foye's history at PG

[theNBAnerd]

There are 3 reasons for all the opposition to the OP.

1. Watson and Tinsley are not very good.

2. Everybody wants to see lots of Burks.

3. Our starting PG isn't that great a distributor in the first place.

those could also be reasons why the OP is even more accurate -- if all of our PG options are substandard as creators, should all our hope be in foye, who -- as billy says -- has been tried at PG several times and never with any success.

You'd think if Utah needed a pure point they'd have made some kind of play for Calderon. This is what I was advocating as plan B before Mo arrived. Now that he's here it seems clear that the ball is going through the post a lot of the time. Watson and Tinsley both have serious warts which IMO offset the benefit of their passing ability, and if they are your backup 1 then Foye is your backup 2. Now Burks is buried again for the sake of playing a "real" PG while Mo rests.

if you read between the lines, this is actually what i'm advocating. i'm saying that we shouldn't regard the roster as done, because as i see it there's still a huge hole at backup PG. i would LOVE a move for calderon, and i've actually proposed something along those lines in recent days.

my approach to the roster from here on out is to call foye what he is: a backup wing. that doesn't mean he'll take minutes from burks, because we can have a 4-man rotation in the two wing spots, and i actually think hayward-marvin-burks-foye is a pretty dang solid 4-man rotation with a lot of strengths and versatility. but my point -- and it's starting to sounds like we agree here -- is that for that to work we need a backup point who actually plays like a point. whether that's calderon or whoever, i would be pretty active at looking into things like this so that foye, burks or even hayward aren't counted on for a huge percentage of our offensive facilitation.

in other words:

*big man rotation of 4 guys (currently jefferson-sap-favors-kanter)
*wing rotation of 4 guys (currently hayward-marvin-burks-foye, with carroll and murph as deep bench)
*2 points (currently mo, and we seriously need to upgrade over jamaal/earl)

 

[NAOS]

Wouldn't it have been nice to get ahold of the speed merchant that used to play in Indy? We had a better package than the **** they got for him.

 

[Brown Notes]

It is possible the Jazz are waiting for Toronto to amnesty Jose. Those guys have Lowry and Lucas who combined are a huge savings compared to Calderon at 10m. I'd be happy to sign that guy and cut/trade our current backups.

But what the Foye @1 thing is really all about is simply freeing up wing minutes, just like Sap @3 for the bigs. I am willing to see this at least tried out here because if it is workable it opens up the door for Burks. I suppose I shouldn't be worried since if he's as good as some of us think he will simply beat out Foye for the spot.

 

[idiot]

But what the Foye @1 thing is really all about is simply freeing up wing minutes, just like Sap @3 for the bigs. I am willing to see this at least tried out here because if it is workable it opens up the door for Burks.

Precisely!

if you read between the lines, this is actually what i'm advocating. i'm saying that we shouldn't regard the roster as done, because as i see it there's still a huge hole at backup PG. i would LOVE a move for calderon, and i've actually proposed something along those lines in recent days.

I don't hate this idea, but I don't really see many long-term benefits in it either. Calderon is not the future PG we need, even if he is arguably (and I do think there are both pros and cons to him) helpful for a year or two. I think that even if our PG play is sub-par this year, we're really not in a position to be burned by it (what's the difference between finishing 6th and 8th in this year's West?). Plus, giving Burks/Hayward more experience in initiating the offense will probably be a good long-term move, even if it proves, in the long-term, that they're not great full-time offensive initiators.

 

[theNBAnerd]

It is possible the Jazz are waiting for Toronto to amnesty Jose. Those guys have Lowry and Lucas who combined are a huge savings compared to Calderon at 10m. I'd be happy to sign that guy and cut/trade our current backups.

they can't amnesty calderon anymore. the window for amnesty cuts has closed for this season. the only way the jazz get jose is via trade, or if toronto buys him out. the latter is extremely unlikely.

 

[theNBAnerd]

I don't hate this idea, but I don't really see many long-term benefits in it either. Calderon is not the future PG we need, even if he is arguably (and I do think there are both pros and cons to him) helpful for a year or two. I think that even if our PG play is sub-par this year, we're really not in a position to be burned by it (what's the difference between finishing 6th and 8th in this year's West?). Plus, giving Burks/Hayward more experience in initiating the offense will probably be a good long-term move, even if it proves, in the long-term, that they're not great full-time offensive initiators.

i think calderon would be a one-year pickup, yeah. but i'm not even married to the idea of calderon specifically. hell, i wouldn't mind if the jazz signed scott machado (still unsigned, but invited to houston's fall camp). i just think the jazz need SOME kind of better backup PG. we can't just rely on hayward/burks/foye being hybrid players all the time, on our two vet PGs suddenly being better than last year, or on mo do reinvent himself as a player a decade into his career.

besides, the real long-term benefit of an al-for-calderon trade lies as much in clearing the way for favors to be the man as it does in 82 games of jose. (although i really believe that jose or someone like him would make the jazz much better.)

 

[NAOS]

Precisely!



I don't hate this idea, but I don't really see many long-term benefits in it either. Calderon is not the future PG we need, even if he is arguably (and I do think there are both pros and cons to him) helpful for a year or two. I think that even if our PG play is sub-par this year, we're really not in a position to be burned by it (what's the difference between finishing 6th and 8th in this year's West?). Plus, giving Burks/Hayward more experience in initiating the offense will probably be a good long-term move, even if it proves, in the long-term, that they're not great full-time offensive initiators.

I think Nerd's proposed trade gives us a good chance to get into the 5th spot.... there is a huge difference between 5th and 6th.

The balance we'd have with this trade would be fantastic. Sadly, I think our FO values Jefferson + I'm not convinced Houston has strong interest.

 

[Brown Notes]

Al + Watson for JV + Calderon.

 

[thebrazilianzz]

I would trade for Calderon as long as it involves sending Roger away on the deal.... thinking about it, I would trade for about anybody to send Roger away!