Democracy after Trump

[fishonjazz]

With all due respect, I don't care what I look like to you. But hey, call me dumb. Call me names. I see that it works. For some....

I didn't ask for examples because I didn't believe you. I asked for examples of what the worst stuff was. Once again, I'm being devil's advocate. I worked in higher education for years so I know when a narrative is being forced. Trump has created some of the narrative based off poor words/messages and some of the narrative has been attributed to him unfairly.

I don't like what he said during the Charlottesville stuff. He was incorrect to say what he said and in the manner that he said. I don't believe what he said makes him a White Nationalist, but I agree that he was wrong. It makes him poor in his wording. He has clearly come out numerous times against racism shown by those groups.

Calling a country a **** hole isn't racist. He didn't say the people were terrible. That's like me saying there is a bar down on Bourbon Street that's a **** hole. I'm talking about the bar. I could walk in the bar but I choose not to. Doesn't mean I'm a piece of **** for walking into it. If Obama would have called some rural area or other country a **** hole, I wouldn't think it was a racist comment at all and I doubt the media would either.

I think a lot of what he says is twisted to have more connotation than it does. Just because he said LeBron is an idiot doesn't mean he's an idiot because he's black or an athlete. But hey, that's what Lemon wants you to think. People call Steven A Smith an idiot all the time but nobody calls them racist.

But this is worth noting. Trump's First Ever National Monument was recognizing an African American Civil War training site in Kentucky. https://www.washingtonpost.com/ener...rican-american-troops/?utm_term=.40ab0571bbb8 And of course the Washington Post has to question the motive as political. However, would a White Nationalist create a National Monument for African American soldiers who fought against the Confederacy?

Bunch of **** hole counties in eastern europe. Interesting how he never says a bad word about them. Wonder why? Maybe cause they are predominantly white?

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[Gameface]

This was from 2016 and I have heard this was only the tip of an iceberg: https://www.tennessean.com/story/ne...-reports-voter-fraud-tennessee-2016/97038324/

You heard it was only the tip of the iceberg? From who and based on what?

I don't want to minimize those 42 votes that were not legitimate, but that's 42 votes out of 4.3 million in that state. And the vast majority were felons voting, which seems like it was an error on the part of their election system to not block felons from registering. The 9 double votes, if they know who those people are they should be charged and I believe the penalty for that should be severe.

But they investigated and found 42 instances out of 4.3 million. You saying it is just the tip of the iceberg is baseless. And if it is an iceberg and the iceberg has a tip 42 instances big, what are you suggesting? 1000 illegitimate votes? Out of 4.3 million. If you could show this iceberg you'd have my attention, but this is a story 2 years old, there have been federal investigations (conducted by Trump's government) and no widespread voter fraud has been found.

 

[Deleted member 5000]

@LoPo run away, far far away! Admit you're a nazi or the declaration of Independence is hate speech first to please them!

 

[gandalfe]

This was from 2016 and I have heard this was only the tip of an iceberg: https://www.tennessean.com/story/ne...-reports-voter-fraud-tennessee-2016/97038324/

There was only a single provable case that resulted in conviction, but, OK, let's say 42 in Tennessee. There are over 6.7 million people in TN. That comes out to about 0.000006%. So... who gives a crap?

 

[gandalfe]

@LoPo run away, far far away! Admit you're a nazi or the declaration of Independence is hate speech first to please them!

You feeling OK, snowflake?

 

[Deleted member 5000]

You still enjoying watching alex jones?

@LoPo I'll take the cover fire run!

 

[LoPo]

So there are 42 counts of confirmed voter fraud that you are okay with.

BUT, the state of Alabama closes some satellite court houses due to lack of funding. These courthouses just happen to also be places where people can vote. The left wants to tell me it's because Alabama is so red that it's suppressing blue voters but there is no actual proof that the courthouse closing hurts blue votes vs red votes.

Are you serious?

 

[Gameface]

So there are 42 counts of confirmed voter fraud that you are okay with.

BUT, the state of Alabama closes some satellite court houses due to lack of funding. These courthouses just happen to also be places where people can vote. The left wants to tell me it's because Alabama is so red that it's suppressing blue voters but there is no actual proof that the courthouse closing hurts blue votes vs red votes.

Are you serious?

I'm not okay with it.

 

[Gameface]

@LoPo I spent a significant amount of time giving honest responses to the points you made.

You have acknowledged and addressed none of my responses in a meaningful way.

Honor and dignity matter to me. You made allegations that you presented as reasonable and meaningful, which I responded to in kind. Were you just throwing **** at a wall to see what might stick? Just providing confirmation propaganda for people who already see the world the way you do? Or were you engaging me in an honorable and dignified discussion?

When I said the comments you made made you look stupid as **** I wasn't calling you names or throwing around cheap insults. I was laying my cards on the table. That's how I do. If you want to engage in a discussion saying "What in the world would make you think Trump is racist? What has he ever said that would make you think that?" I'm going to respond to that as it deserves to be addressed. I provided several points before my final comment and you have not given a meaningful response to a single one of them.

 

[One Brow]

Hard to take anyone seriously who claims both sides are the same but spends all their time minimizing the actual crimes of one group while blowing out of proportion the intraparty squabbles of the other.

I thought Bernie Sanders was great, but he only became a Democrat less than a couple of months before the Iowa caucuses, so it wan't an intra-party squabble. It was lifelong Democrats vs. make-use-of-the-Democrats.

 

[Ron Mexico]

It was years later. And he told his son who told one of his best friends.

Much like the Democrats complaining about the Russians who released their dirty secrets. Who cares if he told me, his son, anybody or not? Isn't the information more important than how the information was made known? He didn't say any specifics but clearly said - I know her and I would never vote for her.

That sounds legit.

 

[Stars Fan]

It all doesn't matter. The left is going to complain about the right and vice versa. We aren't going to become socialist (shut up Republicans) and not every Republican is some racist (shut up Democrats).

I wish they would just leave the stupid Russia thing that exposed the DNC corruption and move on to something that actually matters. You lose Democrats and you won Republicans, move the f on.

LoPo
Look what you stirred up. Lol. I don't check in for a while, and when I come back there is all this fur flying.

Let me just respond by saying it does matter... a lot.

If we were just talking about one side winning and the other losing and both were relatively competent, I would tend to agree with you. But this is different. We are talking about a potentially treasonous event. At its most extreme, the Trump presidency could be the result of a sleeper operation of epic proportions. It is like a fatal traffic accident. Some people drive by and look away from the gore, and others can't take their eyes off it. If President Trump had no prior connection with Russia, and they just intervened because they hate Hillary that would be one thing (a lot of people hate Hillary) and that is one possible explanation. But there could be more to it. President Trump could be under the influence or control of the Kremlin.

Anyone who knows anything about Soviet and Russian covert intelligence operations knows they have sophisticated and capable human intelligence capabilities. They use a target's weaknesses to gain leverage that they can then exploit. Donald Trump first visited the Soviet Union in 1987. That began a long series of visits and business relations with the USSR and Russia. A generous assessment of Trump's character would have to acknowledge the possibility of flaws that human intelligence operatives could exploit.

Consider the fact that Russia bailed Trump out of deep debt in the 1990s, that a bank with known ties to the Kremlin became Trump's primary lender. The same bank was charged with money laundering. Consider Trump's secrecy concerning his finances. Consider his public stances on US alliances, US intelligence agencies, and law enforcement. Consider his dalliances and how he has tried to cover up his affairs. Then consider his bromance with Putin. There could be innocent explanations for all of these shady dealings, but the simplest explanation is Donald is beholden to Vladimir.

He may not be Putin's plant, but the possibility that he is makes this more than just a trivial piece of political in fighting. I understand the desire to look away and dismiss this as nothing big, but sometimes you have to pay attention to the gore to avoid the wreck.


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