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Game Thread Feb 16, 2022 08:00PM MT: Jazz at Lakers

Added to Calendar: 02-16-22

jom2003 said:
it got nothing to do with gameplan or system of the team. it's not the first effed-up by Royce and he's done that so many times in the past that I'm pretty sure that one was 100% on him
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The Lakers are playing small. Royce has a drive to the rim. Who is going to stop him? If someone comes over, he can pass off.
 
jom2003 said:
quin's refusal to adjust his rotation during games is exactly why we won't get a major roster shakeup.

he's so committed to his guys that he wouldn't even take them off the floor when they were clearly struggling. so why would he agree to trade them out of team entirely?

didn't he call off a Jingles trade last summer?
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If he refuses to make the changes we all know he needs to make and become more flexible down the stretch of this season, then we should let him go. As long as we majorly shake up the roster as well.

I don’t think Ainge is going to ask Snyder for permission. When this team goes out in the first round, it’s going to be a major embarrassment, the ownership group will not be happy and neither will our best player. It’s why I’m actually glad Ainge is here. Feel like our front office has been too attached to these guys. Ainge is a sociopath. He will do what needs to be done.
 
Ferguson_Mellochill said:
I can't get over it. Royce should have attacked that close-out from Reaves that led to a throw-away. It's the epitome of what's wrong with this team. They're trying to run some ball-movement system instead of making the right play.
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I think I've said it from time to time the last couple of years... this team appears to be overcoached, and I think it's kind of a natural byproduct of old habits instilled when everything was about adapting around Rudy.
 
fallenchicken said:
If he refuses to make the changes we all know he needs to make and become more flexible down the stretch of this season, then we should let him go. As long as we majorly shake up the roster as well.

I don’t think Ainge is going to ask Snyder for permission. When this team goes out in the first round, it’s going to be a major embarrassment, the ownership group will not be happy and neither will our best player. It’s why I’m actually glad Ainge is here. Feel like our front office has been too attached to these guys. Ainge is a sociopath. He will do what needs to be done.
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yeah i agree. we have to trade some players to force quin's hand. it's a vicious cycle that needs to be broken somehow
 
Expecting Quin to be a psychic and predict that a player is going to have a random bad moment...that's not reasonable.

Using basic common sense strategy against a one man team....that's a reasonable adjustment that we simply aren't capable of making.
 
Ferguson_Mellochill said:
I'm starting to have doubts about Conley in games like these. There is a lack of scoring, a lack of playmaking, and a lack of impacting the game. He was -25 tonight.
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I never wanted Conley on this team. Gave up too much in trade and his salary is too high. He also exacerbates our backcourt size issue.

I like Conley, but it was a mistake to bring him here. That said, he's in a bit of a slump over the last week or so, but he has had a lot of decent games this year.
 
I think if the Jazz had a dynamic wing with some size who could replace Royce in this situation, it would make a world of difference. When Donovan draws a trap and unloads the ball, someone has to be able to make a play and not just pass around the perimeter. Mitchell gave his team a 4-on-3 advantage, and the Jazz couldn't do anything with it. A Harrison Barnes, who could attack from the top of the circle, would be enough. It doesn't have to be an All Star.

Rudy Gay, in theory, would do it, but it looks like he's now too old. Maybe Paschall is the guy.
 
TheGoldStandard said:
I never wanted Conley on this team. Gave up too much in trade and his salary is too high. He also exacerbates our backcourt size issue.

I like Conley, but it was a mistake to bring him here. That said, he's in a bit of a slump over the last week or so, but he has had a lot of decent games this year.
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again, expectation. we gotta accept Conley for who he is. some fans here act like he's CP3 but he's just nowhere near that level of impact.
 
Ferguson_Mellochill said:
I think if the Jazz had a dynamic wing with some size who could replace Royce in this situation, it would make a world of difference. When Donovan draws a trap and unloads the ball, someone has to be able to make a play and not just pass around the perimeter. Mitchell gave his team a 4-on-3 advantage, and the Jazz couldn't do anything with it. A Harrison Barnes, who could attack from the top of the circle, would be enough. It doesn't have to be an All Star.
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Even House would've done better in that situation. At least he would've taken that open corner three instead of passing it up for an ugly turnover......
 
Ferguson_Mellochill said:
I think if the Jazz had a dynamic wing with some size who could replace Royce in this situation, it would make a world of difference. When Donovan draws a trap and unloads the ball, someone has to be able to make a play and not just pass around the perimeter. Mitchell gave his team a 4-on-3 advantage, and the Jazz couldn't do anything with it. A Harrison Barnes, who could attack from the top of the circle, would be enough. It doesn't have to be an All Star.

Rudy Gay, in theory, would do it, but it looks like he's now too old. Maybe Paschall is the guy.
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The other thing a wing with size might do is give Gobert more confidence to leave the paint and make a defensive play on the perimeter. It's like he has a shock collar that zaps him if he moves both feet out the paint on defense.
 
I don't know what it is that we're lacking, but I don't think it's best termed "toughness" or "mental toughness" or some such thing. Maybe just "clutchness" is best.

There's no way players like O'Neale, Gobert, and Ingles would have made it in the league it they didn't have toughness or mental fortitude out the wazoo. But they don't seem to be able to raise their level in clutch situations. DM can, and Bogey can at times, but otherwise it's not clear that we have anyone else on the team that really can do this.

I don't know if it's that they've already more or less maximized their talent such that there's simply not another level to go to, or if it's just that clutchness is just something that some players have and that others don't, or maybe it can be developed over time (ie Giannis wasn't clutch, until he was)? As @fallenchicken implies, probably the only hope I have in switching to Ainge is that he might be better at finding clutch players. Too bad that it will probably require a tear-down to get there.

At any rate, we have one more playoff season to hope the team somehow finds it, though I'm certainly not expecting that they will. I'll be rooting for them, though; and I don't think this talk about "calling out" coaches or players is the path to any kind of solution until then.
 
idiot said:
I don't know what it is that we're lacking, but I don't think it's best termed "toughness" or "mental toughness" or some such thing. Maybe just "clutchness" is best.

There's no way players like O'Neale, Gobert, and Ingles would have made it in the league it they didn't have toughness or mental fortitude out the wazoo. But they don't seem to be able to raise their level in clutch situations. DM can, and Bogey can at times, but otherwise it's not clear that we have anyone else on the team that really can do this.

I don't know if it's that they've already more or less maximized their talent such that there's simply not another level to go to, or if it's just that clutchness is just something that some players have and that others don't, or maybe it can be developed over time (ie Giannis wasn't clutch, until he was)? As @fallenchicken implies, probably the only hope I have in switching to Ainge is that he might be better at finding clutch players. Too bad that it will probably require a tear-down to get there.

At any rate, we have one more playoff season to hope the team somehow finds it, though I'm certainly not expecting that they will. I'll be rooting for them, though; and I don't think this talk about "calling out" coaches or players is the path to any kind of solution until then.
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When the Jazz play a team that switches defensively on the perimeter, and especially when that team starts trapping Mitchell, the Jazz need to swing the ball and who ever gets it needs to be able to put the ball down and make a play. Guys need to be able to drive the ball and either finish with a decent shot, or kick to an open shooter. Unfortunately, Royce can't do that. And strangely, tonight neither could Mike. Bojan just sat on the perimeter too. Their instinct is to hold the ball or move it around the perimeter waiting for Gobert to set a screen for them. This is a personnel problem. What happened with the Lakers tonight was no different from what happens when the Jazz play Miami.

Guys have to be able to attack a switch with a strong drive, and our guys can't do it. So our offense becomes Mitchell against the world. I wonder whatever happened to Mike's floater game. He could have used it tonight.
 
idiot said:
...
There's no way players like O'Neale, Gobert... would have made it in the league it they didn't have toughness or mental fortitude out the wazoo. But they don't seem to be able to raise...
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They use to play at their absolute peak, which is amazing, but not enough.
Like I said somewhere above, everyone knows what should be done, but nobody wants or like to actually say it.

Sent from my SM-G780G using JazzFanz mobile app
 
Ferguson_Mellochill said:
When the Jazz play a team that switches defensively on the perimeter, and especially when that team starts trapping Mitchell, the Jazz need to swing the ball and who ever gets it needs to be able to put the ball down and make a play. Guys need to be able to drive the ball and either finish with a decent shot, or kick to an open shooter. Unfortunately, Royce can't do that. And strangely, tonight neither could Mike. Bojan just sat on the perimeter too. Their instinct is to hold the ball or move it around the perimeter waiting for Gobert to set a screen for them. This is a personnel problem. What happened with the Lakers tonight was no different from what happens when the Jazz play Miami.

Guys have to be able to attack a switch with a strong drive, and our guys can't do it. So our offense becomes Mitchell against the world. I wonder whatever happened to Mike's floater game. He could have used it tonight.
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We need some game plan in tight games like this .Don hero ball in game like
Ferguson_Mellochill said:
When the Jazz play a team that switches defensively on the perimeter, and especially when that team starts trapping Mitchell, the Jazz need to swing the ball and who ever gets it needs to be able to put the ball down and make a play. Guys need to be able to drive the ball and either finish with a decent shot, or kick to an open shooter. Unfortunately, Royce can't do that. And strangely, tonight neither could Mike. Bojan just sat on the perimeter too. Their instinct is to hold the ball or move it around the perimeter waiting for Gobert to set a screen for them. This is a personnel problem. What happened with the Lakers tonight was no different from what happens when the Jazz play Miami.

Guys have to be able to attack a switch with a strong drive, and our guys can't do it. So our offense becomes Mitchell against the world. I wonder whatever happened to Mike's floater game. He could have used it tonight.
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We need some plan for tight games. Don was scoreless in last 5 min and this is story we saw like 10 times this season . Double him in 4th and you got 99% to win game...
 
i think lakers were more prepared to counter rudy and conley combo. our offense is just so predictable with them on the floor. so inserting Hassan and Forrest could have caught them off guard. Forest tried to dunk on Bradley was totally unexpected, he didn't make it but its awesome otherwise.
 
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