Conley hamstringing again

[Sean]

Hamstring injuries just aren’t that easy. Soft tissue takes time to heal. It can go from mild to severe in one game. And it’s pretty obvious this is a chronic issue he has that has never gotten fully right.

It's easy enough to keep listing him as questionable two weeks after the tweak. If it's that severe, they need to stop with the ******** and just say Conley is out. It's not ****ing hard.

At least then we could stop pretending the Jazz has a chance of winning this or that they're playing 4D chess here and keeping him out until he is needed. This is the most ridiculous, pathetic ****ed up injury handling I've seen and it's indefensible.

 

[infection]

So there’s no real rooting guide for the Nets tonight, other than hoping they lose while Harden looks amazing.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Then it's not a mild hamstring issue and the Jazz is leading people on with this questionable ********.

I would be okay with that I guess ... as long as our guys know what it is... having the ghost of Mike Conley hang out there likely causes a little stress for the clips coaches at least.

 

[TheGoldStandard]

I have a friend that works for the Jazz. I never really talk about it because people wouldn't believe me anyway, but I always try to be a straight shooter, but take it for what it is worth.

My friend told me that Conley thought he'd be playing since game 1 and feels good. If this is true, what the hell is our training staff doing?

Again, don't take my word for it, but I anticipate this will leak out everywhere soon.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

What I’m saying is that either way, it’s paradoxical for us a Jazz fans. Scenarios that hurt the Nets also hurt us (because we’d sit Mike), and scenarios that help the Nets (them winning and Harden surviving) are bad for us because we’d see them in the finals.

It’s the Dante Exum paradox... we need him to play well to increase his trade value... but if he plays well DL will never trade him...

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I have a friend that works for the Jazz. I never really talk about it because people wouldn't believe me anyway, but I always try to be a straight shooter, but take it for what it is worth.

My friend told me that Conley thought he'd be playing since game 1 and feels good. If this is true, what the hell is our training staff doing?

Again, don't take my word for it, but I anticipate this will leak out everywhere soon.

I watched him warm up last time he was out... he went pretty hard in warmups... was declared out though.

The staff is doing a CYA job if this is true. They likely aren’t coming back after this years fiasco... they don’t need Mike out there getting hurt while they are looking for a new gig.

 

[oneye]

I watched him warm up last time he was out... he went pretty hard in warmups... was declared out though.

The staff is doing a CYA job if this is true. They likely aren’t coming back after this years fiasco... they don’t need Mike out there getting hurt while they are looking for a new gig.

Mike knows Ryan Smith well. Mike golfs with him on the regular. If there is this huge disconnect with the medical staff you’d think he would say something and the owner could literally step in and would if it was this bad of a situation.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Mike knows Ryan Smith well. Mike golfs with him on the regular. If there is this huge disconnect with the medical staff you’d think he would say something and the owner could literally step in and would if it was this bad of a situation.

Just like how he stepped in and helped quell the disconnect between Dons people and our training staff?

There is a pretty big issue with an owner stepping in and over ruling a medical staff. I’d imagine if something bad happened the league would investigate that for sure... I also think there is likely now a very strained relationship with the current staff... doubt they’d go silent on something like that.

 

[MT Steve]

Just like how he stepped in and helped quell the disconnect between Dons people and our training staff?

There is a pretty big issue with an owner stepping in and over ruling a medical staff. I’d imagine if something bad happened the league would investigate that for sure... I also think there is likely now a very strained relationship with the current staff... doubt they’d go silent on something like that.

Given that the trainer that cleared Mitchell to play in the playoffs was literally Dwyane Wade's personal trainer, I think ownership was already not completely happy with our dumbass medical staff sabotaging our playoff run.

 

[oneye]

Just like how he stepped in and helped quell the disconnect between Dons people and our training staff?

There is a pretty big issue with an owner stepping in and over ruling a medical staff. I’d imagine if something bad happened the league would investigate that for sure... I also think there is likely now a very strained relationship with the current staff... doubt they’d go silent on something like that.

I get what you’re saying, I’m not saying the owner would make the decision, I’m saying I’d be surprised if Ryan Smith didn’t have a conversation with them after the Donovan stuff. And obviously the relationship is strained with Donovan, but there is no real logical motivation to hold a player out if he’s ready to go. None.

 

[oneye]

Given that the trainer that cleared Mitchell to play in the playoffs was literally Dwyane Wade's personal trainer, I think ownership was already not completely happy with our dumbass medical staff sabotaging our playoff run.

Eh, Donovan had been working with that dude last offseason already. I remember seeing him on his IG story and Donovan made a post with him in it last year.

 

[oneye]

If Mike doesn’t play, and the Jazz lose the series though there will be lasting offseason tension with Donovan though. I really have no doubts about that.

 

[MT Steve]

Eh, Donovan had been working with that dude last offseason already. I remember seeing him on his IG story and Donovan made a post with him in it last year.

Weren't you screaming in the other thread about how much you hated this trainer and wanted him away from our team's bench during games?

 

[infection]

I was going to post a larger post regarding where we're at and not just Mike, but my frustration comes from Jazz management, and I think what we're seeing is the trickle-down. They fundamentally have an overconfidence about multiple issues (i.e. we've built a good roster and therefore we don't need to stress about the 9th and 10th men, or we want to prioritize Mike and Don's health at the cost of the first seed because their health is more important than seeding, or hey we think we can beat Memphis so let's save Don for later). Mike went out and he describes it as some tightness or a tug. Obviously players aren't going to give you a complete picture, but Mike gets listed as day-to-day initially. Then he gets listed as questionable, which is the closest thing on an injury report to available beyond "game-time-decision." He didn't suffer some massive injury or that would have been obvious, and they would have come out and said so, though they did say the MRI showed "strain." The injury doesn't have to be worse than we were told for them to feel they need to hold him out. I hate to turn this to COVID, but it's the best example. When is good enough to ease certain restrictions? Those opinions vary, with each person thinking they're "#followingthescience" when this is more personal intuition. A health official from San Diego recently said that June 15th is not a magic end date and that restrictions shouldn't be eased until they saw two incubation cycles where there were no new cases. I believe that what we're seeing is a combination of them playing it safe, but also a carelessness of thinking we're fine out there without Mike, or at least that it's best to save him for a deeper playoff run while being incredibly short-sighted about the here-and-now. There's always risk, and if this is coupled with irrational stupidity from management wanting to "save some for later," akin to Quin and his challenges, then we will continue to think about "OMG what if he played too soon and blew out his hammy?" He could blow out his hamstring next year after a whole off-season. There's no real bench mark, and I think the other end of the equation that's really pissing me off is that I believe he's been held out because they just assume we'll advance and it's better to have Mike then rather than now.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I get what you’re saying, I’m not saying the owner would make the decision, I’m saying I’d be surprised if Ryan Smith didn’t have a conversation with them after the Donovan stuff. And obviously the relationship is strained with Donovan, but there is no real logical motivation to hold a player out if he’s ready to go. None.

Right but they could be conservative to cover their asses... no reason to give an okay if the light is yellow and you already have a relationship that is strained.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I was going to post a larger post regarding where we're at and not just Mike, but my frustration comes from Jazz management, and I think what we're seeing is the trickle-down. They fundamentally have an overconfidence about multiple issues (i.e. we've built a good roster and therefore we don't need to stress about the 9th and 10th men, or we want to prioritize Mike and Don's health at the cost of the first seed because their health is more important than seeding, or hey we think we can beat Memphis so let's save Don for later). Mike went out and he describes it as some tightness or a tug. Obviously players aren't going to give you a complete picture, but Mike gets listed as day-to-day initially. Then he gets listed as questionable, which is the closest thing on an injury report to available beyond "game-time-decision." He didn't suffer some massive injury or that would have been obvious, and they would have come out and said so, though they did say the MRI showed "strain." The injury doesn't have to be worse than we were told for them to feel they need to hold him out. I hate to turn this to COVID, but it's the best example. When is good enough to ease certain restrictions? Those opinions vary, with each person thinking they're "#followingthescience" when this is more personal intuition. A health official from San Diego recently said that June 15th is not a magic end date and that restrictions shouldn't be eased until they saw two incubation cycles where there were no new cases. I believe that what we're seeing is a combination of them playing it safe, but also a carelessness of thinking we're fine out there without Mike, or at least that it's best to save him for a deeper playoff run while being incredibly short-sighted about the here-and-now. There's always risk, and if this is coupled with irrational stupidity from management wanting to "save some for later," akin to Quin and his challenges, then we will continue to think about "OMG what if he played too soon and blew out his hammy?" He could blow out his hamstring next year after a whole off-season. There's no real bench mark, and I think the other end of the equation that's really pissing me off is that I believe he's been held out because they just assume we'll advance and it's better to have Mike then rather than now.

It is not crazy to think that even if we had a Mike Conley at full strength that we could lose 2 out of 3 against the Clips. They very well might be the best team left.

I think people think the evaluation on the hamstring is black and white... you'd know better than most but it is likely some part evaluation some part self diagnosis. How far is too far when it comes to being conservative. Mike played a playoff game with a broken ****ing face. My guess is he is game to play and test it.

They had a short offseason to help strengthen the hamstring and could have been working it during the season (maybe they were) and it hasn't responded... cuz here we are again. He almost surely will re-injure it... at some point. So when do we get the green light here... 12, 14, 16 days? its all arbitrary.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I feel like every year guys rush back from injury during the playoffs to chance it... sometimes it ends tragically like with KD... sometimes like with Steph it ends in a title. Kawhi was on one leg the year the Raps won. I believe Bosh also rushed back at some point and played a part in a title team.

It doesn't feel great but if Mike feels good enough to go and if he's comfortable chancing it then he should be given the opportunity to try.

 

[babe]

I feel like every year guys rush back from injury during the playoffs to chance it... sometimes it ends tragically like with KD... sometimes like with Steph it ends in a title. Kawhi was on one leg the year the Raps won. I believe Bosh also rushed back at some point and played a part in a title team.

It doesn't feel great but if Mike feels good enough to go and if he's comfortable chancing it then he should be given the opportunity to try.

I have been of the opinion/uniformed guess that Conley has felt like he could play, and it's load management/coachdecision to try to let it heal if we can "afford to".

reputation means a lot in most "games" or enterprises/political causes/corporations/governments. It's always gonna a public relations problem/guessing game to a large extent. But reasonablyh talented and intelligent players will look at policies like this and estimate their relative chances with different management characteristics.

Our management will look better than most to the better playersl

This is a long term win for us to be this way..

 

[Sean]

I would be okay with that I guess ... as long as our guys know what it is... having the ghost of Mike Conley hang out there likely causes a little stress for the clips coaches at least.

I think it's pretty clear the Clippers have caught on. It's been the same game all four: the day before, Conley is listed as questionable. The day of, he's listed as OUT.

They'd be stupid to keep falling for it. Yeah, it's a great 'oh ****' move if they do it again for game five and then, bam, he's ready to play but let's be honest: that's not likely to happen. So, any edge we may have gotten from it originally is played out and now it's just creating way more questions than answers. At the end of the day, in terms of injury lexicon (and not just the word), questionable means there's question whether he'll play or not. I think we're beyond that point. End the charade and list him as doubtful. If, by some miracle, he's able to play, then beautiful!

 

[oneye]

Weren't you screaming in the other thread about how much you hated this trainer and wanted him away from our team's bench during games?

I do, his private trainer does not have any business on our bench during games. Outside of that, it’s fine that he has personal trainers. But they should not be involved during a game. Imagine if all 14 guys had their own personal staff on our bench during every playoff game and everyone had to consult on spur of the moment things. No. Dude thinks hes more special than the 14 other guys on the roster when he says he’s so “humble”.