Following 2016 potential draftees

[Handlogten's Heros]

In the context of recent (and future) wing players that are lottery picks, Valentine just won't stack up well as the years pass, I can't stress this enough... 12 would be such a reach.. I'd literally turn the TV off and the draft is my favorite thing to watch every year..

he'd easily be one of the least athletic wings in the lottery compared to these adjacent classes.. There's freak athletes that are also skilled coming thru the pipelines.. Players that can cause Valentine all sorts of issues, on offense, if they were to guard him.. Even if those players were to fall and the players ranked beneath them were to overtake them, most of those guys are markedly more athletic than Valentine too..

It's likely that in the 4 drafts after this there will be much higher upside wings taken in the lottery..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndhA354C_DQ... Might honestly be a Kobe Bryant level prospect..

Obviously Denzel's no Devin Booker either..

So the way I see it, drafting Valentine 12th would be getting the short end of the stick.. I'd also say it'd be the opposite of picking low-hanging fruit.. It'd be a major reach, and a putting all of your eggs in one basket type move..

I'd almost see it as a sign that Lindsey's looking for a quick fix.. like I said it's not going to happen.

Awesome which one of those guys is eligible to be drafted this year... None... okay I guess we will just have to deal with this year's draft picks.

Look I like Luwawu better, but Denzel can play. If we moved down to get him that is fine, but he's not a huge reach. ESPN and Draftexpress both have him right in our range.

Hood was old (for draft prospects), skilled, and average length... got passed on... many GMs regret it.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Valentine at 12 would mean they're convinced he's a needle in the haystack of wings(other than Jaylen Brown and Jamal Murray) in this draft.. That's very far from picking low-hanging fruit, which I'm a huge advocate of...

I've been posting here for quite some time saying the wings from 10-30 are going to be a crapshoot in this draft, and that there's plenty of room for some random wing to go flying up into the lottery due to the lack of quality at the position.. Thats why I'd laugh at anyone who thinks Taurean Prince is markedly worse than players like Korkmaz, Valentine and Luwawu...

Just like I posted that I thought the 2013 draft, despite being percieved as weak, had a chance to have a damn good 1st or 2nd teir C, fall to the 3rd teir picks.. which is exactly what happend with Rudy... This years wings I feel oppositely about, It's probably MUCH safer to go with the BPA PF/C...

I disagree with that premise whole-heartedly, to me thats settling and half-assed because there's certainly other good options to be found, the draft isn't their only avenue to find a backup wing, it is their only avenue to find some truly talented 19 year old to develop over the years though...(especially considering how the rosters currently constructed).. This is one of those situations where kicking the can down the road could very well be beneficial.. I'm vehement he'd be a bad pick, I'd rather gamble on Korkmaz for sure...


Valentine would have to be in the 2nd tier of talent in this draft to justify that pick, and I just don't see it..


the Jazz aren't in some huge need of anything, they're 2 deep at each position(counting Favors as both a starting PF and backup C)..

Chances have gotta be way over 50% the pick will be born in the year 1996 or 1997..

There is no low hanging fruit at 12... Look at the history of the pick. 10-30 is a crapshoot historically. Because of that I'd be fine taking any of the Korkmaz/Luwawu/Valentine trio... although Korkmaz scares me most. Takes a while to load his jumper and just hasn't played a lot. I've only seen the draftexpress videos, but that was what worried me. He's a fine prospect for what we need now and long term though.

I just don't get the Valentine hate... At 12 these guys are all flawed... hell even Murray has size and athleticism concerns. The wings may be a crap shoot but so is every 19 year old with "upside". Valentine can play basketball... we need guys that can do that.

 

[NCJazz]

Loko vs Barcelona Euroleague Playoff game on Watch ESPN. Doubtful any draft prospects will play though. Vezenkov could get a few minutes. Abrines also interesting more so in the fact that wish we could have gotten his rights in the Kanter trade. Also Tomic plays for Barca. Anthony Randolph is a guy you could see back in the NBA also Claver. Delaney i think is better than many backup PGs in the league.

 

[Miggs]

Is Valentine just sort of a better Memphis wing (forget the sf's hyphenated name when they were in final)?

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Is Valentine just sort of a better Memphis wing (forget the sf's hyphenated name when they were in final)?

CDR I assume... Not really. Doesn't shoot pass or rebound as well. More of a driver slasher than Valentine. He got to the line more. He might still be in the league but I think he was kind of an idiot.

 

[orangello]

Jonathan Jeanne has pulled out of the draft.

 

[NCJazz]

Jonathan Jeanne has pulled out of the draft.

He can certainly improve his draft stock with one more year in Europe if he actually plays, but I do not I still think go ahead get in the draft and that way the 3 year clock will start to earn extra money.

 

[ncoloradojazz]

A player id like to see the Jazz take a serious look at is
D. Jackson point guard from Notre Dame
Exum has not proven anything at this level yet, we know all of you are not satisfied with TRey, and Neto is not even backup material honestly. Jackson also has played with another point guard at ND and with Utah IF Exum is playing well he has the length to guard SGs.Jackson is a deceptive athlete , high iq, decent shot, strong as an ox already, and can drive and dish

 

[ncoloradojazz]

same size(undersized SF's) with less than average lateral quicks for defending high-end wings.. Muhammad has a good bit more bounce in his step too..

The Jazz simply aren't going to draft Valentine, they'll take the BPA PF/C over him.. The pick will be someone they project as a possible starter in years, not Valentine who's got little chance to usurp Hood or Hayward as a starter...

Plus Valentine isn't really a match next to Burks or Hood..

JAZZ I thought always liked players with high bball iqs. Cant find another one in this draft with a higher bball iq then Denzel... Sleeping on him since he isn't "Athletic" lol.. I bet you are Video game generation

 

[orangello]

A player id like to see the Jazz take a serious look at is
D. Jackson point guard from Notre Dame
Exum has not proven anything at this level yet, we know all of you are not satisfied with TRey, and Neto is not even backup material honestly. Jackson also has played with another point guard at ND and with Utah IF Exum is playing well he has the length to guard SGs.Jackson is a deceptive athlete , high iq, decent shot, strong as an ox already, and can drive and dish

Wrong, Exum has proven to be an above average PG defender already and he is younger than Jackson (who is already almost 22).

What has Jackson proved in the NBA? I'm interested to know.

 

[ncoloradojazz]

Wrong, Exum has proven to be an above average PG defender already and he is younger than Jackson (who is already almost 22).

What has Jackson proved in the NBA? I'm interested to know.

Nothing Called insurance policy. Exum has not proven he can run a team. That what I am saying.

 

[ncoloradojazz]

and Jackson is 21, Atleast get your facts right before you step to the plate with a slugger like me
He is also 11 months older then Exum. So if Exum can still develop then so could Jackson

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Not at the levels that Valentine can for his position. Denzel also has good size for his position Trey is too slight. I think Trey is a good backup in the league at some point and that may be what Valentine is. At 12 beggers can't be choosers.

What? Trey was player of the year as a Sophomore and did all those things at high level and willed his team to a National Championship game. People act like Trey is super small, but he measured 6'1 with a 6'6 wingspan which is about as average as you can get for a PG. His problem is that he has yet to learn to play at NBA speed and against NBA athleticism. The same problems Trey has run into could happen to Valentine.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

https://www.draftexpress.com/article/Jake-Layman-NBA-Draft-Scouting-Report-and-Video-Breakdown-5459

Jake Layman in the 2nd round please.

Really interested to see some official measurements on him. If he test out with a good wingspan I would be very intrigued. A lot of 3 and D potential. Could see him developing into a good role player.

*Also around 3:50 on the strengths portion he switches onto Denzel Valentine and Valentine is unable to get past him. That is the future of Denzel Valentine in the NBA*

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

What? Trey was player of the year as a Sophomore and did all those things at high level and willed his team to a National Championship game. People act like Trey is super small, but he measured 6'1 with a 6'6 wingspan which is about as average as you can get for a PG. His problem is that he has yet to learn to play at NBA speed and against NBA athleticism. The same problems Trey has run into could happen to Valentine.

I thought it was a weird comparison and hate when we try to compare these guys to only Jazz players... It's kind of lazy.


Trey is average NBA size but very slight in his build. Denzel is average size for a SF as well but not as slight.

Comparing sophomore percentages they are comparable shooters. Comparing Denzel's last year to treys last year... Denzel is a better shooter. Valentine is a great rebounder for his position at 9 Rebs per 40... Trey was 3.5 which is adequate for a pg but not great. For his position... Denzel gets a ton of assists. Trey was good at getting assists as well. Not sure based on position who was better.

So basically I meant what I said Denzel did things a bit better in my opinion. I also think Trey is an NBA player and will find a home. I just think wings that can do things shoot pass and rebound will have a place in the league. There are guys I like better but people are acting like the guy will be horrible and it is a huge reach to take him. I like him and I'll stand by it.

This draft isn't great and when you consider our current roster a wing makes the best sense. I would be fine with them taking Chriss or someone similar but struggle to see how that guy sees the floor in the next 2-3 years. I also think we dismiss guys who's limitations we know and make mistakes betting on the unknowns like Korkmaz.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

https://www.draftexpress.com/article/Jake-Layman-NBA-Draft-Scouting-Report-and-Video-Breakdown-5459

Jake Layman in the 2nd round please.

Really interested to see some official measurements on him. If he test out with a good wingspan I would be very intrigued. A lot of 3 and D potential. Could see him developing into a good role player.

*Also around 3:50 on the strengths portion he switches onto Denzel Valentine and Valentine is unable to get past him. That is the future of Denzel Valentine in the NBA*

Or someone creates and kicks it out to him and he buries the three or pump fakes and drives. I doubt Valentine will be asked to be an Isi player in the league but no let's base it on one possession in a video.

 

[stitches]

Loko vs Barcelona Euroleague Playoff game on Watch ESPN. Doubtful any draft prospects will play though. Vezenkov could get a few minutes. Abrines also interesting more so in the fact that wish we could have gotten his rights in the Kanter trade. Also Tomic plays for Barca. Anthony Randolph is a guy you could see back in the NBA also Claver. Delaney i think is better than many backup PGs in the league.

Vezenkov can't get any minutes because of his defense and general lack of athleticism. Unfortunately he might indeed be a huge liability and close to undraftable at this point, which is a shame because even in Barcelona his offensive game is good. He's sporting a very healthy 62% TS%, 48%FG, 39% from 3 for the season.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

https://www.draftexpress.com/article/Jake-Layman-NBA-Draft-Scouting-Report-and-Video-Breakdown-5459

Jake Layman in the 2nd round please.

Really interested to see some official measurements on him. If he test out with a good wingspan I would be very intrigued. A lot of 3 and D potential. Could see him developing into a good role player.

*Also around 3:50 on the strengths portion he switches onto Denzel Valentine and Valentine is unable to get past him. That is the future of Denzel Valentine in the NBA*

Also I wonder which game that was... Was it the first time they played or the second... He almost triple doubles both times and they won both games. But layman totally owned him... Layman scored 8 pts per on 25% shooting.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Or someone creates and kicks it out to him and he buries the three or pump fakes and drives. I doubt Valentine will be asked to be an Isi player in the league but no let's base it on one possession in a video.

I can find a lot of other video showing how bad Valentine is at driving. He had one of the worst 2pt% in college basketball among the top 80 prospects in the draft, gets to the FT line at one of the lowest rates, and can't finish at the rim. His future in the NBA seems to be delegated to being a good 3pt shooter who can make the right pass. It's not like he has Hood's ability to create midrange looks and convert at a high rate.

Denzel Valentine is going to be like Joe Ingles IMO.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Also I wonder which game that was... Was it the first time they played or the second... He almost triple doubles both times and they won both games. But layman totally owned him... Layman scored 8 pts per on 25% shooting.

His usage rate is so high stats come to him no matter what. Even in his no-show game vs Middle Tennessee in the NCAA Tourney he almost had a triple double.