Dante Exum vs. Zach Lavine

[Beer]

I do believe he is currently the better offensive player because of his ability to shoot and finish at the rim. But I actually said that he would TURN OUT to be the far better offensive player. Why do people think Lavine is a finished product? He's the same age as Dante. Lavine has tools and skills that Dante doesn't. Dante has a better feel for the game and playmaking. Both can learn.

I'd lump him in with Trey. He does more bad things than good things on both ends of the floor.

 

[Flc]

This conversation will be one worth having in two years. As I've mentioned before, generally PGs take a moderate leap from year one to year two, and then a major leap from year two to year three, and then minor jumps or regressions after that.

We'll have a very good idea in what we have with Trey next year and Exum the year after. The conversation is fun, but ultimately an exercise in futility, until then.

 

[AlaskanAssassin]

I'm not even sure how this is a question. Zach Lavine is having a much better year than Dante. I'm glad we have Dante. I think he could be REALLY good in a couple years. But Lavine is clearly better right now. In essentially the same minutes per game, Lavine is averaging more points, assists, and rebounds. He also has much higher shooting percentages. Dante is certainly a better defender right now, but he's sort of an anomaly. Not many 19-20 year olds are expected to be good defenders right away. Lavine has much more confidence right now. I'm hoping an off-season of working on physique and developing a left hand will give Dante some confidence.

Who's going to be better in 5 years? Who knows? Let's hope it's Dante.

The biggest think Dante has going for him is that he hasn't played against much competition during his life. Zach had the benefit of playing US High School ball and UCLA. Dante went straight from Australian HS Ball to the NBA. Next year will be much more telling than this one regarding who will be a better player.

 

[seattlejazzfan]

I'm not even sure how this is a question. Zach Lavine is having a much better year than Dante. I'm glad we have Dante. I think he could be REALLY good in a couple years. But Lavine is clearly better right now. In essentially the same minutes per game, Lavine is averaging more points, assists, and rebounds. He also has much higher shooting percentages. Dante is certainly a better defender right now, but he's sort of an anomaly. Not many 19-20 year olds are expected to be good defenders right away. Lavine has much more confidence right now. I'm hoping an off-season of working on physique and developing a left hand will give Dante some confidence.

Who's going to be better in 5 years? Who knows? Let's hope it's Dante.

The biggest think Dante has going for him is that he hasn't played against much competition during his life. Zach had the benefit of playing US High School ball and UCLA. Dante went straight from Australian HS Ball to the NBA. Next year will be much more telling than this one regarding who will be a better player.

In a nutshell, LaVine isn't afraid of the ball and is willing to step on the court and compete on the offensive end of the court. Only one thing worse than sucking - being unwilling or scared to compete.

 

[LogGrad98]

The defensive ability that Dante is showing at his age and lack of experience bodes very well for us. He could turn into a Gary Payton like player. That might be a decent comparison for him, especially if Dante can find some nasty to his game.

 

[framer]

I'm not even sure how this is a question. Zach Lavine is having a much better year than Dante. I'm glad we have Dante. I think he could be REALLY good in a couple years. But Lavine is clearly better right now. In essentially the same minutes per game, Lavine is averaging more points, assists, and rebounds. He also has much higher shooting percentages. Dante is certainly a better defender right now, but he's sort of an anomaly. Not many 19-20 year olds are expected to be good defenders right away. Lavine has much more confidence right now. I'm hoping an off-season of working on physique and developing a left hand will give Dante some confidence.

Who's going to be better in 5 years? Who knows? Let's hope it's Dante.

The biggest think Dante has going for him is that he hasn't played against much competition during his life. Zach had the benefit of playing US High School ball and UCLA. Dante went straight from Australian HS Ball to the NBA. Next year will be much more telling than this one regarding who will be a better player.

You also realize in that game against us that he committed seven turnovers and that isn't even counting the times he was stuffed by Gobert. Any true measure of playing basketball has Exum better than Levine, and Exum's mental game will help him improve at a high rate. Hell, at this point I don't think that Levine is better than Trey. It is interesting to see how many people hate Trey but love Levine when they kind of play the same type of game. Except Trey takes care of the ball.

 

[Cope]

Best part of this thread? Not more than 3 posters I almost guarantee have watched Levine play outside of the games vs. Utah, the dunk contest, and the All Star game - yet they are experts.

There is a some strong opinions with the 'analytics' piece which may or may not be true.

I have watched maybe 3 other TWolves games in which Levine was definitely off his game. You can see the athleticism there... more than Dante and the exciting part for Dante was how athletic he was.
One poster mentioned teaching Exum to have the 'fire' I believe, drive the ball, etc. To me those are things that can't be taught so that is concerning. With Levine can you teach him to produce in the flow of the offense? Both of them have their areas of improvement.

In no way am I supporting Levine over Exum as it is way too early to tell but the night he had against us opened some eyes from the sounds of things.

 

[freakazoid]

Only one thing worse than sucking - being unwilling or scared to compete.

Unless the goal is winning games, of course. You call it scared and I agree, but there's a positive to understanding personal limitations and making an effort not to allow those limitations to hurt the team. If only Trey could understand that concept.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Unless the goal is winning games, of course. You call it scared and I agree, but there's a positive to understanding personal limitations and making an effort not to allow those limitations to hurt the team. If only Trey could understand that concept.

Pretty spot on. Exum is trying to make winning plays by deferring. I think he is a self-aware dude and is trying to hard to run the offense the right way and give us the best chance to win. I do think he is staying a little too far in his lane and I understand our frustration with him.

The good news is ... Exum's development curve is only a problem because we are much better now than we thought we would be. We need to give him an offseason to work on his body and game before we can really judge.

 

[Hekate]

You also realize in that game against us that he committed seven turnovers and that isn't even counting the times he was stuffed by Gobert. Any true measure of playing basketball has Exum better than Levine, and Exum's mental game will help him improve at a high rate. Hell, at this point I don't think that Levine is better than Trey. It is interesting to see how many people hate Trey but love Levine when they kind of play the same type of game. Except Trey takes care of the ball.

I would love to see Exum get blocked. These guys are supposed to make mistakes. At least Lavine tries.

 

[framer]

Best part of this thread? Not more than 3 posters I almost guarantee have watched Levine play outside of the games vs. Utah, the dunk contest, and the All Star game - yet they are experts.

There is a some strong opinions with the 'analytics' piece which may or may not be true.

I have watched maybe 3 other TWolves games in which Levine was definitely off his game. You can see the athleticism there... more than Dante and the exciting part for Dante was how athletic he was.
One poster mentioned teaching Exum to have the 'fire' I believe, drive the ball, etc. To me those are things that can't be taught so that is concerning. With Levine can you teach him to produce in the flow of the offense? Both of them have their areas of improvement.

In no way am I supporting Levine over Exum as it is way too early to tell but the night he had against us opened some eyes from the sounds of things.

I'm not sure you can be an upper crust defender in basketball and not have a little aggression. In the end, I'm not worried about Exum going all hippy on us.

 

[da ThRONe]

Unless the goal is winning games, of course. You call it scared and I agree, but there's a positive to understanding personal limitations and making an effort not to allow those limitations to hurt the team. If only Trey could understand that concept.

Here's the thing you have to try to know what your limitations are, but most importantly which limitations can be over come or simply needs to be avoided.

You threw Burke in this. Unlike most I think Burke's confidence in himself combine with his work ethic is what's going to make him a borderline all-star player. I know his 1-11, 2-19, and 4-22 games does nothing for his fg% which everybody wants to kill him for. However you want a guy who has enough self belief that the next shot is the one to get him started. Now his accuracy has to get consistently better and time will tell if his does. I've seen some player aggression level not be equal with their skill level and with hard work they became stars-megastars. What you don't see are players who are afraid to make mistake in this league just gain that kind of faith in themselves. Can't think of one player.

 

[framer]

I would love to see Exum get blocked. These guys are supposed to make mistakes. At least Lavine tries.

Trey Burke's problem isn't that he doesn't try enough. . . As far as Exum goes, he keeps watching his teammates get destroyed at the hoop with no calls. Remember the crap that got Burks injured. As long as he keeps improving, which watching both sides of the ball, he is, I'm happy right now. I expect him to really take off his third year and be transformative. Once he fills out, which point guard is going to defend him?

 

[da ThRONe]

Pretty spot on. Exum is trying to make winning plays by deferring. I think he is a self-aware dude and is trying to hard to run the offense the right way and give us the best chance to win. I do think he is staying a little too far in his lane and I understand our frustration with him.

The good news is ... Exum's development curve is only a problem because we are much better now than we thought we would be. We need to give him an offseason to work on his body and game before we can really judge.

I think you are missing the point about Exum's development. I think what people are saying is that he can't get better that's obvious. I think people are saying he doesn't have a killer instinct to take him to the next level as a player. At this point either you have it or you don't. As I said in the post above this one. I can't recall one player developing a killer instinct simply because they got better as you expect young players to do.

 

[Doublea]

It kinda sucks how underrated defense is compared to offense.

 

[framer]

Here's the thing you have to try to know what your limitations are, but most importantly which limitations can be over come or simply needs to be avoided.

You threw Burke in this. Unlike most I think Burke's confidence in himself combine with his work ethic is what's going to make him a borderline all-star player. I know his 1-11, 2-19, and 4-22 games does nothing for his fg% which everybody wants to kill him for. However you want a guy who has enough self belief that the next shot is the one to get him started. Now his accuracy has to get consistently better and time will tell if his does. I've seen some player aggression level not be equal with their skill level and with hard work they became stars-megastars. What you don't see are players who are afraid to make mistake in this league just gain that kind of faith in themselves. Can't think of one player.

Little Johnny Stockton certainly played within himself. He could probably have averaged 25 a night if he played aggressively. He also shot a criminally low amount of three pointers for his accuracy level. He spent time doing unsexy things like setting nasty back picks and throwing the ball to #32.

 

[da ThRONe]

It kinda sucks how underrated defense is compared to offense.

Basketball is a rare sport where equal effort on offense consistently trumps defense. Not that defense isn't important.

Case in point MKG is one of the leagues best perimeter defender. Last year he gave up big nights to LeBron and Carmelo. Played great defense on both all night yet it didn't matter.

 

[framer]

It kinda sucks how underrated defense is compared to offense.

When the Jazz just defensively lock down, it is some of the most fun I have had watching basketball in years. Certainly more fun than the really good DWill Boozer teams that would rarely get separation from good teams on the scoreboard because of their defensive deficiencies.

 

[framer]

Basketball is a rare sport where equal effort on offense consistently trumps defense. Not that defense isn't important.

Case in point MKG is one of the leagues best perimeter defender. Last year he gave up big nights to LeBron and Carmelo. Played great defense on both all night yet it didn't matter.

Jazz D has clowned some pretty good players this year. It is very difficult to play stellar perimeter D which is why you need really good rim protection from the bigs. Glad we have that. MKG does not.

 

[da ThRONe]

Little Johnny Stockton certainly played within himself. He could probably have averaged 25 a night if he played aggressively. He also shot a criminally low amount of three pointers for his accuracy level. He spent time doing unsexy things like setting nasty back picks and throwing the ball to #32.

I think your missing the point. Did anybody ever accuse Stockton of being afraid or lacking a killer instinct? It's not about looking to put up 20+ shot attempts a night. It's about trying to have an impact on the game offensively. It Exum doesn't even try outside of open three pointers.