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Ethereum! capitalist get in here. socialist stay OUT!

In China, according to what I've read.... it was the government that shut down the Africa trade and burned the ships, simply because the upstart merchants were getting rich enough to be a significant concern....
 
Bulletproof said:
Imbecile professors...

Yeah, people devoted to study and knowledge and discussion and debate are the imbeciles. With imbeciles like those spouting off why the hell would I listen to the likes of you?
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The mark of distinction between a good professor and an imbecile professor is actually the kind of scholarship interest that is being done. The "imbecile professors" are the ones who are more interested in the immediate politics of their college than the facts.....
 
babe said:
The mark of distinction between a good professor and an imbecile professor is actually the kind of scholarship interest that is being done. The "imbecile professors" are the ones who are more interested in the immediate politics of their college than the facts.....
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As soon as the word professor was used I questioned the veracity of the argument.
 
babe said:
Now this is an interesting point.

What do we know about ancient China, when they were building huge ocean-going ships and traveling as far as Africa for immensely profitable trade? Or the Egyptian Pharoahs who also build huge ships, compared to the European varieties of the 1490-1600 era, and established mining operations as far away as Indonesia? Were they societies based on "profit maximization", or not? Certainly the British Far East Trading Company, with essentially licenses from the Crown to own and operate colonial territories, were based on "profit maximization". That is why the impudent American colonials who disliked being barred from free competition rebelled.... well, in addition to innumerable petty officials of the Crown who took particular delight in being a nuisance.

I was thinking, human nature being what it is, "profit maximization" probable was the basis for Marco Polo's journeys to China, and every other lucrative trade route or human enterprise. Local farmers and tradesmen included.

But you have a point about organized government-back monopoly rackets.
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Its been ten years since I've read Wallerstein, I've not had much cause to read systems theory since I left uni, I have a condensed version of his book World System Theory somewhere. I've also probably drank a swimming pool full of beer since then (this is a terrifying thought) so I will recall it as best I can.

He would consider the romans, chinese and so on to be capitalist, he is concerned with the idea of power structures between states and the idea core periphery theory, Wallerstein develops the idea of a semi-periphery this allows states to move fluidly from the core of the world system to the periphery and back again. Thinking about it for the first time in ages actually makes me want to read some Wallerstein again because its probably the most complete system theory I've read, which can incorporate shifts within the global system within a historical context. For instance the decline of Spain and Portugal from world powers to middle powers and so on.
 
babe said:
I don't know why people let cranks invent fantastic definitions to provoke mass stupidity.

Take the word, "Capitalism", for example. We as a race made it all the way to 1850 without it, and did good business all along the way. We made it that far without "Socialism", too.

Along comes a pimp intellectual crank and writes a book for some English dudes worried about "Americanism" spreading and causing problems with their government-back trade monopolies, and pretty soon a whole bunch of stupid college kids are believing what the imbecile professors are telling them.

Since then, millions have died fighting wars, or have been done in by their governments, over those stupid ideas. Lies, all lies.
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real capitalism has been around long long long long long long long before 1850. or did you forget to put the BC there!
 
DutchJazzer said:
real capitalism has been around long long long long long long long before 1850. or did you forget to put the BC there!
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Of course, if you call freedom to create, exchange, and own stuff "Capitalism", but the Karl Marx version of the idea carried a sort of evil slur that called for struggle to redistribute everything under the obviously benevolent hands of a few revolutionary cranks......
 
Rubashov said:
Its been ten years since I've read Wallerstein, I've not had much cause to read systems theory since I left uni, I have a condensed version of his book World System Theory somewhere. I've also probably drank a swimming pool full of beer since then (this is a terrifying thought) so I will recall it as best I can.

He would consider the romans, chinese and so on to be capitalist, he is concerned with the idea of power structures between states and the idea core periphery theory, Wallerstein develops the idea of a semi-periphery this allows states to move fluidly from the core of the world system to the periphery and back again. Thinking about it for the first time in ages actually makes me want to read some Wallerstein again because its probably the most complete system theory I've read, which can incorporate shifts within the global system within a historical context. For instance the decline of Spain and Portugal from world powers to middle powers and so on.
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With that description as offered, I think I've heard of this before somewhere. I like ideas elevated to general schematics like "system theory". I bet it is something a lot of well-educated folks contemplate and probably find beneficial, unlike say sheer political propaganda.....
 
babe said:
With that description as offered, I think I've heard of this before somewhere. I like ideas elevated to general schematics like "system theory". I bet it is something a lot of well-educated folks contemplate and probably find beneficial, unlike say sheer political propaganda.....
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I have very little time for retail politics unless im looking for a laugh or a couple of good jokes to tell down the pub
 
babe said:
Of course, if you call freedom to create, exchange, and own stuff "Capitalism", but the Karl Marx version of the idea carried a sort of evil slur that called for struggle to redistribute everything under the obviously benevolent hands of a few revolutionary cranks......
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karl marx is evil scum!


i refuse to take his versions and ideas.

because of him their was a holocaust
 
DutchJazzer said:
because of him their was a holocaust
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That's horribly offensive and untrue. You're a ****ing dickhead, if it wasn't for Hitler some of us would have a lot more relatives, you should have some ****ing decency you repulsive pig.
 
Rubashov said:
That's horribly offensive and untrue. You're a ****ing dickhead, if it wasn't for Hitler some of us would have a lot more relatives, you should have some ****ing decency you repulsive pig.
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Yeah, hitler got inspired by the drivel marx wrote

don't tell me about having more relatives i know. 8 branches of my family tree wiped out!

go read mein kampf!

hitler got inspired by marx, he did say marx had some flaws. but the basic idea was right
 
Rubashov said:
That's horribly offensive
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offense has nothing to do with it!

it is offensive that karl marx is adored, after his cancerous ideology has been the basis for hitler left wing socialist government!


and that is the truth hidden by left wing governments and left wing media, so people are afraid to move over and become (extreme) right wing
 
Rubashov said:
That's horribly offensive and untrue. You're a ****ing dickhead, if it wasn't for Hitler some of us would have a lot more relatives, you should have some ****ing decency you repulsive pig.
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The reason there was a holocaust under Hitler was because some Jewish bankers made a deal with England and helped sink the Kaiser in WWI. Hitler knew about that fundamental betrayal of Germany and decided it was a problem on racial/ethnic/religious lines and went off the deep end for his "final solution".

You could perhaps blame Prescott Bush and some American bankers, JD Rockefeller, Ford, the King of England... all of whom viewed Hitler's rise as wonderful and the harbinger of better days ahead.

You could perhaps blame the American communist party and others of the twenties and thirties who hated America's great financial barons/kingpins whose cartel/monopoly tactics created a popular backlash the above political activists exploited... democrats and unions joining in.... to pass the anti-Trust act.... which created resentment among to Bigs (monopolist industrial interests) and caused them to invest heavily in Germany's industrial expansion. It was their money that build the Hitler war machine....

Oh well, at least the Zionists got the Balfour declaration. Look at all the good that has done.....

I recently watched the movie "The Remains of the Day" giving a sort of apologist version of the history of the so-called (after WWII) traitors who wanted to "Make Germany Great Again" in the 1930s.
A nice but realistic love story included....
 
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