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Hayward & Jazz - not close to agreement (Hayward leaving 4/40 on the table)

Hayward has been the top performing guy of the young core. The Jazz sell more Hayward jerseys than any other player(I think I read that). The jazz just signed favors for 9 million more and have money to spend. Hayward while maybe not worth more than 10 on the open market is worth more than 10 to a small market team that is rebuilding, especially when he is the current face of the franchise. Hayward was right to turn down 10.
 
heyhey said:
Hayward has been the top performing guy of the young core. The Jazz sell more Hayward jerseys than any other player(I think I read that). The jazz just signed favors for 9 million more and have money to spend. Hayward while maybe not worth more than 10 on the open market is worth more than 10 to a small market team that is rebuilding, especially when he is the current face of the franchise. Hayward was right to turn down 10.
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Everything you said was addressed about 10 times in this thread.
 
NUMBERICA said:
Most notably that being from a small market in this situation means SPENDING LESS IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN SPENDING MORE.
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It would be if we were already in a position to actually do something. Right now is different. The jazz won't have to worry about a contract for our franchise player(probably through the draft) for 5 years. Furthermore Hayward @ the 2 if we were to draft a 3 would make the extra couple mill/yr worth it. I think 10 is the lowest he could expect in rfa so why would he take it? You can't expect a player to sign an extension when you offer him the bottom of his pay scale. Hayward has much more to gain than lose in rfa with this offer on the table.
 
Siro said:
Everything you said was addressed about 10 times in this thread.
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I like heyhey's point regardless. Very well stated case, even though I hate the idea of overpaying young players based on hype. heyhey is essentially making the Rudy Gay case.

NBA teams would do well to let Batum-like contracts walk and sign undervalued players in FA for a tenth of the money. Jazz need at least two stars too bad to pay Hayward over $10mm.
 
franklin said:
I like heyhey's point regardless. Very well stated case, even though I hate the idea of overpaying young players based on hype. heyhey is essentially making the Rudy Gay case.

NBA teams would do well to let Batum-like contracts walk and sign undervalued players in FA for a tenth of the money. Jazz need at least two stars too bad to pay Hayward over $10mm.
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I agree but the jazz could front load it so that he makes much more than he is worth now and 10 @ the end of his contract. In terms of the future of the franchise the contract would be a wash.(unless we want to hold on to Biedrins):)
 
heyhey said:
I agree but the jazz could front load it so that he makes much more than he is worth now and 10 @ the end of his contract. In terms of the future of the franchise the contract would be a wash.(unless we want to hold on to Biedrins):)
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I have a hard time arguing against that.

Hayward is an enigma and you are pitching the strongest case for signing heyhey to a maybe might be overvalued contract. As much as I like Hayward I can't get over overpaying a player like Crash Wallace and Batum. Nine-Ten Million seems to be a franchise killing figure under the current CBA. I'd almost rather see a player walk (Raja Bell **** You!).
 
There has been a lot of talk about front loading a contract extension. To what extent is this actually possible? I know when we signed millsap to that front loaded contract, it was basically like they gave him as much as a years salary upfront. I don't think this is possible with extensions?
 
There are some great points in this thread. I guess Im straddling the fence because I don't know what side to take. It looks as though in keeping with fiscal conservativeness, the offer put forth is decent.
 
heyhey said:
I agree but the jazz could front load it so that he makes much more than he is worth now and 10 @ the end of his contract. In terms of the future of the franchise the contract would be a wash.(unless we want to hold on to Biedrins):)
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Except that would make extending him thereafter more difficult because he could only make raises on the salary. Provided he's worth the overall money on the contract to begin with. Which, for the umpteenth time, he hasn't proven yet.
 
i do not understand anything

what is the max that hayward can get now - 13,5 or near 18-20 like paul george got?
is this max can be different next summer?
 
I haven't read through this thread, so I don't if anyone mentioned this, but I noticed online talk of Brad Stevens and the Celtics having a lot of cap room to sign Hayward next year. Do you Hayward is holding out because of his relationship with Stevens and that he knows he will get an offer from the Celtics?
 
Eenie-Meenie said:
I haven't read through this thread, so I don't if anyone mentioned this, but I noticed online talk of Brad Stevens and the Celtics having a lot of cap room to sign Hayward next year. Do you Hayward is holding out because of his relationship with Stevens and that he knows he will get an offer from the Celtics?
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Probably not holding out exclusively for the celtics, but he will likely get interest from 5-6 teams, at more money than the Jazz are offering right now.
 
Eenie-Meenie said:
I haven't read through this thread, so I don't if anyone mentioned this, but I noticed online talk of Brad Stevens and the Celtics having a lot of cap room to sign Hayward next year. Do you Hayward is holding out because of his relationship with Stevens and that he knows he will get an offer from the Celtics?
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Even if they let everyone walk, they'll have less than $10mm in cap room next summer.
 
GVC said:
Even if they let everyone walk, they'll have less than $10mm in cap room next summer.
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Wow! They do have some salaries committed for another couple of years. Didn't realize that until I saw your comment. That said, I'm sure if they really wanted Hayward, they could clear a guy like Courtney Lee or even find a taker for Wallace. What might keep Hayward's price in check is that several teams are going to be hitting the jackpot with elite wings via the draft. Also, I doubt many teams believe Utah WOULDN'T match a deal for Hayward with the financial freedom the Jazz has. Why would Boston, LA, etc. want to tie up salary space and have to wait several days to see if Utah was going to match? That shortens the time for them to go after other FA's. Most major deals are agreed upon during the 10-day moratorium. But Team A would have to wait through the moratorium and then, what, up to 3 or 4 days after that before Utah would have to officially match? Meanwhile, every other decent wing is signing elsewhere.

With RFA's, it's much more likely for teams to raid other teams that have cap and tax considerations. Utah isn't in that position for the next several years thanks to KOC and Lindsey. Even by matching any offer for Hayward and giving Enes a similar deal to what Favors received, the Jazz will still be able to keep drafting and paying their players. Now they MIGHT have to consider trading a guy like Burks down the road, but he can easily be replaced in the draft. Five years from now, perhaps one of the "core-3" will need to go...if they get a superstar in the draft and have to pay him the MAX or close to it. But that would be a good problem to have!

I predict Hayward will be back on the Jazz at $11M or so, whether he signs the contract now or waits to test his market value next summer.
 
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