gordon had one good year.

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So we can count you out for our post-championship celebration?
 
dont-feed-the-trolls.jpg
 
infection said:
So we can count you out for our post-championship celebration?
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If we win a championship with Hayward as the man than sure. It isnt going to happen.

What are we going to do when Gobert is a URFA? Write a message on the moon for him to stay. I just have perspective Hayward is not even close the the best Jazz man I have seen in my lifetime. Why sell the future for him?

If he signs a team friendly contract below thw max for sure we can be a good team. If we sign him for max money this will be the highest seed we will ever see in the next four years.

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Giving Hayward a max deal so that we have a core of Hayward and Gobert isn't a problem. Giving too much money to Hill or someone else on our current roster is a problem. The Jazz need to find a third All Star somehow.
 
If the Cs are willing to trade their 2018 BK pick, plus two players for Jimmy Butler, while keeping Fultz to take over for IT in a year, they can argue that they have a team that can unseat the Bulls in a couple years (assuming Fultz pans out). They'll have to find an interior defender and rebounder somewhere, but it's doable.

If the Cs don't commit to that path, i don't see what attracts Hayward to Boston.

I think the Cs have figured out that offering IT a big extension is not a good idea, either short term or long term.
 
Mission Accomplished said:
If we win a championship with Hayward as the man than sure. It isnt going to happen.

What are we going to do when Gobert is a URFA? Write a message on the moon for him to stay. I just have perspective Hayward is not even close the the best Jazz man I have seen in my lifetime. Why sell the future for him?

If he signs a team friendly contract below thw max for sure we can be a good team. If we sign him for max money this will be the highest seed we will ever see in the next four years.

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The Jazz believe that they're the third best team in the west right now with potential for internal improvement. Both Hayward and Gobert are showing they have another level to reach beyond what they showed mid-season. Hood, Lyles and Exum are still developing. If the Jazz play their cards right, they can begin to challenge San Antonio, who is losing Parker and Ginobli at a minimum.

That's a 55+ win team and something worth keeping together.
 
Catchall said:
If the Cs are willing to trade their 2018 BK pick, plus two players for Jimmy Butler, while keeping Fultz to take over for IT in a year, they can argue that they have a team that can unseat the Bulls in a couple years (assuming Fultz pans out). They'll have to find an interior defender and rebounder somewhere, but it's doable.

If the Cs don't commit to that path, i don't see what attracts Hayward to Boston.

I think the Cs have figured out that offering IT a big extension is not a good idea, either short term or long term.
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I think even that's riddled with question marks, though. From Hayward's perspective of being in the league 7 years and for the most part not competing well as a team prior to this year, it's just unclear how changing the dynamic in Boston and playing along side another wing as the other star on the team would work out. Naturally that's a good core to build around and a lot of talent with a possible high ceiling, but even staying here is much less risky and arguably as high a ceiling (may take some heat for that).
 
It's true that there are uncertainties. The Wizards are also competitive at the top of the east. But if the Cs have Butler, Fultz and Hayward, that team becomes interesting. Anything short of that, however, may not attract Hayward.

Right now, the consensus is that the Jazz are 60% or 65% likely to retain Girdon.
 
Catchall said:
The Jazz believe that they're the third best team in the west right now with potential for internal improvement. Both Hayward and Gobert are showing they have another level to reach beyond what they showed mid-season. Hood, Lyles and Exum are still developing. If the Jazz play their cards right, they can begin to challenge San Antonio, who is losing Parker and Ginobli at a minimum.

That's a 55+ win team and something worth keeping together.
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I dont know if you have been watching they stopped the development of the whole team because they feel Gordon is that special. Listen to Locke they are set to find a veteren guard. Then replace everyone including Jingles with minimum contract players.

So, we might seem to be the third best in the west but for how long? Other teams are not frozen in time they are going to make roster changes.



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If the Jazz keep Hayward, they have 2 All Stars in their prime.

San Antonio is losing Parker, Ginobli and has Kawhi and an aging core. They'll make moves.

Houston's current team isn't terribly sustainable. The players are fairly old, injury-prone and don't play defense. The Jazz felt they were better than the Rockets already.

The Clippers have peaked, and if CP leaves, they're done. Redick and Crawford are declining, and one or more might not return.

OKC is probably going to lose Westbrook in another year.

Memphis is old and getting older.

The challenges will come from Minnesota, Denver and Portland -- all in the NW division.


The Jazz need to add an impact guard and a versatile PF. Obviously, they're hoping Exum and Lyles become good players, but they probably need other options as well.
 
Catchall said:
It's true that there are uncertainties. The Wizards are also competitive at the top of the east. But if the Cs have Butler, Fultz and Hayward, that team becomes interesting. Anything short of that, however, may not attract Hayward.

Right now, the consensus is that the Jazz are 60% or 65% likely to retain Girdon.
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To you and anyone else who continues to spread these Hayward with Butler/George ideas for Boston, how does that even relatively help their biggest issues which are rebounding and interior defense?

Hint: It doesn't. And this is partly what Ainge was implying imo.
 
silesian said:
Why do you assume I live there now?

By the way, I used to live in Worcester, have traveled extensively to all major US cities including a lot of time in Boston.

Moreover, there is a lot of provincialism in every city. Folks who occasionally travel more than a few miles from their home, have seen 0.001% of the area, and have no perspective on how their city compares to others.
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I'm not saying there are not a lot of people in the metro area. But the surrounding towns are structured in a way that they feel like small town suburbia. The metro town of Concord, MA could very well be a town way out in western Mass.
 
Beantown said:
I'm not saying there are not a lot of people in the metro area. But the surrounding towns are structured in a way that they feel like small town suburbia. The metro town of Concord, MA could very well be a town way out in western Mass.
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Great point. I'd live to live in the Boston burbs if not for the cost of living.

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