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And when he doesn't get the ball he sulks. And when he does get it, if he can't finish easily he's going to avoid contact and put up something soft. And he might just stand in the corner to clank a three instead of cutting to the rim dynamically. Hes a fairly large negative on the offense, almost as much as he's a positive on defense.
This is mostly my position as well. I want to see that toughness and grit that he shows on defense on the offensive side of the ball. There’s a solid role for him, but he needs to play within his ability to actually fill it.
You said "But even if he turns us into the 20th ranked defense instead of 30th....That is a massive amount of wins." There was nothing about the defense-offense trade-off in that statement. I just wanted to add the caveat that the amount of wins would be somewhat less than massive since the offense would get worse at the same time as the defense improves. And here you are arguing not against me but against Hardy and Ainge because they are clearly concerned with Kessler's offensive limitations. They are very much aware about his defensive chops but he was moved to the bench and cautiously shopped around because they are not confident that all his defense would compensate for his offensive shortcomings. I, personally, value Kessler's defense much more than them.
That was funny, because you know which Jazz player Kessler had the highest offensive rating with in 2022-23? Mike Conley... The second one was Kris Dunn. And in 2023-24? It was again Kris Dunn and by a long shot.
Can you imagine how Kessler will respond if he pushed to the bench not only by the veteran Collins but now by a rookie drafted in the second round???
Again, I like Kessler's defense. I like Dunn's defense. I think that both of them should have had larger roles on the team. We are not at all apart in our estimates. But in the post that started this entire discussion you talked only about a massive amount of wins that could be had if the Jazz defensive ranking improved due to playing Kessler more and him being more motivated. I just added some context to it related to the unavoidable offensive drop-off.
Again, Kessler cannot generate his own offense. Like, at all. He has no jump shot, no low-post moves, he cannot dribble to the basket. All that he can do is to score off rebounds, in a very precisely executed pick-and-roll, or when other players scramble the defense and he is left in a great position for an uncontested dunk. All of that - besides the rebounding - requires good playmakers creating the opportunities for him. The Jazz does not have good playmakers now.
Oh, I agree completely. I was very disappointed when Kessler was pushed back to the bench because Ainge stupidly invested too much in Collins and was afraid to bench him instead. And for the life of me I cannot understand the obsession that Hardy and Ainge have with the offense in general. That was the Achilles hill of the previous iteration of the Jazz and they are hellbent on rebuilding the exact same team only with new characters.
Eh, Kessler has nothing special in terms of his size and rebounding ability, he is a run-of-the-mill center in that regard. And that's true, the Al Jefferson type of center died out completely. But it still infinetely easier to generate the offense from the centers who have a jump shot, a reliable hook shot or can dribble a bit. If Kessler had something like that in his bag even our combo guards (Keyonte, Sexton, Clarkson) could set him up well. Even Collins or Brice. But Kessler is such a hard player to set up. On the pick-and-roll you need to have the ball passed to him in a very specific spot where he has two steps to the basket and nobody in the front. And you cannot simply through a ball to him deep at the basket: he does not have the reach and hops of Gobert or even Lively. Again, he needs to be completely open or, at best, have an open lane under the basket for his favorite reversed dunk. It requires a lot of passing skills and the desire to get him involved instead of going to a much better offensive player (and that would be anyone else who is currently on the court for the Jazz).
You know, instead of personal attacks you could have just asked where I got the numbers from and I would have responded with the link. It's possible that I misinterpreted something, or it could be a stat slightly different from what you used. I was thinking about doing it anyway but then I realized that I somehow lost interest in continuing this conversation. You know, I come here to talk about the Jazz and not for mutual personal attacks. I think that our interests are just different and I wish you all the best in your future endeavors. Goodbye.
If he comes cheap...and if we can still weaken the roster while getting picks then yeah.
